New thread because New Bombshell tweets

[ndesgeorges]

I doubt any school or program is completely clean once you get down to the individual player level. It is naive to think otherwise.

I don't think most schools are tossing around $100k to their top recruits though. I think thats probably reserved for players actively seeking it, and the programs willing to play ball. But it doesn't take $100k to commit a NCAA infraction. Kids get free meals, tattoo's etc... probably pretty much everywhere.

I agree that the schools arent directly involved as much as I may look like I am arguing that. There has to be a layer between and they do have compliance offices to get around. Less people that know things or are involved the better. However, those infractions are not what I am really referring to cheating wise. Even if you disregard agents/shoe cos and just looked at people tangentially connected to schools, I think the level of cheating would blow your average fan away..ie local boosters, local PDs, car dealers

 

[kyjeff1]

Well, in recent years Kentucky hasn't been kicking anybody's ass but that's not relevant here.

You know Kansas hasn't been proven to have done anything wrong at this point, right? I mean there's a lot there to suggest that they knew about dirty stuff going on but we have no evidence that Self and staff directed anything. What we do know for sure is that players are getting paid at the AAU level by shoe companies in order to steer them to certain schools. It's very naive to assume that it's not happening with players trying to go to schools like UK, Duke and UNC and it's very naive to assume that the coaches at these schools aren't aware that it's happening.

I've said for years that everybody is dirty and I still believe that. I think that most coaches are aware of this happening at the high school levl but do nothing about it because they know they need those guys in order to win and keep their jobs. That's dirty and since they do nothing about it they're contributing to the problem. That's just my opinion though.

Why do you assume everyone is dirty? What have you personally witnessed to say that?

As far as your questions to me about KU in paragraph 2, come on man, it's not looking good and if the roles were reversed and it was Cal/UK, you would be positive that Cal/UK was crooked.

Calipari, Roy and K can't hide man, they can't. There are too many people watching every move they make and on top of that, Calipari, for whatever reason, is on thin ice. His reputation is that of a cheater because two kids made terrible decisions and put Cal in that position to defend them.

Rose let Cal take the fall while he refused to answer questions. But Cal can't cheat, if he does, he's done in college basketball.

Why would K and Roy ruin the reputations they have built?

 

[kyjeff1]

I had friends who played D1 sports at multiple schools (one was a girls tennis player who had a surprising amount of shadiness around her recruitment) and a family member who played AAU ball and stayed connected for a while. I was told some general things about the Bagleys, and thats as specific as I was ever told. I have very little inside knowledge of specifics, but can also fill in some blanks using basic logic. Have you ever been to an AAU event? It really doesnt take much insider info or connections to get an idea. Pay attention to some "insiders" comments on Twitter surrounding this trial.

I know it seems easier to just believe elite player A choose elite school A over B because A had a more at "home" feel or whatever it is, and I probably wont ever change your mind, which is fine

Well, you're going to believe what you're going to believe, but I choose to believe that the coaches at the top 4 or 5 programs, with the exception of Self now, don't need to cheat. When you put kids in the NBA and you have standards that you follow, you don't need to pull any stupid stunts to land stud players.

 

[KYtotheCore]

.

 

[Global Havok]

Well, in recent years Kentucky hasn't been kicking anybody's ass but that's not relevant

?? Since Cal has been at UK, hes been to 6 elite eights, 4 final fours, two championship games and has a national title. What?

 

[ndesgeorges]

Well, you're going to believe what you're going to believe, but I choose to believe that the coaches at the top 4 or 5 programs, with the exception of Self now, don't need to cheat. When you put kids in the NBA and you have standards that you follow, you don't need to pull any stupid stunts to land stud players.

And thats fine that you believe that. Hopefully those schools or your school never gets implicated like others have (its not fun lol). I just dont know how you can look at the Zion news plus everything else and still hold that belief, but you do you.

 

[kyjeff1]

And thats fine that you believe that. Hopefully those schools or your school never gets implicated like others have (its not fun lol). I just dont know how you can look at the Zion news and still hold that belief, but you do you.

I'll admit it is tough to look at the Zion stuff and say that Duke is clean, but I would be stunned if K paid the kid.
However, I wouldn't put it past Capel.

 

[ravenman10]

What’s hilarious is that there are two more trials and people are still confident without a shadow of a doubt that their school did no wrong.

I’m telling you now, nothing has been PROVEN about Kansas knowing players were paid. In fact!! Kansas has shown the willingness to sit players that are found to have violated the rules. Rule violations uncovered the by school itself and shared with the NCAA. Kansas found out about Preston and Alexander and sat their butt. But now they are willing to overlook Silvio De Sousa????? Seriously?? Use logic people.


