POLL: UT at UK Saturday
- Thread starter DezyVol
- Start date
Well, but you have to admit, UVA has shit the bed in the NCAAT after dominating the ACC too often.
When you do that, there will be criticism.
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I didn’t say we didn’t deserve criticism. I asked why your wins during the regular season matter and ours don’t.
Your regular season wins do count, the difference between UVA and UK is, UK follows up regular season wins with tournament success.
That’s fine. But you can’t discredit what someone does in the regular season simply because they lose in a single elimination tournament either. I would argue that UVA probably overachieves during the regular season and then underachieves during the tournament. But all it takes is one good postseason run.
That's fine, but when UK and UT meet in the SECT finals and UK handles them right before the NCAAT, it's a pretty significant win, I think that win is a better indicator of where teams are at tournament time.
So you’re saying that this game isn’t as meaningful as the SEC tournament game will be? I’m confused but isn’t that what everyone else has been saying too? You can’t be upset that people are discrediting UKs win (which I’m not doing btw) when you say yourself that games closer to the tournament mean more.
So you think winning at home is a bigger win than a neutral court win just before the NCAAT?
I don't.
I don’t either. But the point that others are making is that your win doesn’t mean as much now as future games vs UT will. Sounds like you agree as well.
No, I don't agree with that. It was a dominant win against the #1 team in the country. UK had them down by 24 points at one time and UT is a team that UK is fighting with for a 1 seed. That makes this win bigger than a typical regular season win.
If UK only won by a bucket, it would be different. UK looked dominant and that could have an effect on how UK and UT are judged.
If UK goes into Knoxville and wins again, that gets them a 1 seed IMO, so in this case, these regular season wins matter just as much.
Because you usually suck in the NCAA tourney. We will see what happens this year.
I’m here. Hungover, but here. We got our booties blasted. No question.
Will be interesting to see if how we respond (and will determine whether we go down as a great 2019 team, or a early season stud turned late season fraud).
Similar to some of Self’s years at KU. Begin the year with so-so expectations, overachieve in the regular season, then fail to play to seed and the masses label it a huge choke.
Meanwhile, for Izzo or Cal the narrative is “Oh my! How’d he get the 8 seeded preseason #1 greatest recruiting class of all time to the F4?”
LOL, What??? KU overachieve? They're freakin' pre season top 5 every year. They seem to get a 1 seed every year and lose to lower seeded teams.
UK has a couple of minor upsets in the tournament under Cal (2010 and 2018), but has more success stories than blunders.
KU has had some head scratching losses in the tournament after dominating the BIG12.
He’s overachieved in the regular season several times.
Yes, he’s lost to many lower seeded teams. That’s my point. Some of those shouldn’t have been lower seeds based on the talent level.
that is total B.S.
KU has never lacked talent under Self
name me one lower seeded team that has knocked KU out that had higher rated recruits
remember we are not talking about losing to a UK or Duke
UCLA, Michigan and both Nova teams were more talented. Oregon was on par.
If you just want to use recruiting rankings, then Cal fails massively in the tourney every year. Let’s compare the recruiting rankings of 15 Kentucky and Wisky.
Is it really that ****ing controversial to argue that teams like Nova in 16 or UCLA in 07 were more talented? Good God.
Playing to seed in the tournament is easier when you underachieve in the regular season.
UVA ran into Michigan State twice in the 2nd round and Sweet 16 simply because they didn't perform that well in the regular season. Most people though MSU was the best team in the country in 2014 (preseason #2) and they were a 4 seed in UVA's bracket.
I don’t remember saying there weren’t losses to lesser teams.
That Wichita St team, though, was flat out better at that point in the season, given the injuries and suspensions. And yeah, VCU was an 11 seed or whatever, but they weren’t playing like it. They had won four tourney games and rolled over some good teams. It’s not like we’re talking about Lehigh or UMBC.
Yeah, but KU still has the coaching and talent to overcome the WSU's and VCU's of the cbb world.
I guess it would be different if it didn't happen so many times to KU.
LOL, you threw Duke and UVA right in the fire at the end there. I can't be held responsible for the torches and pitchforks that might be coming your way after that. Ha ha.
you also have to add in whether they are freshmen or not
KU plays a lot of upper classmen
if you are not smart enough to see that you have to add in experience then you really do not understand basketball
How do you stop it? Recruit nothing but* players and suffer through 2 or 3 terrible years until they turn into something?
Some of these guys were not supposed to be one and done players, but they end up showing potential and apparently that's all you need to do.
Gilgeous Alexander was expected to be a sophomore at UK this year, he was a 4* player, but he put in the work, got done good coaching and voila, he ends up in the freaking lottery.
How do you stop it?
I don't know how you stop it once you've started but you can recruit the back end of the top 100 players and develop them without completely sacrificing the program. Those are still 4-star guys that can win games and most will not leap to the NBA after 1 year. And I imagine that Kentucky could get their fair share of those guys. I just don't think that's Cal's way. He, like most coaches, want the best players. And when you're Cal and Kentucky, you get them. But the best players aren't always the best for your system/approach. Being young may be an explanation for losses but you can't use it as an excuse when you were the one who decided to adopt that model.
K has a TON of upsets on his resume and he’s considered the GOAT. Yes, he also has a bunch of final fours and titles. He’s also coached for 4 decades.
No shit. Which is...my point. High school rankings are one small piece of judging talent.
Well, I guess I wouldn't change either if I was him. I believe UK had the most regular season and tournament wins since he's been here. 4 final fours and a title. That's pretty impressive for a guy that "is an awful coach", "just rolls the balls out" and utilizes mostly freshmen.
Yeah, but K has told everyone that he is beyond criticism, so he is exempt from this discussion.
Haven't you heard, even mosquitos won't bite him out of respect.
Don’t act like there have been a lot of those. In fact, he’s the only one I can think of at the moment. Most have been expected OADs. A few weren’t ready, but still expected to bolt prior to the season.
maybe because the players are not slaves and become millionaires
Eric Bledsoe (68th) was a 4 star as well. Yeah, it doesn't happen often for 4 star players. But there are also a host of lower rated 5* players that left after 1 or two years as well.
Schools like KU and UNC are hanging on to Tyler Ulis, Wenyen Gabriel, Bam Adebayo, Isiah Briscoe, Bledsoe, Booker and Dakari Johnson type players for 3 and 4 years. UK is only able to hang on to them for 1 or 2 years.
Hats off to Self and Roy for finding a way to keep good players that long. I don't know how they're doing it, but they are.
All the NBA needs to see is potential and Cal is honest with these kids, some leave even after he tells them they shouldn't.
I wish Cal could hang on to those players longer, I think he would have more final fours and titles.
That’s true about Roy, but I’m curious to know who these KU players are. Far more of the opposite happens. Do you think Brannen Greene had any business leaving early? Cheick Diallo couldn’t even get off the bench. McLemore was ranked in the 50s and left after one year. Selden stayed a few years but went undrafted. Oubre and Julian Wright left before they were ready.
In fact, the only surprise return I can remember is Brandon Rush, and that only happened because an untimely injury forced him to come back.
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