OT 2020 NFL general discussion thread.

[bMORE607]

Right...because I changed my handle to hide.

Some had them favored before the draft but oddsmakers didn't like their draft. Yet it had a pretty big impact on the SB.

Here you go rehtard. They were never favorites to win the Super Bowl.

Super Bowl 55 Odds Tracker

Look back to the 2020-21 NFL season and see how the odds to win Super Bowl 55 changed throughout the year, from opening right up to kickoff on Super Bowl Sunday when the Chiefs beat the Buccaneers.

www.sportsbettingdime.com

 

[ExitFlagger]

Here you go rehtard. They were never favorites to win the Super Bowl.

Super Bowl 55 Odds Tracker

Look back to the 2020-21 NFL season and see how the odds to win Super Bowl 55 changed throughout the year, from opening right up to kickoff on Super Bowl Sunday when the Chiefs beat the Buccaneers.

www.sportsbettingdime.com

So that means that there were zero sportsbooks that ever favored them?

Who gives a shit anyway. The point was that their odds shortened a lot after adding Gronk.

 

[bMORE607]

So that means that there were zero sportsbooks that ever favored them?

Who gives a shit anyway. The point was that their odds shortened a lot after adding Gronk.

Yes, no well known sports book had them as favorites ever. I actually know a thing or two about gambling, and gambling futures. It’s pretty obvious you have no idea wtf you’re talking about.

 

[Villian07]

Would we be talking about how loaded TB is with talent if Winston was their QB?

I don't remember anyone talking about how they underachieved last year.

Yea if they added fournette, AB, and Gronk to go with Evans and Godwin they would absolutely have been loaded with or without Brady.

 

[Villian07]

a guy who had been retired 2 years, a WR really no one wanted and those that have could not wait to get rid of and a RB whose own team did not even extend the 5th year option is "a bounty"?

Have you ever seen those guys play??? They are all amazing football players.

 

[ExitFlagger]

Yes, no well known sports book had them as favorites ever. I actually know a thing or two about gambling, and gambling futures. It’s pretty obvious you have no idea wtf you’re talking about.

Not hiding from the fact that I'm not a degenerate gambler. I don't know which sportsbooks are well-known and don't care.

But the point was that adding Gronk shortened their odds a lot.

 

[dtgold88]

Have you ever seen those guys play??? They are all amazing football players.

OK, but this isn't 2017. Ozzie Newsome was an "amazing football player". Should the Browns sign him back?

AB so amazing they completed their run to the SB without him.

 

[Villian07]

OK, but this isn't 2017. Ozzie Newsome was an "amazing football player". Should the Browns sign him back?

AB so amazing they completed their run to the SB without him.

I don’t care enough to argue with you but both are still better than 80% of the players at their position. Both have played in a Super Bowl. And combined for 3 tds in this Super Bowl, you know the biggest game on the planet. Hard to think washed up over the hill guys could pull that off, But yea sure, no where near the player they were 2-3 yers ago. Not like either retired bc of age, they still have the talent., AB might be the best wr in the league if he wasn’t nuts. And yea they won be first three without him bc they were stacked at every skill position with a great line.

Im not trying to shit on Brady, but to act like he carried some rag tag group of losers to the Super Bowl is dumb as fk

 

[JimboBBN]

It’s very clear some on here lack reading comprehension. Not a single poster has said Brady carried a group of nobodies to the championship. Do you guys just like hearing yourselves talk or what?

 

[ExitFlagger]

OK, but this isn't 2017. Ozzie Newsome was an "amazing football player". Should the Browns sign him back?

AB so amazing they completed their run to the SB without him.

How bout 2018? 1300 yds and 15 TDs in 15 games. He consistently put up huge numbers in his last 6 full seasons. And this year his catch % was the highest yet.

Sure sounds washed up. I'm gonna laugh when he gets a huge deal in the offseason.

The fact that they made it to the SB without him only proves our point.

 

[Villian07]

It’s very clear some on here lack reading comprehension. Not a single poster has said Brady carried a group of nobodies to the championship. Do you guys just like hearing yourselves talk or what?

you literally said Brady andBrady alone carried the worst franchise in pro history to a title and no one but brady could have done it.

 

[JimboBBN]

you literally said Brady andBrady alone carried the worst franchise in pro history to a title and no one but brady could have done it.

Has much more to do with teaching a talented team how to win than carrying a bad team on his back. I’ve been pretty clear with that in multiple posts.

