Why you going to send your damn direwilf off to fight with a Dothraki hoard? Even if they were to survive the Dothraki would eat it during their celebration. John Snow is a dumbass.
GOT
- Thread starter mebeblue2
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Robb is absolutely the better military tactician and leader than Jon. That’s always been the case. Jon doesn’t even want to be the king. Shoot, his mistakes already got him killed once.
But regarding the flanking, kind of harder to execute at night. The Dothraki are really good at fighting as a charging Calvary, but that’s really all they can execute. They aren’t good in close quarters.
Looks like Ghost is in the preview for episode 4 at the 0:18 mark among the people.
I’m glad the dog recognized that charging in was a suicide mission and bailed.
You've made a couple excuses for what amounts to just terrible tactics. If they're only good for a charge, do it while the enemy is preoccupied.
Ahhhh thatd be nice. Would it not have been smarter to just leave him with Sansa?
Daenarys has to know Jon was telling the truth about being Rhaegal’s son. She saved Jon with dragon fire and it didn’t affect him. “Fire cannot burn a dragon.”
I think fire can burn Targaryens. She used blood magic to survive the funeral pyre of Drogo.
Nah Dany can just withstand fire -- she also did it when she took down the temple of the Dosh Khaleen.
Jon burned his hand badly when he saved older Mormont from the wight at Castle Black. I think he just wasn't close enough to the dragonfire -- got a little par baked, not cooked -- as opposed to it showing he has that blood of the dragon ability to not be hurt by fire.
So I don't think all Targaryens have it. But Dany does.
This pops up when you google are Targaryens fireproof. I don’t think she is completely immune to fire because I think she got burned in the books.
Daenerys (and by extension Targaryensin general) being fireproof is an extremely common misconception among fans of the show. George RR Martin's first book in the series, A Game Of Thrones, gave his readers no reason to believe that Daenerys was immune to heat damage. ... TARGARYENS ARE NOT IMMUNE TO FIRE!
Maybe not completely immune, but something close as she's withstood fire twice in the show and once that I know of in the books (I'm on book 2 currently). Also in the books (and I think in the show as well) she constantly gets into baths that are described as scolding hot.
In the book she came out of Drago's funeral pyre with her hair singed off, but otherwise no damage.
That was definitely in the show... I remember that scene, vividly.
Yea I think she has a strong resistance to fire, whether that’s due to her having some special ability or some blood magic, but the show has seemed to make her completely immune.
I didn't say they were good tactics. I said Jon is not a good tactician and neither is Dany. Robb was, he's dead. Jamie is, but they don't fully trust him.
Jon having terrible tactics is true to Jon's character.
Not wanting to be King doesn't mean you are worse at the job than someone who does want it.
Rob was a better tactician, but not the better (at least not clearly) leader. His own decisions led to the Red Wedding. Meanwhile, Jon's short stint as King led to the defeat of the army of the dead.
Whole lot being said about tactics, but who's to say that flanking would even work at all? You're talking about thinning out your significantly smaller army across an unknown length of the battlefield in an attempt to attack 2-3 sides of a supernatural army that has you vastly out-manned.
I feel like it's also fair to say that when you send thousands of Dothraki into battle and they all die within 30 seconds, it comes down to a bit more than tactics.
And what exactly does an undead army preoccupy its time with? They don't need food or sleep, they never get tired, they're ultra aggressive, there were seemingly hundreds of thousands of them, their generals are apparently Olympian javelin throwers with ice javelins that kill dragons in one hit, they have the ability to summon an ice storm that pretty much makes a dragon useless, and is one helluva fire extinguisher to boot, and they can just raise an entire undead army again at the flick of a wrist. I don't feel like conventional warfare is a valid answer here lol.
I feel like it's also fair to say that when you send thousands of Dothraki into battle and they all die within 30 seconds, it comes down to a bit more than tactics.
And what exactly does an undead army preoccupy its time with? They don't need food or sleep, they never get tired, they're ultra aggressive, there were seemingly hundreds of thousands of them, their generals are apparently Olympian javelin throwers with ice javelins that kill dragons in one hit, they have the ability to summon an ice storm that pretty much makes a dragon useless, and is one helluva fire extinguisher to boot, and they can just raise an entire undead army again at the flick of a wrist. I don't feel like conventional warfare is a valid answer here lol.
