*Official* B1G Off-season Thread

[B-Westy]

Do you honestly think Edwards won’t be the only focus of a teams denfensice game plan? He’s going to be the main focus of every single team you play. You literally have no player that has shown they have the capability of taking over of Edwards gets slowed/shut down.

Who the hell is "shutting down" Edwards? The dude hits 24 foot threes with a hand in his face every game. You act as if good defense has stopped him from scoring before? The guy is going to get his either way. Yeah he might have some off nights but the guy is a hell of a talent and even being the focus of a defensive game plan can only do so much to stop him. And there are other guys around him who will capitalize on the opportunity if a team decides to "double team" Edwards for the entire game.

 

[NC_Trojan10]

Ok so now Freshman teams count? OK then Eastern and Haarms will make All Big Ten defense then. So in this instance Purdue > IU.

And give me experience in college basketball over the freshman sensation every damn time.

No one ever said they didnt? Eastern wont make the defensive team, but haarms probably will.

So with your college experience argument, you are saying you would take Cline over Romeo? Another classic take. Keep them coming, this is hilarious
RollLaugh

 

[theetommyt]

How many guys have averaged 23-25 points a game in the big 10 in the last 20 years?

 

[klize17]

How many guys have averaged 23-25 points a game in the big 10 in the last 20 years?

Not many if I had to guess

 

[NC_Trojan10]

How many guys have averaged 23-25 points a game in the big 10 in the last 20 years?

I dont think you are taking into account the fact that Edward's gets to play with Ryan Cline. Cline's presence alone on the court will boost Edward's to 25 ppg. Teams will be triple teaming Cline and that will allow Edward's to have an open shot whenever he wants it

 

[MileHighSpartan]

How many guys have averaged 23-25 points a game in the big 10 in the last 20 years?

Only 10 total players/seasons have averaged 23+ since 1985.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/conferences/big-ten/leaders/pts-per-g-player-season.html

 

[SNU0821]

Who the hell is "shutting down" Edwards? The dude hits 24 foot threes with a hand in his face every game. You act as if good defense has stopped him from scoring before? The guy is going to get his either way. Yeah he might have some off nights but the guy is a hell of a talent and even being the focus of a defensive game plan can only do so much to stop him. And there are other guys around him who will capitalize on the opportunity if a team decides to "double team" Edwards for the entire game.

Jesus Christ....

Who here said he wasn't a hell of a talent? Nobody. Good players get shut down. I'm assuming some teams will this year. It won't be a regular happening by any means, but odds are he's going to have bad games where he doesn't produce whether that's at the hands of the defense or because he doesn't shoot it. It happened last year.

You're now entering the realm of acting like Edwards is Michael Jordan or Lebron James or Kobe Bryant. He's not. He's a damn good college player, for sure, but even great players get shut down. Stop being you, Blaire. Come back down to reality a bit. Edwards is definitely going to put up points. Nobody is doubting that.

And those "other guys" around him aren't anyone that I would want to rely on to win games for me. Unproven middle of the road talent lacking experience. Color me skeptical.

 

[SNU0821]

Who the hell is "shutting down" Edwards? The dude hits 24 foot threes with a hand in his face every game. You act as if good defense has stopped him from scoring before? The guy is going to get his either way. Yeah he might have some off nights but the guy is a hell of a talent and even being the focus of a defensive game plan can only do so much to stop him. And there are other guys around him who will capitalize on the opportunity if a team decides to "double team" Edwards for the entire game.

By the way, I absolutely love this post. It points out just how delusional and easily triggered young Blaire is. LOL! Super Purdue fanboy out early this morning. Must have the early shift at McDonalds today...

 

[bMORE607]

 

[B-Westy]

No one ever said they didnt? Eastern wont make the defensive team, but haarms probably will.

So with your college experience argument, you are saying you would take Cline over Romeo? Another classic take. Keep them coming, this is hilarious
RollLaugh

Nah I'm saying Edwards over Romeo for sure. And why won't Eastern make All Defense?

 

[Jaycg15]

Painter or this coaching staff doesn’t usually publicly pump up players, but they’ve doing it all off-season with Cline. Saying he’s going to have a great season this year. And he’s been putting up good numbers in these intra-squad scrimmages. I’ll take a wait & see approach with it, but I tend to trust the eye of the coach going into his 15th year, rather than NC_Trojan.

Cline is not making an All Big Ten team.

 

[B-Westy]

Jesus Christ....
And those "other guys" around him aren't anyone that I would want to rely on to win games for me. Unproven middle of the road talent lacking experience. Color me skeptical.

I think the same about IU's team for sure then. Besides Morgan & Romeo, I don't expect unproven, middle of the road talent that is lacking experience from a 16 win team to help all that much.

 

[Da_Bull]

Tell me how you realistically, can double team ONE GUY throughout the course of a college basketball game. I'd love to see it. You really think that's a viable strategy?

If you were playing Purdue what would your game plan be? Play everyone straight up or would you plan to slow down Carsen and make the other unproven guys beat you?

 

[B-Westy]

Cline is not making an All Big Ten team.