 

[ExitFlagger]

I don’t care enough to argue with you but both are still better than 80% of the players at their position. Both have played in a Super Bowl. And combined for 3 tds in this Super Bowl, you know the biggest game on the planet. Hard to think washed up over the hill guys could pull that off, But yea sure, no where near the player they were 2-3 yers ago. Not like either retired bc of age, they still have the talent., AB might be the best wr in the league if he wasn’t nuts. And yea they won be first three without him bc they were stacked at every skill position with a great line.

Im not trying to shit on Brady, but to act like he carried some rag tag group of losers to the Super Bowl is dumb as fk

Brady had the best supporting cast in the league and definitely more to work with in that game particularly.

Tampa's receiving corps was being rated higher than KC's before adding Brown. Godwin finished last year ranked #1 at WR by PFF. Evans was ranked #6. They already had two quality TEs before signing Gronk. Plus they drafted a talented WR.

Then they add Fournette to go with Jones and one of the best O-lines.

But we're told that KC, with an injured Watkins, dogshit at TE behind Kelce, 3rd-string OL and lesser defense was the "superteam."

How'd Brady do it?

 

[ExitFlagger]

Frankly, the embarrassing thing is that they lost 5 games along the way, one by a 38-3 score. Actually, it's not embarrassing because Brady's 43. The praise is embarrassing.

 

[dtgold88]

I don’t care enough to argue with you but both are still better than 80% of the players at their position. Both have played in a Super Bowl. And combined for 3 tds in this Super Bowl, you know the biggest game on the planet. Hard to think washed up over the hill guys could pull that off, But yea sure, no where near the player they were 2-3 yers ago. Not like either retired bc of age, they still have the talent., AB might be the best wr in the league if he wasn’t nuts. And yea they won be first three without him bc they were stacked at every skill position with a great line.

Im not trying to shit on Brady, but to act like he carried some rag tag group of losers to the Super Bowl is dumb as fk

What is with so many exaggerating and making up comments to make their point here? Who said washed up and over-the-hill? I just think they are no longer "amazing players". and who said Brady carried ragtag losers to a SB win?

Wasn't Gronk the #2 TE for much of the season for his own team (behind Brate)? Is he even ahead of Howard if healthy?

agree AB among the best if not nuts (2 years ago) but he is nuts. and, sure, he caught a TD in the SB...but he also had 22 more yards than me in the game, and what I said is also true. They went to that big game you mention with him contributing nothing in the playoffs leading up to that game.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Right...because I changed my handle to hide.

Some had them favored before the draft but oddsmakers didn't like their draft. Yet it had a pretty big impact on the SB.

No they weren’t favored. Just dug into it last night. What sportsbook are you seeing that and then favorited over KC?

 

[ExitFlagger]

What is with so many exaggerating and making up comments to make their point here? Who said washed up and over-the-hill? I just think they are no longer "amazing players". and who said Brady carried ragtag losers to a SB win?

Wasn't Gronk the #2 TE for much of the season for his own team (behind Brate)? Is he even ahead of Howard if healthy?

agree AB among the best if not nuts (2 years ago) but he is nuts. and, sure, he caught a TD in the SB...but he also had 22 more yards than me in the game, and what I said is also true. They went to that big game you mention with him contributing nothing in the playoffs leading up to that game.

So, because he's "nuts," he can't catch the ball anymore?

You said that nobody wanted him. Yeah, nobody wants a guy who had 1300 yds and 15 TDs in his last full season. Only the Patriots last year and this year’s SB winner. Doubt anyone else will ever pay him again.

You realize that every time you build up the other TEs and receivers on that team, you’re just proving the point for us right? Gronk had by far the most production of any of their TEs btw.

 

[ExitFlagger]

No they weren’t favored. Just dug into it last night. What sportsbook are you seeing that and then favorited over KC?

I don’t know. I looked and didn’t find it. Not going to spend all day looking.

Who cares? The point was that Gronkowski made a big difference in Vegas’s eyes.

 

[dtgold88]

So, because he's "nuts," he can't catch the ball anymore?

You said that nobody wanted him. Yeah, nobody wants a guy who had 1300 yds and 15 TDs in his last full season. Only the Patriots last year and this year’s SB winner. Doubt anyone else will ever pay him again.

You realize that every time you build up the other TEs and receivers on that team, you’re just proving the point for us right? Gronk had by far the most production of any of their TEs btw.

actually what I also said was everyone who had him could not wait to get rid of him...and you keep ignoring they won all road games to get to the SB against some really good teeams....with Ab helping them as much as I did.

