Gotcha. Wasn't sure what you meant earlier. I wasn't commenting on any school in particular . . . just the size of our posts.
New thread because New Bombshell tweets
- Thread starter HRTheCard
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Oh yeah I'm on the same page with you know.
My post was just the actual full texts of what was put forth as evidence in court. Didn't know if anyone had seen those yet. Decided to copy and paste so people didn't have to click the link.
Vorrect, no money was mentioned, but you can read between the lines. They aren't dumb enough to literally say on text: "Hey Bill, are you good with me paying DeSousa ONE MILLION DOLLARS (#movie reference for comedy), are you good with that"
Self: "hell yeah Stevie, pay him, lemme know if you come up short, I'll chip in a couple thousand dollars"
It's just not going to be that obvious.
But, you and Schooner could very well be right, maybe it's not about money.
I've never once said I don't believe Self and them didn't know about the money. I've said several times that they probably at least had a good idea on what was going on. You know "wink wink nudge nudge". What I'm saying is those text messages don't prove a damn thing and can be explained as other reasons such as working on getting Adidas for the Angolan team.
I agree with you, but you can see how it looks like money is could be exchanging hands right?
Oh absolutely. That's where the "you can read between the lines" comes into play that I said too.
Well, I hope it's not true. I've never had an issue with Self. I think he's a good dude and I'd hate to see his reputation tarnished for something he never needed to do.
Hell, we deal with a negative reputation put on Calipari due to the transgressions of two players. He didn't cheat, but that's not the narrative.
CBB needs K, Cal, Roy and Self in my opinion.
Kentucky fans were the loudest Calipari accusers until literally the day he was hired by Kentucky. They pulled a 180 overnight.
I think we all know that these players are getting paid. Ayton was paid, De Sousa, Zion, Adebayo, etc, etc, etc. Let's not kid ourselves. Wishing it weren't true doesn't make it reality.
The only thing in question is the involvement of respective coaches. But to assume that coaches are completely ignorant or uninvolved is naive.
See, this is the definition of a troll post. Totally unnecessary.
Yeah, okay, every single UK fan screamed out loud about how crooked Calipari was when he was at Memphis. Yup, every single one.
I have admitted that I thought he was slimy, but I was wrong. I questioned the hire and thought it might bite UK in the ass, but Cal has been an incredible ambassador for UK and has taken UK to another level. I was wrong about him. No doubt about it. He's a terrific person.
However, it's easy to sling mud at Self right now, but did I do that? No I didn't.
Take your agenda somewhere else.
how is that different then any other discussion people have with you
You’re the expert on that
You say this like its an insult. UK fans are die hard. We hate coaches until we steal them. It's not hard to understand.
If your coach is winning more than us, then we're coming after them. And we got him. Eat it.
Since then Calpari>Self.
So do you actually think no Kentucky players are paid, or do you think Calipari is completely ignorant to it?
I mean, I've talked to a former AAU coach. I already know how this shit works and how prevalent it is. He was very clear and open about it. And it's gone on for a long time.
No, I don't think Calipari or UK is paying players. I just don't. The UK compliant office, headed up by Sandy Bell, doesn't play and there's simply no reason for Cal to put everything on the line just to pay a player.
Until there is actual proof that it's happening, I'd be a real ass if I accused him, or anyone, of being a cheater. I think it's crap to assume someone is cheating or paying players when there's absolutely nothing that proves it's happening.
But I get that people like you would think that way.
Haha. What? You had entire posts about how he only played DeSousa last year because he didn’t think he’d get caught. You also were pushing the agenda that Self and crew are orchestrating payments to recruits in order to get them to play at KU in order to keep up with UK, Duke, UNC and Nova. You may not think that’s mud slinging but you were throwing those statements around like they were fact. Those facts were nothing but your own opinions with nothing really to back them other than your own suspicions. It wasn’t until a few back and forths with me and Big C that you started changing your tune.
First of all, I was referring to the post that MrBaracus quoted. Go back and read what I said in that post.
Second of all, you and I disagree on how we are viewing those text messages, it's not slinging mud when it looks like it's the truth.
Slinging mud is what has been said about Cslipari since Rose and Camby made their bad decisions. Since then, rival fans have called the guy a cheater and a slime ball and most still do. THAT is slinging mud. There's a difference.
Well, I mean it’s been pretty well established here that he knew about both Camby and Rose then bolted from both jobs when the getting was good. That’s fine and all but just own up to it as a fan of his.
No, he didn't know about either issue. But I'm not going to hijack this thread going over it with you because you're butthurt about what's going on with KU and this FBI case.
That’s not what I heard. Regardless, he left two programs in shambles so he deserves everything that’s thrown his way.
Why don't you go ahead and post what you heard buddy. I'll be right here waiting for you to do so.
This should be good. You're going to end up on an island all by yourself if you try to continue with this lie.
Listen pal, I’ve already told you what I’ve heard. I’m not gonna go back and look up something that happened 10 years/20 years ago.
And there’s nothing wrong with having a dirty coach. Self is dirty and I’ll root for him to succeed at Kansas until the end. What he does to succeed doesn’t affect my life whatsoever other than him winning makes me happy. Just wish others would acknowledge that their own coaches have done dirty things too.
Oh no, no you freaking don't. You don't get off the hook that easy.
I told you to drop it, but you didn't. You know damn well how this shit works. Now I'm calling your ass out.
IDGAF how many years ago it happened, it's not like the internet is that hard to navigate. Even if it happened a hundred years ago it is still the same effort.
Either own up to lying, or provide a link that proves your point, which was that Calipari knew about Rose and Camby's transgressions before the NCAA did.
Here's a hint, you won't find anything that supports your claim. So own up to your lie.