But to sit on a soap box slinging dung at Kansas and act like other schools are clean is just plain dumb and naive. If I’m a fan of ANY high level school attracting elite talent, I’m super eager to see what comes out in April. I’d take bets with anyone on this board that the other top schools come into play sooner than later.

“My coach doesn’t need to cheat because we are so great.” Haha, give me a break. This thread should be pinned so you all can come back and eat crow when the dirty underbelly of NCAA basketball is revealed next year.

You don’t think these assistant coaches that got canned are going to have some good dirt to throw around? Don’t be so obtuse.

 

[ndesgeorges]

I'll admit it is tough to look at the Zion stuff and say that Duke is clean, but I would be stunned if K paid the kid.
However, I wouldn't put it past Capel.

Thats the thing..im not really differentiating between who is doing what. I dont think K or Cal is sitting there ordering bags of money for recruits

 

[kl40504]

Yep. Told my wife the exact thing. Why would a kid pass on $100K, and go play somewhere else for free? It would be quite naive to think your school, COULDN"T be involved.

IU has to be dirty with all those top recruits they have been getting.

 

[HRTheCard]

That's a bold statement to make. You've said it a couple of times now this week. You have no idea what all goes involved with any of those schools so I'm not sure why you say this with such confidence.

Because it is stuck in their thick minded skulls that "Everyone hates us including the FBI and NCAA and they watch Cal like a hawk so if something was bad it would've already came out."

 

[kyjeff1]

What’s hilarious is that there are two more trials and people are still confident without a shadow of a doubt that their school did no wrong.

I’m telling you now, nothing has been PROVEN about Kansas knowing players were paid. In fact!! Kansas has shown the willingness to sit players that are found to have violated the rules. Rule violations uncovered the by school itself and shared with the NCAA. Kansas found out about Preston and Alexander and sat their butt. But now they are willing to overlook Silvio De Sousa????? Seriously?? Use logic people.


But to sit on a soap box slinging dung at Kansas and act like other schools are clean is just plain dumb and naive. If I’m a fan of ANY high level school attracting elite talent, I’m super eager to see what comes out in April. I’d take bets with anyone on this board that the other top schools come into play sooner than later.

“My coach doesn’t need to cheat because we are so great.” Haha, give me a break. This thread should be pinned so you all can come back and eat crow when the dirty underbelly of NCAA basketball is revealed next year.

You don’t think these assistant coaches that got canned are going to have some good dirt to throw around? Don’t be so obtuse.

Kansas sat players when they knew others knew about transgressions. DeSousa played, but that's because Self didn't think he would get caught.
I dont understand why you KU fans are trying so hard to defend Self. If the information we have is true and why wouldn't it be? Self is guilty.

 

[IUfanBorden]

IU has to be dirty with all those top recruits they have been getting.

Agree, 100%.

BTW, what top recruits are you speaking of?

 

[schoonerwest]

?? Since Cal has been at UK, hes been to 6 elite eights, 4 final fours, two championship games and has a national title. What?

I said in recent years. They haven’t been to a Final Four in 4 years this upcoming season. Still elite obviously.

Also, I was kind of taking a quick jab. Winking

 

[schoonerwest]

Kansas sat players when they knew others knew about transgressions. DeSousa played, but that's because Self didn't think he would get caught.
I dont understand why you KU fans are trying so.hard to defend Self. If the information we have is true and why wouldn't it be? Self is guilty.

What is with you and these giant assumptions that you state like they’re a fact?

 

[kyjeff1]

Because it is stuck in their thick minded skulls that "Everyone hates us including the FBI and NCAA and they watch Cal like a hawk so if something was bad it would've already came out."

Do you post about anything other than UK and UK fans?
I take that back, you are all over Mack's junk, but when you aren't posting Chris Mack love notes you're trying to sling mud at UK fans. Are you that ate up by UK?
So there is a segment of UK fans that think the NCAA is out to get UK, all fanbases have those fans and don't even try to say UL doesn't because we all know better.
Heck, even Cornfly talked about UNC being a target of the NCAA. Seriously, a UNC fan thinks the NCAA is out to get them.
But whatever, keep up with your agenda. It's what gets you off I guess.

 

[HRTheCard]

You all gotta admit that Calipari is under more scrutiny than just about any other coach and he’s at a program with the resources to get good players with out cheating. Not hard to believe at all that he hasn’t cheated at UK due to scrutiny.

