***Official 2019 B1G Off Season thread***

[hailtoyourvictor]

Did someone say it needed to be rebuilt "from the ground up" or are you injecting that?

No more than CardinalBoiler injected that I was "arguing that Purdue hadn't really struggled before Painter got there" when I literally said Purdue had two bad seasons before he got there.

Purdue struggled before Painter got there.
Dayton struggled before Miller got there.

Purdue is better now than it was when Painter took over.
Dayton was better when Miller left than when he arrived.

 

[bMORE607]

No more than CardinalBoiler injected that I was "arguing that Purdue hadn't really struggled before Painter got there" when I literally said Purdue had two bad seasons before he got there.

Purdue struggled before Painter got there.
Dayton struggled before Miller got there.

Purdue is better now than it was when Painter took over.
Dayton was better when Miller left than when he arrived.

No they didn't. Archie inherited a team that won a combined 97 games the previous 4 years. Stop acting like he built up Dayton.

 

[B1G_Fan]

No they didn't. Archie inherited a team that won a combined 97 games the previous 4 years. Stop acting like he built up Dayton.

Did Painter build up Purdue?

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

I think you misconstrue my simple statement as casual dismissal. But I can understand how that could happen on a message board.

That said, I am on record as saying I think too much emphasis is put on NCAA tournament results and that Dayton run would be an example I would use.

In the first round, Dayton needed a bucket with less than 4 seconds left to knock off OSU and in the 2nd round, Tyler Ennis missed two open looks in the last 8 seconds for Syracuse that would have given Cuse a late lead. If either of those occur, I'd wager Archie isn't coaching at IU. But they did so he is. And I didn't even mention that they beat 10 seeded Stanford to reach the Elite Eight (wait, now I did).

It was a great run and they won the games but it also illustrates the tenuous nature of NCAA success. As a Michigan fan, you should be well aware of that.

Purdue needed some of the most unconscious shooting I've ever seen and free throws with 2 seconds left to go into OT with Tennessee. I don't think that diminishes the accomplishment of Purdue making the Elite 8. Sometimes you're the hammer and sometimes you're the nail.

 

[IUBtown]

Maybe Izzo is a dirty coach...

View embedded media

He doesn’t pay his players he just allows them to rape and pillage without repercussion.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

No they didn't. Archie inherited a team that won a combined 97 games the previous 4 years. Stop acting like he built up Dayton.

Gregory missed the NCAA Tournament in 6 of 8 seasons including the 2 seasons before Archie took over when they finished 7th and 8th in the Atlantic 10. I consider that struggling.

Miller left Dayton making 4 straight NCAA Tournaments, Dayton's first Elite 8 since 1984, and winning back to back A-10 championships. I consider that being built up.

 

[B-Westy]

Did Painter build up Purdue?

No but he built it BACK up to the level of expectations that Purdue expects from its basketball program.

A Maserati with no engine or tires is still a Maserati yes, but you need an engine and tires to perform like a Maserati is expected to perform.

Purdue had a good reputation when painter took over, but it wasn’t in a good place performance-wise.

A coach can still build something at a program that has historically already been built.

 

[Toast.]

Wasn't last year's team was one of the last four out, lol. They would have been a shooin had we not had the injuries we did.

So again, you're either ignorant or you're lying, or both.

Ah, whoops they probably were this year.

But you still vastly overpredicted how good your team would be two years running. That's what homers do.

 

[boilerzz]

Purdue needed some of the most unconscious shooting I've ever seen and free throws with 2 seconds left to go into OT with Tennessee. I don't think that diminishes the accomplishment of Purdue making the Elite 8. Sometimes you're the hammer and sometimes you're the nail.

I agree. Purdue getting unconscious shooting from Edwards and Cline didn't suddenly make Painter a better coach.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

I agree. Purdue getting unconscious shooting from Edwards and Cline didn't suddenly make Painter a better coach.

I'm sorry but if you think non-conference win/loss without considering SOS is more important than tournament wins then you're not going to get very far with me. When comparing coaches from the same conference I care more about conference win/loss and tournament history than I care about who padded their win totals with cupcakes in the non-conference.

 

[B1G_Fan]

No but he built it BACK up to the level of expectations that Purdue expects from its basketball program.

A Maserati with no engine or tires is still a Maserati yes, but you need an engine and tires to perform like a Maserati is expected to perform.

Purdue had a good reputation when painter took over, but it wasn’t in a good place performance-wise.

A coach can still build something at a program that has historically already been built.

