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Hurt To Duke

schoonerwest said:
Duke did have the highest ceiling but people on this board have unrealistic expectations of what they consider a good year. Some say that anything other than a title or Final Four is a bad season. They’re basically saying that the best programs have been unsuccessful 75% of their history. That’s just dumb. An Elite Eight is a really good year no matter who you are. We all know it hurts when you’re one of the favorites and you lose in the Elite Eight but it doesn’t change the fact that just getting there is a pretty big accomplishment.
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I thought about hastaging this with blue blue problems(stupid joke that i only laugh at), but realistically, we're better. We're bluebloods for a reason. I can go on and on about fans of lesser teams spouting off about how we didn't succeed, but why bother? They rarely succeed.
 
coryfly said:
I don't disagree K may not have had the horses in terms of depth. Some of that may be due to the transfers he losses because he doesn't develop that depth though. I'm not sure. I can't keep up with which guys they lose would still be there. Regardless, if that is the case then that may still be the case next year. I believe their bench is about the same next year as this year. Depth is definitely important. That has been part of the issue for UNC the last couple of years.

I'll admit I was very bullish on their team when healthy. I thought they were clearly the best team in the country. I still believe that. They just lost. They also weren't really playing their best basketball in the tourney. That happens in the dance. I'm glad it did. Like usual, both extremes are probably off here. I bet if we cared enough to look there were Duke fans here who implied pretty strongly they were the best team in the country. I bet there were others, I know there were, who tried to temper things a bit and were optimistic but realistic as well. They didn't meet expectations that remained pretty consistent all year. However, they weren't the only team.
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Agreed.

All the sudden, Duke fans are saying they just weren't that good, but that wasn't the narrative all year long on here and certainly not on ESPN.

I've never seen a team and an individual player hyped up so much in my life.

Duke had not one, but two transcendent players, plus a top 10 pg and a top 5 forward in Reddish.

They were the most talented team in the country by a mile. Add the fact that they supposedly have the GOAT in the coaches box.

The one thing I noticed, especially the last two years, is the lack of player development. Reddish and Barrett seemed to be the same in March as they were in April. Jones got better defensively and Zion showed some defensive improvement, but when you compare the game on 11/6 to the last game, I didn't see much in the way of individual player improvement.

But again, the narrative has certainly changed after MSU beat Duke after Duke almost lost their previous two games.

We've seen UK choke a couple of times (2010 and 2015), but remember, Cal just rolls the balls out, nobody has ever referred to him as the GOAT or even great, just good, descent or terrible. K has massively underachieved these last two years.

Now Duke is going to field a far less talented team than the 18 and 19 versions and it will be an extremely young team. I'm not seeing much for Duke in 2019/2020.
 
kyjeff1 said:
Agreed.

All the sudden, Duke fans are saying they just weren't that good, but that wasn't the narrative all year long on here and certainly not on ESPN.

I've never seen a team and an individual player hyped up so much in my life.

Duke had not one, but two transcendent players, plus a top 10 pg and a top 5 forward in Reddish.

They were the most talented team in the country by a mile. Add the fact that they supposedly have the GOAT in the coaches box.

The one thing I noticed, especially the last two years, is the lack of player development. Reddish and Barrett seemed to be the same in March as they were in April. Jones got better defensively and Zion showed some defensive improvement, but when you compare the game on 11/6 to the last game, I didn't see much in the way of individual player improvement.

But again, the narrative has certainly changed after MSU beat Duke after Duke almost lost their previous two games.

We've seen UK choke a couple of times (2010 and 2015), but remember, Cal just rolls the balls out, nobody has ever referred to him as the GOAT or even great, just good, descent or terrible. K has massively underachieved these last two years.

Now Duke is going to field a far less talented team than the 18 and 19 versions and it will be an extremely young team. I'm not seeing much for Duke in 2019/2020.
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Where are Duke fans saying that they just weren't that good?

What are you noticing in Cal's system to where they haven't had any more success with freshmen development than Krzyzewski? I mean, why are we expecting freshmen to make these huge leaps from November to March? This is why the OAD era is so frustrating. Krzyzewski has adopted it, so it's on him to do what he can. But it doesn't matter how high players are rated coming out of HS. The vast majority of players don't reach their potential in their first year. Many don't reach it in their second year. It is past time we sit back and reflect on the expectations we are placing on 18 year old kids.