I mean when he answers like this of course he's going to get scrutiny. The reason why Uk fans thinks that everyone's out to get them is because your own coach does!

https://www.cbssports.com/college-b...calipari-is-not-happy-to-be-playing-in-idaho/

and the most important



RollLaugh



Gahhhh! Kentucky vs the world!!!!!! Good lord.

 

[kyjeff1]

What is with you and these giant assumptions that you state like they’re a fact?

What's it look like to you?
If what we heard is correct, Self knew… .check that, Self asked to pay a recruit. Yet he played De Sousa.
So what does it look like to you?

 

[kyjeff1]

I mean when he answers like this of course he's going to get scrutiny. The reason why Uk fans thinks that everyone's out to get them is because your own coach does!

https://www.cbssports.com/college-b...calipari-is-not-happy-to-be-playing-in-idaho/

and the most important

View embedded media

RollLaugh



Gahhhh! Kentucky vs the world!!!!!! Good lord.

Ha ha, yeah, Pitino has gone away quietly. Hypocrite much?

 

[KYtotheCore]

thick minded skulls

 

[Dattier]

You literally, just restated what I have said...

You've insisted Duke was mentioned. M-E-N-T-I-O-N-E-D. "MENTIONED." "Mentioned," as in, someone included them by name in some official legal doc.
I'm thinking you're one of the last people I'd consider an authority on "literally."

I didn't insinuate anything. I already said I don't think Duke cheated. Read the damn thread before you start pulling stuff out of your backside.

Ummm... I refer back to your poor grasp of "literally": As you were insisting something that literally didn't happen did indeed literally happen, the only option left is that you did indeed insinuate it, whether you meant to or not.

 

[Global Havok]

You've insisted Duke was mentioned. M-E-N-T-I-O-N-E-D. "MENTIONED." "Mentioned," as in, someone included them by name in some official legal doc.
I'm thinking you're one of the last people I'd consider an authority on "literally."


Ummm... I refer back to your poor grasp of "literally": As you were insisting something that literally didn't happen did indeed literally happen, the only option left is that you did indeed insinuate it, whether you meant to or not.

Yes, Duke was mentioned. I've also said UK was mentioned. Both via players that went through our program, not by university name. It is a fact. Why so butthurt over a mundane detail?

 

[ExitFlagger]

Well, in recent years Kentucky hasn't been kicking anybody's ass but that's not relevant here.

You know Kansas hasn't been proven to have done anything wrong at this point, right? I mean there's a lot there to suggest that they knew about dirty stuff going on but we have no evidence that Self and staff directed anything. What we do know for sure is that players are getting paid at the AAU level by shoe companies in order to steer them to certain schools. It's very naive to assume that it's not happening with players trying to go to schools like UK, Duke and UNC and it's very naive to assume that the coaches at these schools aren't aware that it's happening.

I've said for years that everybody is dirty and I still believe that. I think that most coaches are aware of this happening at the high school levl but do nothing about it because they know they need those guys in order to win and keep their jobs. That's dirty and since they do nothing about it they're contributing to the problem. That's just my opinion though.

I've talked to a former AAU coach. He was very open and direct about it. Of course it's everywhere.

It's going to turn some people's worlds upside down when the FBI finds its way to Nike. RollLaugh

 

[schoonerwest]

What's it look like to you?
If what we heard is correct, Self knew… .check that, Self asked to pay a recruit. Yet he played De Sousa.
So what does it look like to you?

I’ve already said he looks guilty. I said he was dirty years before this even started. But nothing we’ve heard this past week is definitive proof. Not yet.

Also, what you’re referring to was the closing arguments by the defense attorney. That’s hardly evidence of anything. They’re trying to win a case. Attorneys can help me out though if I’m wrong.

If the NCAA does its own investigation based on what comes from these trials then I might be concerned.

 

[Kevin Bryan]

A little last day BOOM goes the dynamite on Self and co. That's gonna hurt.

 

[kyjeff1]

I’ve already said he looks guilty. I said he was dirty years before this even started. But nothing we’ve heard this past week is definitive proof. Not yet.

Also, what you’re referring to was the closing arguments by the defense attorney. That’s hardly evidence of anything. They’re trying to win a case. Attorneys can help me out though if I’m wrong.

If the NCAA does its own investigation based on what comes from these trials then I might be concerned.

Didn't think we needed definitive proof to make a statement based on what was said in a court of law.
I don't care if the defense attorney stated those facts during his opening argument or closing argument, doesn't matter, he said it and he obviously has proof.
Know why I say that? Because if that attorney made that statement on record in court and it's not true, he's going to find himself on the wrong side of a slander suit.
So given that, I'm going to believe it's true. And if.it is true, that means Self played DeSousa knowing he paid him and if that's the case, he played him on the belief that he wasn't going to get caught.

