Because we are staying inside and practicing much better health habits like frequent hand washing. Flu is much less contagious than COVID.
OT- death projections 60k
- Thread starter ThroughBlue
- Start date
Because we are staying inside and practicing much better health habits like frequent hand washing. Flu is much less contagious than COVID.
I know people who think China engineered this or that they are keeping us inside for other insidious purpose. I just can't get with that sort of thing though, haha.
I'm all for preserving lives. What I find problematic, however, is there have been close to 50 million babies aborted in the United States in last half century - mostly due to the financial and lifestyle burden that they could present. The rationale needs to be consistent, IMO. Abortion is much more insidious because it is a calculated decision; it is an attack on the defenseless.
From my perspective, those who who are willing to dispose of the elderly in favor of preserving the economy, are taking almost the exact same stance as pro-choice advocates. Essentially saying, “sacrificing/risking someone else’s life is justified if it places an undue amount of pressure on us emotionally or financially.” Let's protect the elderly. Yes. Absolutely. But let's not forget about the unborn who don't get a say in the matter.
I think a key difference is, there is universal agreement that the elderly person is a person with rights and liberties. There is not universal agreement about that being true for an unborn fetus.
Hey numb nuts, might want to read my posts before quoting this one sentence trying to sound like a smart ass
Wait, so which is it... a man made weapon to cull the Chinese herd, or a hoax to cover up impending world wide doom? Make up your mind, man! Or are you implying that it it is a made man weapon that just happened to be released at the exact right time because now we don’t know about the asteroid, so it is BOTH?! Son of a...
Yeah, that’s a pretty key difference, the idea that this:
And this:
... are meaningfully different.
Man, adding photos on an iPad is ****ing ridiculously hard. They really messed it up.
Last edited:
I recognize that we live in a society that is very tolerant of a women's right to have an abortion. But, I do believe it's essentially the same thing. Both represent huge financial and emotional burdens - both represent opportunities lost. Freedom to run your business, or freedom to come and go as you please in your social life.
I think it's a bit misguided to think an unborn child shouldn't have rights, however. They have their own unique DNA Code at conception, a heartbeat begins within 3 weeks, at 26 days the circulation of blood begins. The thing with abortion, as far as what constitutes human life, is life at conception is the only consistent argument. Is it universally accepted that unborn babies have human rights? No, of course not. It's also not universally accepted on the way we should go about ending this pandemic. Either way, human life should be valued. And if left to its natural processes, an unborn baby is human life.
This is a pretty ridiculous take DD and a logically bankrupt analogy. Unless you are saying that the people who don't care about protecting the elderly don't believe the elderly are people.
But you are avoiding the difference because you don't think there is one. I may even agree with you there but the two things are different because the people who are pro choice do not view the two the same. Even if you and I do your analogy only works with the mindset of a pro-life individual. Pro-choice advocates do value human life, or what they consider physiologically to be human life.
My point, is that those who are pro-economy with minimal quarantine restrictions are clearly willingly to risk the lives of others, because doing so would reduce financial and emotional stress. This is exactly why people get abortions. Women wouldn't get an abortion if it didn't impose certain stresses. Babies represent lost opportunity for many, and it makes professional and social development much more challenging. Yet, the rationale is the same. You risk the life of others to make your life easier.
People play Russian roulette with the elderly because they're concerned about their own livelihood - the same way young women often do with their unborn children. To say otherwise, IMO, is wildly inconsistent. If we're trying to value human life, let's protect all human life, and not have selective compassion.
You are correct that pro-choice people don't view it as the same. That's why I'm pointing out the logical inconsistency. In both cases, we're talking about human life. And it's our selfish nature that is willing to risk the livelihood of another person - because of the burdens and stresses they represent.
Exactly. Whether folks want to admit it or not, there are large numbers of people on both sides of that argument.
There are not large segments of people who believe that a 70 year old person isn’t a person.
I see your point but I think when the world reopens it's going to be with stipulations on the elderly staying in place. I don't know, I'm lucky I'm still working and have enough money to last awhile if I'm suddenly out of work... A lot of people aren't so lucky. It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.
No, we aren’t. That’s the point. There is a very large segment of people who do not view it as human life. There simply isn’t an agreed upon definition of when life starts.
Also, I think you’re being a little incomplete with your reasons for abortion. Financial burden or loss of opportunity are certainly some of the reasons. But not all.
Once again, NOPE. DD, you're too smart to not see how flawed your logic is on this.
I'm sure there are a myriad of reasons why women get an abortion. The bottom line, is it's an inconvenience. People in the midst of this pandemic wanting to get back to their normal lives, not concerned about the elderly or autoimmune compromised, are also inconvenienced. Both are risking the life of someone else.
And yes, it is human life we're talking about. It doesn't matter that it's not universally accepted. What matters is that an unborn baby has a beating heart. And to have an abortion, you are stopping that heartbeat. There's no way around that. Only difference between abortion and those eager to back to their normal lives, is abortion has a fatality rate of 100%.