As far as next year, we'll see. I definitely don't think they will be hyped or favored to win it all. But I welcome that.
 
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All this thread comes down to is opposing fans being pissed at the coverage Duke and Zion received this year from the media.

Newsflash, Duke has nothing to do with that.
 
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kyjeff1 said:
Agreed.

All the sudden, Duke fans are saying they just weren't that good, but that wasn't the narrative all year long on here and certainly not on ESPN.

I've never seen a team and an individual player hyped up so much in my life.

Duke had not one, but two transcendent players, plus a top 10 pg and a top 5 forward in Reddish.

They were the most talented team in the country by a mile. Add the fact that they supposedly have the GOAT in the coaches box.

The one thing I noticed, especially the last two years, is the lack of player development. Reddish and Barrett seemed to be the same in March as they were in April. Jones got better defensively and Zion showed some defensive improvement, but when you compare the game on 11/6 to the last game, I didn't see much in the way of individual player improvement.

But again, the narrative has certainly changed after MSU beat Duke after Duke almost lost their previous two games.

We've seen UK choke a couple of times (2010 and 2015), but remember, Cal just rolls the balls out, nobody has ever referred to him as the GOAT or even great, just good, descent or terrible. K has massively underachieved these last two years.

Now Duke is going to field a far less talented team than the 18 and 19 versions and it will be an extremely young team. I'm not seeing much for Duke in 2019/2020.
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UK 2013, what was that.
 
LetsGoDuke301 said:
Where are Duke fans saying that they just weren't that good?
As far as next year, we'll see. I definitely don't think they will be hyped or favored to win it all. But I welcome that.
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Unfortunately, I’m one of the fans that says we weren’t that good. At least not what the hype was. It’s a shame someone else couldn’t step up and help Zion and RJ.
I agree with you on next season’s team. But it feels really good going into the season knowing Tre is our returning point guard. We have a true leader. I don’t think we’ve had that since Cook.
 
Mac9192 said:
Unfortunately, I’m one of the fans that says we weren’t that good. At least not what the hype was. It’s a shame someone else couldn’t step up and help Zion and RJ.
I agree with you on next season’s team. But it feels really good going into the season knowing Tre is our returning point guard. We have a true leader. I don’t think we’ve had that since Cook.
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For sure. And junior Quinn was good, but he wasn't what he became as a senior.
 
LetsGoDuke301 said:
Where are Duke fans saying that they just weren't that good?

What are you noticing in Cal's system to where they haven't had any more success with freshmen development than Krzyzewski? I mean, why are we expecting freshmen to make these huge leaps from November to March? This is why the OAD era is so frustrating. Krzyzewski has adopted it, so it's on him to do what he can. But it doesn't matter how high players are rated coming out of HS. The vast majority of players don't reach their potential in their first year. Many don't reach it in their second year. It is past time we sit back and reflect on the expectations we are placing on 18 year old kids.

As far as next year, we'll see. I definitely don't think they will be hyped or favored to win it all. But I welcome that.
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LetsGoDuke301 said:
You watched that Duke team and can say that they had plenty of horses? Over 50% of their scoring came from two guys. That is a two horse show.
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TheDude1 said:
How some people still don’t get that there is more to making it to the final four than just having some first round draft picks is beyond me.
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Afamu said:
UK 2013, what was that.
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Oh, maybe a catastrophic knee injury to Nerlens Noel after the entire team from the season before left. What exactly is your point? Nobody crowned that UK team as anything great. 2018/19 Duke was hyped up more than any team that I can remember. ESPN was doing split cams on Zion, games were moved to ESPNNEWS that were in overtime so we could watch Duke's players get introduced and ESPN talked more about Zion and Duke basketball than the NFL, the Yankees, Red Sox and even the Dallas Cowboys.

Jay Bilas was all on that Duke train and refused to believe anything but Duke being the best team.

There is no way anyone can sit here now and all the sudden claim that K was at some disadvantage the last two years or that Duke really didn't have much in the way of talent. You have to he kidding.

Again, don't know where you were going with the 2013 UK comment, you would have been better off saying UK 2010 or UK 2015.
 
kyjeff1 said:
Why are they horrible letsgo? Because they don't support your argument?