 

[Kevin Bryan]

I damn sure wouldn't play Keldon J0hnson (if I was Calipari) in this scenario, until the NCAA told me I could and even then you're not safe.

NCAA would say, "you're good, Derrick Rose"... then retroactively say "just kiddin'".

 

[kyjeff1]

NCAA would say, "you're good, Derrick Rose"... then retroactively say "just kiddin'".

Yeah, only that "Just kidding" would come after the season was over.

 

[Kevin Bryan]

Yeah, only that "Just kidding" would come after the season was over.

That was my point, hence the "retroactively".

 

[schoonerwest]

Didn't think we needed definitive proof to make a statement based on what was said in a court of law.
I don't care if the defense attorney stated those facts during his opening argument or closing argument, doesn't matter, he said it and he obviously has proof.
Know why I say that? Because if that attorney made that statement on record in court and it's not true, he's going to find himself on the wrong side of a slander suit.
So given that, I'm going to believe it's true. And if.it is true, that means Self played DeSousa knowing he paid him and if that's the case, he played him on the belief that he wasn't going to get caught.

That’s been discussed on our homeboard all day. Self suing for slander I mean. Smarter people than me say that is something he DOES NOT want to do, for reasons that don’t have anything to do with him being possibly guilty.

 

[Quavarius]

I don't recall the entire Bam story, but it didn't involve him or his family. Think it was his AAU coach? His eligibility isn't in question with what came out.

RollLaugh

 

[Global Havok]

RollLaugh

What part of that would you like to refute? I'll be happy to admit if was wrong.
From what I recall, they paid his coach to try and convince him to go to NC State. And Bam obviously didn't listen to him, or benefit from it in anyway. Why would that jeopardize his eligibility?

 

[Global Havok]

RollLaugh

https://www.courier-journal.com/sto...er-agent-stephen-pina-yahoo-sports/398267002/

Must have been thinking of someone else. If they prove he took the money, we should forfeit the games he played in. No biggie.

 

[kyjeff1]

That’s been discussed on our homeboard all day. Self suing for slander I mean. Smarter people than me say that is something he DOES NOT want to do, for reasons that don’t have anything to do with him being possibly guilty.

Okay, so you're telling me that people on your home board are assuming the attorney is lying about Self's text messages about authorizing paying players and you're fine with their assumptions, but you're upset with me because I'm choosing to believe what the attorney stated? Do I have that correct?
What's more far fetched to you:
-The attorney has solid proof (text messages) that Self authorized a shoe rep pay Desousa
Or
-The attorney lied about the text messages and said something that would get him sued for slander?

Option A for me. I would be shocked if that attorney lied about that and opened himself up to a slender suit. Attorney's know better.

 

[Quavarius]

What part of that would you like to refute? I'll be happy to admit if was wrong.
From what I recall, they paid his coach to try and convince him to go to NC State. And Bam obviously didn't listen to him, or benefit from it in anyway. Why would that jeopardize his eligibility?

Bam was mentioned. Bam went to Kentucky. What don’t you get?

 

[schoonerwest]

Okay, so you're telling me that people on your home board are assuming the attorney is lying about Self's text messages about authorizing paying players and you're fine with their assumptions, but you're upset with me because I'm choosing to believe what the attorney stated? Do I have that correct?
What's more far fetched to you:
-The attorney has solid proof (text messages) that Self authorized a shoe rep pay Desousa
Or
-The attorney lied about the text messages and said something that would get him sued for slander?

Option A for me. I would be shocked if that attorney lied about that and opened himself up to a slender suit. Attorney's know better.

I’m not a Carolina fan. I’m not gonna get into one of these long discussions with you. Enjoy your evening.

 

[Global Havok]

Bam was mentioned. Bam went to Kentucky. What don’t you get?

Am I in the Twilight Zone right now? I said Kentucky was mentioned. I get it. Apparently you, still, do not.

 

[Dattier]

Yes, Duke was mentioned...via players...not by university name. It is a fact.

 

[Kevin Bryan]

Stop arguing about what programs were mentioned by name. Who gives a shit? It's petty banter. You all have been going on about it for like 3 or 4 pages. Leave it alone and get back on track.

 

[Global Havok]

Laughing See the post above yours. It is not a big deal. It's okay guys, I've said about 10 times so far I don't think Duke actually cheated. And I said at least once I don't think Zion even got paid by anyone.