Yeah, we are in the same situation here, which is why I try to not say a lot about the situation. I know people who are struggling financially or emotionally with this probably have issues with it I don't. I'm sure that influences their outlook. I feel like I'm empathetic and do really feel awful about it but it isn't the same as being truly impacted by it. I mean, the biggest drawback for me right now is not playing golf.
Many people do not think it is a human life. A fetus (that’s the word you are looking for, not “unborn baby”... medically, baby is post-birth) doesn’t always have a heart beat. And a heart beat doesn’t mean anything magical... it’s not like “Ah, a heart beat means it is sacred and holy and life!” You seem to be struggling with this idea, that not everyone agrees with you and that you might not be right.
We kills millions of animals every year for food and whathaveyou. Shelters kill more animals than can be counted.
Many of them have more “going on”, more awareness and life and caring and love, than this:
It’s a bad analogy. Try a different one.
Last edited:
Man, this thread is all over the place. I just want it to be known that I'd abort a fetus and half of you in here.
And I’ll add that I am pro-choice but I still think an abortion is the murder of a baby. That’s what it was going to be the majority of the time.
I also think cookie dough will eventually be cookies, FTR.
If it was up to me you'd be allowed to abort anytime for any reason until the baby reaches the age of 2.
How did this thread get on abortion? Too funny
Agree with this. Pro choice but you’re kind of kidding yourself if you think abortion isn’t killing a human being.
Yeah, this is where I fall as well. I think it is completely wrong but am sort of pro choice because of my feelings on prohibition and the ramifications of it. I also don't vote on social issue though so don't really care about this sort of thing that much.
It's a good analogy you guys just enjoy justifying baby murder. Sorry, fetus murder. Which is fine but you also try to take the moral high ground a lot which is pretty ****ed up given your stance on this particular issue.Many people do not think it is a human life. A fetus (that’s the word you are looking for, not “unborn baby”... medically, baby is post-birth) doesn’t always have a heart beat. And a heart beat doesn’t mean anything magical... it’s not like “Ah, a heart beat means it is sacred and holy and life!” You seem to be struggling with this idea, that not everyone agrees with you and that you might not be right.
We kills millions of animals every year for food and whathaveyou. Shelters kill more animals than can be counted.
Many of them have more “going on”, more awareness and life and caring and love, than this:
It’s a bad analogy. Try a different one.
If given the option would you rather live 70+ years then die of some Chinese flue virus/asteroid diversion or get stabbed to death by a coat hanger in a back alley because your mom is a slut?
I know which way I'd prefer.
For me it‘s partly because we have a long history of men in government controlling women’s reproductive rights without much knowledge on the topic. I think women should absolutely be able to have the right to choice in the matter.
I also think that many abuse that right but regardless I do think they should still have it. I’m not too passionate on the matter either though.
I am also about to have a child so I’ve thought about it more recently. I certainly have come a lot closer to siding with the pro-life argument than I ever have before.
A heartbeat is evidence of life. Not necessarily human life. That’s a pretty massive distinction you’re missing.
And no, not all abortions are about inconvenience. Heck, the human body itself will “abort itself” if it senses something is wrong.
Many people do not think it is a human life. A fetus (that’s the word you are looking for, not “unborn baby”... medically, baby is post-birth) doesn’t always have a heart beat. And a heart beat doesn’t mean anything magical... it’s not like “Ah, a heart beat means it is sacred and holy and life!” You seem to be struggling with this idea, that not everyone agrees with you and that you might not be right.
We kills millions of animals every year for food and whathaveyou. Shelters kill more animals than can be counted.
Many of them have more “going on”, more awareness and life and caring and love, than this:
It’s a bad analogy. Try a different one.
You can say fetus all you want, but it's still an unborn baby.
And I love how you justify stopping a human heartbeat. Basically all anyone has said to rebut my comparison is that moral relativism is alive and well. Sad that we in a society where we don't even agree on what constitutes terminating a life. Pregnant women know that if that don't intervene at some point, it will undoubtedly be a human life. A baby has a unique DNA code at conception. Not the mother's DNA. Not the father's DNA. Not anyone else's. It's their own. And I'm not comparing human life to animal life. I'm comparing human life to human life - because, well, consistency matters.
Also, here's a pic of what a 7 week fetus looks like. It's much, much more developed than the images you are posting. That's at a stage when a women is more likely to have an abortion. And these unborn babies have a brain, a circulatory system, a heartbeat, hands, and feet. But sure, it only has value if the mother believes it to be so. Please.
My point is that if you value protecting human life, such as the elderly - you should also believe in protecting the most vulnerable, the ones who are completely defenseless.
That's a miscarriage, which is not intentional. An abortion is a calculated decision to terminate a beating heart. And the unborn baby has other elements to it - its own DNA, its own circulatory system, feet, hands, a brain. To terminate that is morally indefensible, IMO (outside of extreme circumstances).
@dukedevilz I’m genuinely curious, what do you think differentiates a human being from other mammals? Say, a squirrel. What makes a human a human?
Similar threads