Gronk was so good he got them the same production they got from Brate when Brate was only 3 years into the league (Brate had 37 more yards and 1 more TD). do you really not get this is not the same Gronk he was 3+ years ago?

 

[dtgold88]

I don’t know. I looked and didn’t find it. Not going to spend all day looking.

Who cares? The point was that Gronkowski made a big difference in Vegas’s eyes.

Probably wise not to spend any time looking for something that does not exist. Good call.

 

[ExitFlagger]

actually what I also said was everyone who had him could not wait to get rid of him...and you keep ignoring they won all road games to get to the SB against some really good teeams....with Ab helping them as much as I did.

Gronk was so good he got them the same production they got from Brate when Brate was only 3 years into the league (Brate had 37 more yards and 1 more TD). do you really not get this is not the same Gronk he was 3+ years ago?

So, because they were good enough to beat good teams without him, that means he isn’t good/doesn’t make them better? Are you serious with this stuff?

Who said that Gronk is in his prime? He can’t be past his prime and still be really good? You do realize that if you have three good TEs and several good WRs, you can’t really expect one of the TEs to put up monster numbers, right? Yet he was still top 10 in yards among TEs.

This is absurd.

If that wasn’t a loaded offense, what is?

 

[bMORE607]

No matter what facts are presented he’s still going to cry.

 

[dtgold88]

So, because they were good enough to beat good teams without him, that means he isn’t good/doesn’t make them better? Are you serious with this stuff?

Who said that Gronk is in his prime? He can’t be past his prime and still be really good? You do realize that if you have three good TEs and several good WRs, you can’t really expect one of the TEs to put up monster numbers, right? Yet he was still top 10 in yards among TEs.

This is absurd.

If that wasn’t a loaded offense, what is?

He's not in his prime nor really good.

who said it was not a loaded offense? Pretty damn good offense. Great with Brady (and, yes, some other QBs) but also would have still been mediocre with Winston.

 

[Crappy Davenpot]

Now AP wants to go to Tampa, play with Brady, and get a ring. On the cheap I’ll bet.

 

[bMORE607]

Now AP wants to go to Tampa, play with Brady, and get a ring. On the cheap I’ll bet.

Lol why would they sign him

 

[ExitFlagger]

He's not in his prime nor really good.

who said it was not a loaded offense? Pretty damn good offense. Great with Brady (and, yes, some other QBs) but also would have still been mediocre with Winston.

Multiple people have said they’re not loaded and that KC is more talented. And did you forget the bit about Tampa being a shit franchise that only Brady could turn around?

Any offense led by a pick-6 machine is going to be worse than one led by Brady. Who‘s denying that? Yet they put up more yards last year.

Gronk was 9th in yardage among TEs, while playing on a team full of weapons. Several of the TEs ahead of him were on teams with few weapons. And he was their most productive player in the SB. I’d say that adds up to still being really good.

 

[Villian07]

actually what I also said was everyone who had him could not wait to get rid of him...and you keep ignoring they won all road games to get to the SB against some really good teeams....with Ab helping them as much as I did.

Gronk was so good he got them the same production they got from Brate when Brate was only 3 years into the league (Brate had 37 more yards and 1 more TD). do you really not get this is not the same Gronk he was 3+ years ago?

Do you really not get that no one is gonna put up gaudy stats when you have three pro bowl receivers and perhaps the best TE ever, not to mention guys like brate and ScottyMiller. And you actually have a run game with Jones and fournette.

Comparing stats from this years Tb team to years past is beyond ridiculous.

And jimbo literally posted that Brady took the worst franchise in pro history to a Super Bowl, something no one else could have done, bc of his leadership and culture or whatever else except the fact that he played on a Uber talented team.

Again not to shit on Brady, he’s proven he’s the goat, but he’s not the onlyQB on earth that would have won the super bowl with TBs roster.

 

[dtgold88]

Do you really not get that no one is gonna put up gaudy stats when you have three pro bowl receivers and perhaps the best TE ever, not to mention guys like brate and ScottyMiller. And you actually have a run game with Jones and fournette.

Comparing stats from this years Tb team to years past is beyond ridiculous.

And jimbo literally posted that Brady took the worst franchise in pro history to a Super Bowl, something no one else could have done, bc of his leadership and culture or whatever else except the fact that he played on a Uber talented team.