Those quotes prove my point to a tee and what's funny is one of them is yours.
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They don't support your argument. In no way do the comments you quoted suggest that either of us were saying that Duke just wasn't that good. In fact, if you would quit cherry picking comments to attempt to make them support your argument and actually read everything that I have said, you would see that in no way was I saying Duke wasn't good.

But it's whatever. This is a tired topic. One fan base gets to celebrate 2019 and it is neither yours or mine.
 
kyjeff1 said:
Agreed.

All the sudden, Duke fans are saying they just weren't that good, but that wasn't the narrative all year long on here and certainly not on ESPN.

I've never seen a team and an individual player hyped up so much in my life.

Duke had not one, but two transcendent players, plus a top 10 pg and a top 5 forward in Reddish.

They were the most talented team in the country by a mile. Add the fact that they supposedly have the GOAT in the coaches box.

The one thing I noticed, especially the last two years, is the lack of player development. Reddish and Barrett seemed to be the same in March as they were in April. Jones got better defensively and Zion showed some defensive improvement, but when you compare the game on 11/6 to the last game, I didn't see much in the way of individual player improvement.

But again, the narrative has certainly changed after MSU beat Duke after Duke almost lost their previous two games.

We've seen UK choke a couple of times (2010 and 2015), but remember, Cal just rolls the balls out, nobody has ever referred to him as the GOAT or even great, just good, descent or terrible. K has massively underachieved these last two years.

Now Duke is going to field a far less talented team than the 18 and 19 versions and it will be an extremely young team. I'm not seeing much for Duke in 2019/2020.
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Even Duke fans said and joked that they peaked the first game of the year.... When Barrett and Zion scored so easily all season... they probably didnt think they needed to improve on anything.
 
kyjeff1 said:
Why are they horrible letsgo? Because they don't support your argument?

Those quotes prove my point to a tee and what's funny is one of them is yours.
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So you think that someone pointing out that Duke was really reliant on two players and that having first round draft picks isn’t all you need to make the Final Four = Duke wasn’t a good team?

You are dumb.
 
TheDude1 said:
You know how people have been talking about how this forum isn’t quite what it was, that some crappy posters are scaring off the good ones?
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are you about to talk about pigtails again, or maybe ask about what porn we watch?
 
kyjeff1 said:
Agreed.

All the sudden, Duke fans are saying they just weren't that good, but that wasn't the narrative all year long on here and certainly not on ESPN.

I've never seen a team and an individual player hyped up so much in my life.

Duke had not one, but two transcendent players, plus a top 10 pg and a top 5 forward in Reddish.

They were the most talented team in the country by a mile. Add the fact that they supposedly have the GOAT in the coaches box.

The one thing I noticed, especially the last two years, is the lack of player development. Reddish and Barrett seemed to be the same in March as they were in April. Jones got better defensively and Zion showed some defensive improvement, but when you compare the game on 11/6 to the last game, I didn't see much in the way of individual player improvement.

But again, the narrative has certainly changed after MSU beat Duke after Duke almost lost their previous two games.

We've seen UK choke a couple of times (2010 and 2015), but remember, Cal just rolls the balls out, nobody has ever referred to him as the GOAT or even great, just good, descent or terrible. K has massively underachieved these last two years.

Now Duke is going to field a far less talented team than the 18 and 19 versions and it will be an extremely young team. I'm not seeing much for Duke in 2019/2020.
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But...what about the narrative that UK was the best team in the country and was going to mow through the field like it were the Bahamas? How does that fit in?
 
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MrBaracus said:
But...what about the narrative that UK was the best team in the country and was going to mow through the field like it were the Bahamas? How does that fit in?
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Some have that selective amnesia going on. They were doing a lot of talking on how they were going to do duke dirty and we all know who got done dirty. After the Bahamas trip it was like let’s crown UK now.
 
AWilli6995 said:
Some have that selective amnesia going on. They were doing a lot of talking on how they were going to do duke dirty and we all know who got done dirty. After the Bahamas trip it was like let’s crown UK now.
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Anyone down playing their team next year?:D
 
I;m sure Duke will have him NBA ready in one year.



 
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LetsGoDuke301 said:
They don't support your argument. In no way do the comments you quoted suggest that either of us were saying that Duke just wasn't that good. In fact, if you would quit cherry picking comments to attempt to make them support your argument and actually read everything that I have said, you would see that in no way was I saying Duke wasn't good.