Would you say he has outperformed his predecessor so far?

 

[bMORE607]

Gregory missed the NCAA Tournament in 6 of 8 seasons including the 2 seasons before Archie took over when they finished 7th and 8th in the Atlantic 10. I consider that struggling.

Miller left Dayton making 4 straight NCAA Tournaments, Dayton's first Elite 8 since 1984, and winning back to back A-10 championships. I consider that being built up.

Its fvcking Dayton not a power 5 school. Jesus stop saying they struggled before Archie.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Its fvcking Dayton not a power 5 school. Jesus stop saying they struggled before Archie.

They still finished 7th and 8th in their mid-major conference and Archie still took that same mid-major to 4 straight NCAA Tournaments before he left.

 

[gowolverines8]

Juwan hits the trail for the first time tomorrow as he puts together another fab five.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Juwan hits the trail for the first time tomorrow as he puts together another fab five.

Thanks for the update, buddy. This thread needs more Michigan updates.

 

[B-Westy]

Would you say he has outperformed his predecessor so far?

About where Keady was or equal to it at this point.

 

[klize17]

Juwan hits the trail for the first time tomorrow as he puts together another fab five.

 

[hawkit3113]

Dayton is triggering the shit out of a particular poster.

 

[gowolverines8]

Thanks for the update, buddy. This thread needs more Michigan updates.

Agree, here's another juwan update

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

I'm ready to move on. I hope Archie fails at Indiana so we can see Borden pretend like Archie was never the guy he wanted.

 

[B1G_Fan]

About where Keady was or equal to it at this point.

I thought you were wrong and then I looked it up. I always thought Keady had more success than that.

 

[BoilerExpress]

Would you say he has outperformed his predecessor so far?

you talking Keady vs. Painter?

Their first 14 years are pretty damn close:

Keady: 4 b10 titles, 1 elite 8, 2 s16, 10 NCAAT appearances

Painter: 3.5* b10 titles, 1 elite 8, 5 s16, 11 NCAAT appearances

* i decided to count the BTT title as half a title


couple thoughts: Keady had a huge disadvantage with Knight at IU during those years: RMK won 2 national titles during the above time frame, and had iu absolutely rolling. as pointed out above, Keady took over right after a final four appearance (the stars of that team went to the NBA, however, so the cupboard wasn't loaded), and Painter walked into a team in bad shape that had missed 4 of the previous 5 NCAATs. And Painter was quite a bit younger and less experienced that Gene when he got the job

 

[SNU0821]

Ah, whoops they probably were this year.

But you still vastly overpredicted how good your team would be two years running. That's what homers do.

Hahahaha! Nah, I really didn't. Again, you’re either an idiot or you’re lying. Maybe both.

Show me where I “vastly over predicted” how good IU was going to be. Apparently it seems I didnt.

 

[boilerzz]

I'm sorry but if you think non-conference win/loss without considering SOS is more important than tournament wins then you're not going to get very far with me. When comparing coaches from the same conference I care more about conference win/loss and tournament history than I care about who padded their win totals with cupcakes in the non-conference.

I agree that conference W/L is more impactful than non-conference W/L. But it's not as easy as it used to be with there no longer being round robin schedules. Dayton's conference SOS under Archie averaged 10th and only top half once. Under Gregory, it was 4.6 and was top half 7 of his 8 seasons.

 

[gowolverines8]

Juwans top targets entering the live period

5* Wing Joshua Christopher
5* Guard Nimari Burnett
Top 50 wing Jabri Abhur-Rahim

Still waiting to identify the big he wants to go after, should be a top 50 guy at a minimum though.

 

[Toast.]

Hahahaha! Nah, I really didn't. Again, you’re either an idiot or you’re lying. Maybe both.

Show me where I “vastly over predicted” how good IU was going to be. Apparently it seems I didnt.

You thoughts both teams would make the NCAA tournament and neither did. You've already admitted in this thread that you thought both of those things. Instead they're not even .500 in the B1G and barely .500 overall.

 

[BoilerExpress]

BoilerExpress who I view as a very rational poster (plus his gif usage is elite).

 

[SNU0821]

You thoughts both teams would make the NCAA tournament and neither did. You've already admitted in this thread that you thought both of those things. Instead they're not even .500 in the B1G and barely .500 overall.

Nope. The first year they finished higher in the B10 than I predicted and last year they were ravaged by injuries or they would have. Yes, they missed the tournament the first year, I was wrong there, but last year they were one of the first four out and they had half the team with various injuries throughout the year or else they would have made the tournament. OMG, VASTLY overpredicted the results, huh? Lulz.