That's fine. I never said he would.

 

[theetommyt]

Only 10 total players/seasons have averaged 23+ since 1985.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/conferences/big-ten/leaders/pts-per-g-player-season.html

0 in the last 20 years and only 9 since 85. Respert did it twice.

 

[B-Westy]

If you were playing Purdue what would your game plan be? Play everyone straight up or would you plan to slow down Carsen and make the other unproven guys beat you?

It sounds great in theory, and makes more sense in practice vs. a big guy like Haas or Swanigan, but I just don't see how it's realistic to expect your team to double team a guard out on the perimeter the whole game and expect to win.

 

[SNU0821]

Nah I'm saying Edwards over Romeo for sure. And why won't Eastern make All Defense?

Well, IU has two players with better than average chances of making an All B10 team (not counting Freshman team). Purdue has Edwards. Nobody else is a realistic shot, at this point, to make an All B10 team. If I had to pick, I would go with Haarms having the best chance out of the rest of the roster at Purdue. If he can knock down some mid range jumpers with consistency, he'll be pretty dangerous. But, haven't seen him be able to go get a bucket when the team needs it like Haas could do.

At the end of a game, if you're down a bucket. Edwards is going to get ALL of the attention. Who's gonna step up and go get a bucket? Who? Cline? Give me a break. Eastern? I'd back off him almost to the paint. So now you're left with Haarms and Eifert. Yeeeeeeesh.

 

[Da_Bull]

You've done it the past two years down playing Purdue's season.

Did it the year after Hammons left. Said Biggie wouldn't improve that much and the supporting cast wasn't great.

Did it last year when Biggie left. Said that since Biggie was gone, Edwards and Edwards would get all the attention and wouldn't be able to produce. And that Haas won't be able to be as effective without him. Yet they win a school record number of games and have a good season.

We do this every year. Everyone here knows you're the IU die-hard who can't look at their rival objectively.

Now you're sounding like Hail. "Beilein will take a 2* guy and turn him into an all american every single year because its happened before."

 

[SNU0821]

Cline is not making an All Big Ten team.

Not a chance in hell...

 

[otte21]

I'm still laughing at Carsen avg 25 pts/game. Do you not understand how many double teams he's going to have to fight through?

Idk if he’ll avg 25, that’s a lot of points for anyone at the college level but I do think it’s realisitic. I would guess 22 per game though. Doubling a perimeter guard that can also drive the ball isn’t really viable at the college level. In high school you can, sure but not in the big ten. It isn’t like doubling Happ down low at Wiscy and make the others beat you.

 

[SNU0821]

I think the same about IU's team for sure then. Besides Morgan & Romeo, I don't expect unproven, middle of the road talent that is lacking experience from a 16 win team to help all that much.

Buuuuuuuut. We've got a lot more returning than Purdue does. We also have an instant impact guy, one and done, recruit coming in. Morgan what 2nd team last year. He's going to be one of the better players in the league this year as will (should) Romeo. So, when you look at all that, it's not hard to see how IU will be better this year.

 

[Da_Bull]

It sounds great in theory, and makes more sense in practice vs. a big guy like Haas or Swanigan, but I just don't see how it's realistic to expect your team to double team a guard out on the perimeter the whole game and expect to win.

I still think he's going to get his pts but it won't be 25/game

 

[B-Westy]

Well, IU has two players with better than average chances of making an All B10 team (not counting Freshman team). Purdue has Edwards. Nobody else is a realistic shot, at this point, to make an All B10 team. If I had to pick, I would go with Haarms having the best chance out of the rest of the roster at Purdue. If he can knock down some mid range jumpers with consistency, he'll be pretty dangerous. But, haven't seen him be able to go get a bucket when the team needs it like Haas could do.

At the end of a game, if you're down a bucket. Edwards is going to get ALL of the attention. Who's gonna step up and go get a bucket? Who? Cline? Give me a break. Eastern? I'd back off him almost to the paint. So now you're left with Haarms and Eifert. Yeeeeeeesh.

Yes. If Cline is open for a three at the end of the game, I'd love for him to take that shot. He's hit huge shots for Purdue in the past and I wouldn't mind at all if he took an open shot to win a game.

Northwestern last year, Pitt his freshman year. He's hit big shots in his career on limited minutes. Can't wait to see what he does w/ 30 MPG.

 

[B-Westy]

I still think he's going to get his pts but it won't be 25/game

That's fine. I never argued he would average 25. I'm thinking in the realm of 19-21.

 

[theetommyt]

I still think he's going to get his pts but it won't be 25/game

Yeah we're talking about something so rare it hasn't happened once since Kevin Garnet was drafted.

 

[Da_Bull]

Idk if he’ll avg 25 but I do think it’s realisitic. Doubling a perimeter guard that can also drive the ball isn’t really viable at the college level. In high school you can, sure but not in the big ten. It isn’t like doubling Happ down low at Wiscy and make the others beat you.

I'm just saying if you're a coach game planning for Purdue, your prime focus is knowing and hounding Carsen.