Charging straight into an army with light cavalry thats vastly outnumbered has and will always be the wrong tactic.
Hey I don't disagree that they were vastly outnumbered and up shit's creek.
That doesn't mean that there weren't better plans than giving your siege weapons and archers 30 seconds of firing then sending your cavalry straight into the army that's so powerful. Their big move was a small trench that was on fire.
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The one and only goal should’ve been to hit the Night King with dragonstone. The more bloodshed is always in his interest since he can raise the dead. While they were playing tag on dragons, they should’ve been launching dragonstone at the guy.
All bs aside about Bran, Night King, Three Eyed Raven, et. all, was really hoping for more clarity in that storyline. Bran is a weird dude. Needs explanation.
How many armies destroyed? Cersei will be stopped... how
All bs aside about Bran, Night King, Three Eyed Raven, et. all, was really hoping for more clarity in that storyline. Bran is a weird dude. Needs explanation.
How many armies destroyed? Cersei will be stopped... how
Eh, Winterfell is total ass right now, but ol' Ned did say that 500 men could hold Winterfell against 10,000 men. Plus there are two dragons. I suppose it really depends on where the battle takes place. At least by the look of the preview for the next episode, it would appear that the golden company is getting ready to march off to war.
Whole lot of dialogue left to be divulged before we can connect those dots specifically though.
The war for the iron throne won’t(shouldn’t) be held in the north. They will make them lay siege to King’s Landing.
Ice dragon knocked big chunks of wall down. Winterfell is not in good shape.
I was referring to Winterfell’s wall. The ice dragon destroyed a good piece of it.
Some ideas:
Lannister army, led by Bronn of the Blackwater, could flip and fight with Jamie/Tyrion/Podrick.
Second Sons could show up and fight for Daenarys.
The dothrak
Pretty sure jon was burned in S1 when fighting off the first wight
I think they had the Dothraki rush just because the visuals looked cool. Maybe. IDK. I just hated Jorah saving her. Thought that was too Hollywood for a show that for the most part has avoided it.
I laughed out loud when he showed up, ultimate friend zone move
I feel like that could be a mistake. Leaving Kings Landing would take away her biggest advantage of having Euron’s ships.
Marching while dragons can pick apart your army would seem like a mistake. putting an army in ships while there are dragons would also seem like a mistake. so I might agree with you.
Hmmm... a lot of thoughts, now that I finally caught up, a day late.
It was a difficult episode to watch.
Firstly, because of the actual filming. It was dark, a lot of the bodies looked the same, the dragons REALLY looked the same, there was a lot of swirling snow, and there was a lot of "Character A magically appears next to Character B, even though they were nowhere near each other."
Secondly, for me, because it was just terribly brutal. Sure, maybe not for our named characters, but christ, the sheer scale of death was a lot to take. Every single dothraki, it looks like almost all of the unsullied, we didn't see a ton of the wildlings but I think we have to assume them, too, and then a lot of the crypt... the North is basically wiped out, and all of Dany's armies that she built up over the last seven seasons, gone too. And horribly, too... what a terrible death for so many people. Listening to the slaughter in the crypt made me a bit sick.
Not a fan of the tactics. I guess it makes sense that the Dothraki would just charge... that's clearly their way, and they clearly will be most effective doing that, rather than fighting on foot behind walls... but still, just felt like suicide. And the unsullied... throughout the show, they never really fought in the shield wall/phalanx formation that spears and shields would imply. I expected them to make a big ass wall of shields and have the dead smash into them for a good long while... instead, the dead just flowed right over them like water. Maybe the idea is that the humans didn't REALLY get how deadly the dead were?
I was shocked that more named people didn't die, but in the end I am glad. I was not ready to say goodbye to a lot of these characters. But yeah, it was WAY too convenient... they were all surrounded by dead bodies and wights, but all managed to survive, without any regular people around them surviving? WAY too much plot armor.