The internet is impossible to navigate sometimes. Just google John Calipari is a cheater and it’s probably 700 pages of crap written by Kentucky fans. I never click past page one on anything I google.
Idk anything about Camby. Don't know anything about whether Cal was involved in getting Rose eligible. I do know that Cal and Memphis were guilty of concealing Rose's questionable SAT scores from the NCAA. This was a big reason (along with Memphis lying to the NCAA and Rose not cooperating with the NCAA investigation) why Memphis had to vacate that entire season.
Idk about Cal cheating or anything. It just always looked bad on his part that he bailed shortly before or after his schools were put on probation.
No no, I'm not doing your flipping work for you. Are you helpless or something?
You're the one saying he knew, you put your foot in your mouth and I'm not letting you just walk away from this.
You're full of crap and you went too far. Post a link or admit you lied.
Would you bolt from being a fry cook at McD's to being the CEO of a Forbes top 100 company? He'd look worse if he stayed at that shithole when Camelot was offering him a job.
And let's be honest - the NCAA does whatever the fvck they want. If you're going to judge a coach or a program based on how they've been rightly or wrongly punished in the past, then you're a fool. The NCAA is trash, and so many of you use their rulings to back your arguments.
Definitely not wrong about that. UMass to NBA then Memphis to UK. Definite upgrades. But tarnished his image some with leaving shortly after that. Always made him appear like he's bailing on tough situations. Whether right or wrong It's a all about perception.
This. And 1 thing is for certain is there punishments will be extremely inconsistent from school to school. Also can guarantee that no one will end up happy with what the NCAA decides for any school.
Untrue.
Cal and Memphis weren't guilty of anything. It was Rose. He refused to talk to the NCAA, the NCAA told him to retake the SAT or you will be deemed ineligible. Rose declined to take the test.
This article doesn’t go into the specifics with regard to the correspondence between Rose and the NCAA, but you get the point. This is just the first story that came up on Google.
I'm in disbelief, I thought these were well known facts.
Calipari was not charged with a single thing in either case (Rose or Camby):
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/news/story?id=4412279
Memphis must vacate its NCAA-record 2007-08 season and serve three years' probation because of NCAA rules violations, the NCAA committee on infractions announced Thursday.
Under former coach John Calipari, Memphis won a record 38 games that season and reached the NCAA championship game.
Memphis president Shirley Raines said shortly after the NCAA's announcement that the school is appealing what she called an unfair penalty.
"We know the rules," Raines said. "We did our due diligence. We did everything we could to determine the student-athlete was eligible and that the rules were being followed."
In May, the NCAA accused Memphis of several major infractions under Calipari, including a fraudulent SAT score by a player, later revealed to be Derrick Rose, and providing close to $1,700 in free travel to Rose's brother, Reggie.
Paul Dee, the chairman for the committee on infractions, said in a teleconference that even though Memphis was not aware of Rose's questionable test score until midway through his freshman year, once the score was invalidated by Educational Testing Service, Rose no longer met the initial eligibility standards.
"This is a situation of strict liability," Dee said. "If he is ineligible and does not meet initial requirements, the penalties are related back to that time and a determination is then made: Did he play in any contests after the fact? In this case, he did."
Calipari was not penalized because he was never included in the original notice of allegations, Dee said. But Dee did stress that vacating the record books carries with it an implied punishment.
Calipari is the first head coach to have vacated Final Four appearances with two different schools. His 1996 Massachusetts team met the same fate because of NCAA rule violations, even though Calipari was not implicated in that instance, either. Memphis also suffered the same fate in 1985, when it was stripped of its NCAA tournament appearance then because of rules violations.
Dee said: "Whenever records are vacated, that is a strong indication that there was a problem. Because there were no allegations against the coach, we did not consider any, but whenever you have a situation that affects a team's record or an individual's personal record, it will have an impact on that individual."
Though hit with a failure-to-monitor charge, Memphis will escape a postseason ban or loss of scholarships.
However, the university will be on probation until 2012.
"That means the university is on heightened review," Dee said of the probation. "Probably the most important thing about probation is once a school goes on probation, if they commit another major violation within five years, they are subject to a special review and substantially harsher penalties."
In addition to the lost season, Memphis must return to Conference USA the 2008 NCAA tournament money it received. The Tigers' Final Four run ended with an overtime loss to Kansas in the championship game.
Memphis also will be prevented from receiving future shares doled out in the conference's revenue-sharing program -- a total loss estimated at $530,000 on top of the $85,000 already paid by the school. If Memphis loses its appeal, athletic director R.C. Johnson said approximately $300,000 in bonus money Calipari earned from that season would be paid back.
Josh Pastner, who did not have knowledge of the NCAA investigation when he joined Calipari's staff before last season, said he has spoken with his recruits and that none will back out of their commitments.
"The bottom line is there's so much to look forward to with the current team and the future of this team," Pastner told ESPN.com following the NCAA's announcement. "There are no loss of scholarships, no effect on the future of our program. We are on the same level playing field as every other team in the country."
Despite his optimism, Pastner, who had no head-coaching experience when he succeeded Calipari, acknowledged that vacating its Final Four run would have an effect on the program.
"There are no bullets dodged here," he said. "It still hurts. I wasn't here, but it affects a lot of student-athletes, coaches, university officials and fans. There's still a ruling that came down against us, and even though it's in the past and I wasn't here, it still involves the university and I'm part of [this] university."
Memphis originally received the notice of allegations on Jan. 16 and appeared before the committee in June. The primary academic allegation against Rose is that someone stood in for him and took the SAT that Rose was supposed to take, even though the NCAA Eligibility Center later cleared Rose to play.
In its report, the NCAA did not identify the ineligible player as Rose. He was taken by the Chicago Bulls as the No. 1 pick in the 2008 draft and went on to win the NBA Rookie of the Year award.
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