Again not to shit on Brady, he’s proven he’s the goat, but he’s not the onlyQB on earth that would have won the super bowl with TBs roster.

Cannot say I saw that from Jimbo but that also is a bit of exaggeration IMO. Most QBs could not have done what Brady did, but some could. Pretty sure they'd have been OK with AR at QB.

There are also many who would not have gotten past NO and GB on the road IMO.

 

[Crappy Davenpot]

Lol why would they sign him

Still averaging 800+ yards per year the last few years. Why did they sign Leonard F.? Still productive. May be a lot of vets who wants to go to the Tom Brady Bucs for a last shot at a ring. On the cheap.

 

[bMORE607]

Still averaging 800+ yards per year the last few years. Why did they sign Leonard F.? Still productive. May be a lot of vets who wants to go to the Tom Brady Bucs for a last shot at a ring. On the cheap.

Exactly they already have younger backs and the cap is going down. Even for veteran minimum it doesn’t really make sense.

 

[Villian07]

Cannot say I saw that from Jimbo but that also is a bit of exaggeration IMO. Most QBs could not have done what Brady did, but some could. Pretty sure they'd have been OK with AR at QB.

There are also many who would not have gotten past NO and GB on the road IMO.

Brady wasn’t the reason TB beat GB. He didn’t even play all that well. Red zone defense and #20 King sucking ass beat GB moreso than Brady. He had 3 picks, I think many qbs could’ve played that game in his spot and won. And they absolutely dog walked the saints so not sure you can say Brady was the difference there either.

Bradys the goat, he proven it. But he had more help this year than ever before.

 

[GhostOf301]

Nobody is saying that Brady is the reason why they won any particular game. But he deserves more credit than some of you are willing to give him for taking TB to the super bowl and winning it. How many times does he have to win before you people concede to the fact that it is no longer a coincidence? That maybe he is the reason his teams win.

 

[ExitFlagger]

Nobody is saying that Brady is the reason why they won any particular game. But he deserves more credit than some of you are willing to give him for taking TB to the super bowl and winning it. How many times does he have to win before you people concede to the fact that it is no longer a coincidence? That maybe he is the reason his teams win.

Right...poor Tom doesn't get enough credit. I don't think anyone has said that he deserves no credit. But I'm giving a hell of a lot more to the defense that held a great Chiefs offense to its worst scoring output in years, and the Patriots defense that held a great Rams offense to 3 points (while his O scored 13).

He did zip last year with the best defense in the league. Not because he sucks. But because he's old and didn't have a loaded offense.

Remember, this started with the nonsense about Brady being the only QB who could "take that shit franchise to the SB," 7-9 last year, blah, blah.

At 43, the only thing that he's better than everyone else at is getting calls. 27 PIs this year. No one else was close. KC had 4. NE, btw, was dead last. After being near the top every year during Tommy's reign. Seems legit.

 

[GhostOf301]

Right...poor Tom doesn't get enough credit.

So salty.

 

[JimboBBN]

So salty.

His vagina has bled all over this thread

 

[ExitFlagger]

So salty.

I'm making arguments that are echoed by experts like Chris Simms, while everybody else is white knighting Tommy like a Patriots/Bucs homeboarder.

 

[ExitFlagger]

His vagina has bled all over this thread

Speaking of bleeding vaginas, remember when you threatened to leave the board because people were saying mean things about Kentucky?

That was pretty funny.

 

[JimboBBN]

Speaking of bleeding vaginas, remember when you threatened to leave the board because people were saying mean things about Kentucky?

That was pretty funny.

We believe you, little guy. Now tell me, where did Brady touch you?

 

[GhostOf301]

I'm making arguments that are echoed by experts like Chris Simms, while everybody else is white knighting Tommy like a Patriots/Bucs homeboarder.

You're making reductive arguments that most people would agree with if you respected the full context of the argument. I am far from a Patriots/Bucs homeboarder. But I don't think the Bucs make it to the SB and win it without his experience as a leader. I am not going to argue that he is as good as he was 10 years ago. But his presence meant a lot more than you appreciate.

 

[JimboBBN]

You're making reductive arguments that most people would agree with if you respected the full context of the argument. I am far from a Patriots/Bucs homeboarder. But I don't think the Bucs make it to the SB and win it without his experience as a leader. I am not going to argue that he is as good as he was 10 years ago. But his presence meant a lot more than you appreciate.

I couldn’t imagine being this big of a crybaby having a team as good as he does. Brady hurts a lot of feelings. You nailed it, though