But it's whatever. This is a tired topic. One fan base gets to celebrate 2019 and it is neither yours or mine.
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I think you need to read those quoted comments again. I don't recall seeing comments like those during the season when Duke was all over ESPN and things appeared to be fine.
 
kyjeff1 said:
I think you need to read those quoted comments again. I don't recall seeing comments like those during the season when Duke was all over ESPN and things appeared to be fine.
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Dude. You can do the leg work here and go back to where I have been consistent with what I am saying here for the last two months of the season. Don't know why you're so held up on this, but I am over it.
 
bignish said:
He's our baby! We're going to take care of him.

Hurt is perfect, Duke is going to have the deepest front court in the country.
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It is still Bolden and Delaurier as your depth and two freshman as your starters. You are kind of prone to preseason super hype regarding Duke though.
 
LetsGoDuke301 said:
Dude. You can do the leg work here and go back to where I have been consistent with what I am saying here for the last two months of the season. Don't know why you're so held up on this, but I am over it.
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Because they really want to prove how upset we are.

And what’s funny is that we were literally talking about this all year, that we only had two real options for scoring, that cam wasn’t playing well, that Jack White and some of our other bench wasn’t playing well, that our three-point shooting was poor, and that we weren’t hitting free throws. Literally discussed all year.

But hey, when a crazy rival fan gets a story in their head, whether it is a reality or not, they are going to roll with it.
 
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coryfly said:
It is still Bolden and Delaurier as your depth and two freshman as your starters. You are kind of prone to preseason super hype regarding Duke though.
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I'm actually looking forward to having Delaurier as a senior role player. I'm not expecting him to be an all American or anywhere near it, I just think that he is better suited for the style of play Duke will be playing next year. Wouldn't say that Duke has the deepest front court either way though.
 
TheDude1 said:
So you think that someone pointing out that Duke was really reliant on two players and that having first round draft picks isn’t all you need to make the Final Four = Duke wasn’t a good team?

You are dumb.
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I can see you're upset, you'll be fine.

Duke might have been reliant on two scorers....in crunch time maybe. But who's fault is that?

You guys are trying to say Duke only had 2 reliable scorers period. I call bullshit. According to ESPN.com stats, Reddish averaged 13.5ppg, Jones scored 9.4ppg and FIVE POINT THREE assists per game. K had more offensive firepower than anyone else in the country. He also had more athletasism and talent across the board.

Barrett AND Zion both averaged 22.6ppg out of the toughest conference in the country according to every ACC fan on here (to which I agree with).

Now, let's look at the team that won the tournament. UVA had a total of three, count them, 3 guys that averaged double digits points: Guy (15.4), Hunter (15.2) and Jerome (13.6). Then Diakite averaged 7.4.

It looks to me like Duke had more reliable scorers than UVA has.

Texas Tech had Culver (18.5), Moretti (11.5), Mooney (11.3) and Owens (8.7). Nowhere near the firepower of Duke.

My question to you and Let's go is, what the hell else does the GOAT need? Zion might be the greatest freshmen to ever play in college. ESPN certainly thought so. That kid was unstoppable on both ends of the court and Barrett, a second transcendent player on the team, could score at will and had a PG that could get him the ball anywhere on the court

I gotta say, the excuses are pretty lame. At least when UK lost in 10 and 15 we owned it. We still have to deal with the "Cal can't game coach" crap. But you guys are hinting at a flawed roster all the sudden.

My opinion, K massively underachieved the last 2 years.
 
LetsGoDuke301 said:
I'm actually looking forward to having Delaurier as a senior role player. I'm not expecting him to be an all American or anywhere near it, I just think that he is better suited for the style of play Duke will be playing next year. Wouldn't say that Duke has the deepest front court either way though.
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Oh, it isn't a bad deal for you guys. If the freshman are better than both of those guys they are great bench players. That is what UNC has needed for both Brooks and Manley but haven't been able to do that because we haven't had a center. We do next year but he is a freshman so who knows how that will work out.
 
MrBaracus said:
But...what about the narrative that UK was the best team in the country and was going to mow through the field like it were the Bahamas? How does that fit in?
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Hmm, don't know what that has to do with this. I don't see any Uk fans making excuses for losing. But thanks for continuing to be worthless on here.
 
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