 

[SNU0821]

It sounds great in theory, and makes more sense in practice vs. a big guy like Haas or Swanigan, but I just don't see how it's realistic to expect your team to double team a guard out on the perimeter the whole game and expect to win.

Look at Oklahoma and Trey Young. See how well they did with a prolific scorer and no supporting cast. Something like 18-13. BUT Trey Young got his. Real awesome.

 

[B-Westy]

Buuuuuuuut. We've got a lot more returning than Purdue does. We also have an instant impact guy, one and done, recruit coming in. Morgan what 2nd team last year. He's going to be one of the better players in the league this year as will (should) Romeo. So, when you look at all that, it's not hard to see how IU will be better this year.

Returning what? Players from a 16 win team? How is that better than what Purdue returns?

 

[Jaycg15]

That's fine. I never said he would.

You said he has "a good shot". That's not accurate at all. He averaged 4 ppg last season. He's a complimentary player. Those guys rarely make All-Big teams, so I think the better descriptor would be "he doesn't really have a shot, but could surprise everyone."

 

[otte21]

I'm just saying if you're a coach game planning for Purdue, your prime focus is knowing and hounding Carsen.

Yeah but how are you doing it? Most likely just putting your best defender on him and telling others to make sure they get help side or hedge on ball screens. You can’t play box and 1 at the college level or try to double a perimeter player.

 

[B-Westy]

I'm just saying if you're a coach game planning for Purdue, your prime focus is knowing and hounding Carsen.

They wanted to hound Biggie and he still put up absurd numbers. It's college basketball here. This isn't the NBA where you're playing elite athletes night in and night out. There are 4 other scholarship players on the floor with Carsen. I'd gladly take my chances against a team that wants to double Carsen all game. Sounds like an awful strategy to me.

 

[B-Westy]

You said he has "a good shot". That's not accurate at all. He averaged 4 ppg last season. He's a complimentary player. Those guys rarely make All-Big teams, so I think the better descriptor would be "he doesn't really have a shot, but could surprise everyone."

That's fair. Like I said before, the "All Big Ten" benchmark for a team's success doesn't make much sense. Plenty of guys can contribute to a winning team and not be All Big Ten.

 

[NC_Trojan10]

Nah I'm saying Edwards over Romeo for sure. And why won't Eastern make All Defense?

I never said Romeo over Edwards? However, Romeo would far and away be your 2nd best player.

 

[SNU0821]

Yes. If Cline is open for a three at the end of the game, I'd love for him to take that shot. He's hit huge shots for Purdue in the past and I wouldn't mind at all if he took an open shot to win a game.

Northwestern last year, Pitt his freshman year. He's hit big shots in his career on limited minutes. Can't wait to see what he does w/ 30 MPG.

Cline is Ryne Smith. Nothing more. He's not even close to Mathias.

 

[Da_Bull]

They wanted to hound Biggie and he still put up absurd numbers. It's college basketball here. This isn't the NBA where you're playing elite athletes night in and night out. There are 4 other scholarship players on the floor with Carsen. I'd gladly take my chances against a team that wants to double Carsen all game. Sounds like an awful strategy to me.

Best ball defender on Carsen, hedge screens. Doubeling a big body like Biggie vs a guard is quite different. Again my argument was against 25pts/g.

 

[Jaycg15]

Returning what? Players from a 16 win team? How is that better than what Purdue returns?

I think most people are pretty high on what IU is returning. Right or wrong, there's 1 player on PU's roster that is a stud, and a few others with a chance to become pretty good this season. Again, not bagging on PU, but your roster is unproven this season. You're getting a lot of credence because Painter does well fitting guys in his system.

IU is bringing in a talented class to add to a strong core of players. It's not surefire, but it's not hard to see why people are predicting IU to take a step forward and PU to take a step back.

 

[SNU0821]

Returning what? Players from a 16 win team? How is that better than what Purdue returns?

Experience and production. Not hard, really. Add in they were learning a completely different system offensively and defensively, and it's not hard to understand some inconsistency last year. But, we get you're not that great with logic and reasoning.

 

[Jaycg15]

That's fair. Like I said before, the "All Big Ten" benchmark for a team's success doesn't make much sense. Plenty of guys can contribute to a winning team and not be All Big Ten.

Not disagreeing with that. It's not a good way of evaluating players.

 

[B-Westy]

Cline is Ryne Smith. Nothing more. He's not even close to Mathias.

And if Cline has a senior season like Smith, I won't be disappointed. I'll take around 10 PPG w/ 2.5 made threes a game. That works for me.

 

[NC_Trojan10]

It sounds great in theory, and makes more sense in practice vs. a big guy like Haas or Swanigan, but I just don't see how it's realistic to expect your team to double team a guard out on the perimeter the whole game and expect to win.

You dont double team them the whole time. You trap ball screens. When there is no screen, you have the on ball defender play up in Edwards. When Carsen drives by that defender you have another defender there to force Carsen to make a pass. It's simple defensive strategy. It's not like they are going to double him every time he touches the ball. You just force him to give up the ball.

When he gets tired of passing, he will start to force contested shots. Both are wins for the defense.