So longwinded way of saying I was pretty close excluding the one tournament miss his first year. So, again, you're either stupid or intentionally lying. I'm going with both.

 

[Toast.]

The first year they finished higher in the B10 than I predicted

lolololol they didn't make the tournament though you predicted them to, and you're trying to use their B1G finish to claim they were better than you thought they'd be.

you're either stupid or intentionally lying. I'm going with both.

 

[SNU0821]

lolololol they didn't make the tournament though you predicted them to, and you're trying to use their B1G finish to claim they were better than you thought they'd be.

you're either stupid or intentionally lying. I'm going with both.

VASTLY overpredicted. Lulz. Take the L bud.

 

[boilerzz]

Just went back thru the start of the in season thread and the end of the prior offseason thread and looks like Snu didn't even have the balls to make a prediction on Big Ten finish. The only thing I found was this:

Alright, I’m ready to do my final preseason prediction

1. Michigan
2. MSU
3. Indiana
4. Nebraska
5. Wisconsin
6. Purdue
7. Maryland
8. Iowa
9. Minnesota
10. Ohio State
11. Penn State
12. Illinois
13. Rutgers
14. Northwestern

Edit: the conference is much deeper as a whole this year. Making this list was hard in the middle. Many potential tournament teams.

I am Snu0821 and I approve of this message.

BTW, most of us were stupid and had IU in the top 3 (me included).

 

[Toast.]

VASTLY overpredicted. Lulz. Take the L bud.

I get it, you're always going to make big assumptions about how good IU will be. 2 tourney predictions, 2 NITs. You also debated adamantly that last year's IU team wasn't gonna suck from 3, which was painfully obvious for anyone that wasn't a massive homer.

 

[SNU0821]

I get it, you're always going to make big assumptions about how good IU will be. 2 tourney predictions, 2 NITs. You also debated adamantly that last year's IU team wasn't gonna suck from 3, which was painfully obvious for anyone that wasn't a massive homer.

VASTLY over predicted. Whoooooops. Take your L man.

 

[Toast.]

VASTLY over predicted. Whoooooops. Take your L man.

SNU predictions:
- Archie's first team would make the tourney = wrong
- Archie's second team would make the tourney = wrong
- McBob > Cline = lololol
- IU wouldn't suck ass from 3 = lololol

Some Very Good Takes from resident homer SNU.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Juwans top targets entering the live period

5* Wing Joshua Christopher
5* Guard Nimari Burnett
Top 50 wing Jabri Abhur-Rahim

Still waiting to identify the big he wants to go after, should be a top 50 guy at a minimum though.

Castleton is going to be good. Would a 5* want to come in and sit behind him?

 

[Toast.]

Castleton is going to be good. Would a 5* want to come in and sit behind him?

I really wanted Purdue to get him. I think he's going to be really good in time.

 

[SNU0821]

SNU predictions:
- Archie's first team would make the tourney = wrong
- Archie's second team would make the tourney = wrong
- McBob > Cline = lololol
- IU wouldn't suck ass from 3 = lololol

Some Very Good Takes from resident homer SNU.

Soooo IU was one of the first four out even with the injuries and they finished higher in the B10 then I predicted in Archie’s first year. VASTLY over predicted. Lulz.

 

[boiler1987]

Soooo IU was one of the first four out even with the injuries and they finished higher in the B10 then I predicted in Archie’s first year. VASTLY over predicted. Lulz.

That Cline-McBob one was bad though. No idea where that came from.

 

[SNU0821]

That Cline-McBob one was bad though. No idea where that came from.

Not what we're talking about, but don't disagree either. I was pretty conservative with my predictions on IU and wasn't that far off. We did better in the B10 than I thought the first year, but missed the tourney. Last year, well, that doesn't count in my mind considering the injuries and impacts on the team even though we were still on the bubble and I thought we'd be in.

 

[boiler1987]

Not what we're talking about, but don't disagree either. I was pretty conservative with my predictions on IU and wasn't that far off. We did better in the B10 than I thought the first year, but missed the tourney. Last year, well, that doesn't count in my mind considering the injuries and impacts on the team even though we were still on the bubble and I thought we'd be in.

Dumb question but I’m guessing that barring any unexpected injuries, most IU fans will be pretty pissed if you guys miss the tournament? Not that Archie’s seat will be hot but maybe starting to get warm? I’m guessing he gets at least 4 years.