Interesting that Arya turned out to be the one the prophecy was talking about. Didn't expect that. But so then why did Jon come back to life? What was his mission? Was it basically the gathering of the people to defend the North?
The cleanup would be INSANE. Like... it would take months and months. I guess you'd just have the dragons burn the bodies? What a horrible job. BTW, can't believe that it seems that both dragons (and Ghost?!) survived the battle! Sooo... now how does that impact what happens in Kings Landing? The image of Drogon hopping away covered with the dead was pretty brutal.
Will winter now end? Like... will the weather turn good now? I'd be down for that, I think.
I am actually thrilled that the Night King storyline appears to be done. The dead and the Night King were never the shows strong point; the strong point has always been the characters and the interactions. The "next week on" made me very happy... all faces we know, all well-lit, and looking like the GoT we know so well. I have high hopes for the last three episodes, especially since we sort of knew what was coming to this point (big battle, good guys win.)
I am also starting to have some hope, that in the end some of the characters we love will survive.
It was a difficult episode to watch.
Firstly, because of the actual filming. It was dark, a lot of the bodies looked the same, the dragons REALLY looked the same, there was a lot of swirling snow, and there was a lot of "Character A magically appears next to Character B, even though they were nowhere near each other."
Secondly, for me, because it was just terribly brutal. Sure, maybe not for our named characters, but christ, the sheer scale of death was a lot to take. Every single dothraki, it looks like almost all of the unsullied, we didn't see a ton of the wildlings but I think we have to assume them, too, and then a lot of the crypt... the North is basically wiped out, and all of Dany's armies that she built up over the last seven seasons, gone too. And horribly, too... what a terrible death for so many people. Listening to the slaughter in the crypt made me a bit sick.
Not a fan of the tactics. I guess it makes sense that the Dothraki would just charge... that's clearly their way, and they clearly will be most effective doing that, rather than fighting on foot behind walls... but still, just felt like suicide. And the unsullied... throughout the show, they never really fought in the shield wall/phalanx formation that spears and shields would imply. I expected them to make a big ass wall of shields and have the dead smash into them for a good long while... instead, the dead just flowed right over them like water. Maybe the idea is that the humans didn't REALLY get how deadly the dead were?
I was shocked that more named people didn't die, but in the end I am glad. I was not ready to say goodbye to a lot of these characters. But yeah, it was WAY too convenient... they were all surrounded by dead bodies and wights, but all managed to survive, without any regular people around them surviving? WAY too much plot armor.
Interesting that Arya turned out to be the one the prophecy was talking about. Didn't expect that. But so then why did Jon come back to life? What was his mission? Was it basically the gathering of the people to defend the North?
The cleanup would be INSANE. Like... it would take months and months. I guess you'd just have the dragons burn the bodies? What a horrible job. BTW, can't believe that it seems that both dragons (and Ghost?!) survived the battle! Sooo... now how does that impact what happens in Kings Landing? The image of Drogon hopping away covered with the dead was pretty brutal.
Will winter now end? Like... will the weather turn good now? I'd be down for that, I think.
I am actually thrilled that the Night King storyline appears to be done. The dead and the Night King were never the shows strong point; the strong point has always been the characters and the interactions. The "next week on" made me very happy... all faces we know, all well-lit, and looking like the GoT we know so well. I have high hopes for the last three episodes, especially since we sort of knew what was coming to this point (big battle, good guys win.)
I am also starting to have some hope, that in the end some of the characters we love will survive.
Agree. Game of Thrones used to avoid all the typical tropes but the last few seasons they seem to have bought into them more and more. A lot of Deus Ex Machina in this episode to save all of the most important characters for the end.
Don’t get me wrong, I still enjoy the show and there were aspects of the episode that I enjoyed. But I never felt any of the main characters were in real danger so it took much of the suspense away.
Really?! Shit, I thought Jorah was dead as soon as he rode out with the Dothraki, and I thought Brianne and Jamie and the rest died as soon as the dead hit the first line of men. I mean... they should have.
Definitely a little too much deus ex machina and forced stuff, but what can you do.
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