Is the Summit the biggest news this offseason?
- Thread starter lurkeraspect84
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Think of it in terms of hunger. If someone is starving, they may know that stealing food is wrong, but if they have no other means, that's what they're going to do. When the alternative is starving to death, how much sense does it make to focus on the law? If our entire process about it begins and ends w/ "IT'S ILLEGAL," it does nothing to change circumstances moving forward.
Should have went with that one first instead of:
Healthcare: Don't get sick?
Poverty: Don't be poor?
Immigration: Be born here?
Rape: Don't wear short skirts?
Racism: Go back to Africa?
I was illustrating the extremism and short-sightedness of the canned, kneejerk response, but okay. You understand where I'm coming from now?
Not once have I suggested that there is not a problem. That is very dishonest of you.
Though it is unlikely to get through the democrats, the GOP essentially agreed, and Trump has promised to sign a bill that would immediately end the separation of families. I hope that if and when the democrats turn the bill down, Trump uses the executive order to make it law himself.
Lying on the part of our President and AG has been part of the problem. Cruelty on the part of our President and AG has been part of the problem.
Acknowledge that without going back in time to 1996 to blame President Clinton. Acknowledge that this is a completely optional policy that our President has chosen -- at the expense of humanitarian and moral concerns -- and that failing to address that specifically, directly, immediately, and unequivocally makes one complicit.
You won't, b/c that would implicate you, as well. President Trump gets away with unconscionable actions because people like you are willing to compromise what is right for a political goal, whether pointing blame elsewhere and into the past, laughing about "liberal tears," undermining faith in the foundational institutions of America, or oversimplified rationalizations about law.
Oh, @LetsGoDuke301...
Donald Trump directs his AG to enforce policies that other presidents, both Republican and Democrat, have not.
http://www.newsweek.com/jeff-sessions-children-parents-border-912972
This is a fact. These separations were not being handled like this or being done at this scale before. The AG even addressed that, being sure to point out...
“If you are smuggling a child, then we will prosecute you and that child will be separated from you as required by law. If you don’t like that, then don’t smuggle children over our border."
.... despite the fact that, regardless of the law, this wasn’t happening like this before... same way cops have the legal right to drag a speeding teen out of the car, cuff them, and search them, but they don’t, because... well, you know.
And the President has been very clear that this change is being used as a bargaining chip.
New thing. Done by the Trump administration.
Nearly everyone in the world saw this change, and what happened because of it, and spoke out against it.
Republicans Senators, like Lindsey Graham and Orrin Hatch and and John McCain. Republican Representatives, like Will Hurd and Mario Diaz Balart. Decorated military leaders like Mike Hayden. Groups like a group of twenty state AGs and dozens of prominent religious leader like Franklin Graham, Tony Suarez, Jentezen Franklin, and Tim Dolan. Former First Ladies and the United Nations.
Nearly everyone in the world, including literally thousands of people who know a lot about our laws, our policies, and what is and is not right, has been speaking out against this.
Then there is you.
Insults and excuses.
Excuses.
Insults and excuses.
Excuses and insults.
Insults and excuses.
Insults.
Excuses.
Excuses.
Excuses.
Excuses and insults.
Not sympathy.
Not sympathy.
Excuses.
Excuses.
Excuses, and lies.
Excuses.
Excuses, and a personal shot.
I detect a lack of sympathy...
Not sympathy.
Insults.
Insults.
More insults. Lies too, but whatevs.
Hah! How could anyone have that idea, that you have no compassion after you point out that hey, the kids aren’t doing HARD LABOR, right?
Just a little personal shot.
You can say that again.
Excuses.
And then... FINALLY... after telling everyone they are brainwashed and stupid, blaming Obama and coyotes, insisting nothing has changed at the border. after pointing out that hey, the kids aren’t doing hard labor or being sold into slavery...
(Oh, and more excuses. And lies.)
Honestly, Letsgo, if you don’t get how your first response to this situation should be a human one, and that because it never was, because you focused on telling people they were brainwashed and this is a liberal ploy and how Obama is as much to blame for this as Trump and SHEESH, it isn’t like we are selling the kids into slavery... you look pretty not-compassionate...?
Now, you could double down and insult someone or complain about how Obama didn’t do anything or bash me or whatever, go the whole “I’m not going read that!” route.
Or you COULD actually take a second and think ‘Shit. Okay, I get how, when I look at ALL of those posts, one after another after another, I come off as not actually caring about the real life people involved here and seem just combative and a bit uncaring.’ And then you could even say something like that, actually reach out an olive branch.
I honestly hope you do that, because I think *not* doing that... well, it would change my opinion of you a bit.
Donald Trump directs his AG to enforce policies that other presidents, both Republican and Democrat, have not.
http://www.newsweek.com/jeff-sessions-children-parents-border-912972
This is a fact. These separations were not being handled like this or being done at this scale before. The AG even addressed that, being sure to point out...
“If you are smuggling a child, then we will prosecute you and that child will be separated from you as required by law. If you don’t like that, then don’t smuggle children over our border."
.... despite the fact that, regardless of the law, this wasn’t happening like this before... same way cops have the legal right to drag a speeding teen out of the car, cuff them, and search them, but they don’t, because... well, you know.
And the President has been very clear that this change is being used as a bargaining chip.
New thing. Done by the Trump administration.
Nearly everyone in the world saw this change, and what happened because of it, and spoke out against it.
Republicans Senators, like Lindsey Graham and Orrin Hatch and and John McCain. Republican Representatives, like Will Hurd and Mario Diaz Balart. Decorated military leaders like Mike Hayden. Groups like a group of twenty state AGs and dozens of prominent religious leader like Franklin Graham, Tony Suarez, Jentezen Franklin, and Tim Dolan. Former First Ladies and the United Nations.
Nearly everyone in the world, including literally thousands of people who know a lot about our laws, our policies, and what is and is not right, has been speaking out against this.
Then there is you.
Insults and excuses.
Excuses.
Insults and excuses.
Excuses and insults.
Insults and excuses.
Insults.
Excuses.
Excuses.
Excuses.
Excuses and insults.
Not sympathy.
Not sympathy.
Excuses.
Excuses.
Excuses, and lies.
Excuses.
Excuses, and a personal shot.
I detect a lack of sympathy...
Not sympathy.
Insults.
Insults.
More insults. Lies too, but whatevs.
Hah! How could anyone have that idea, that you have no compassion after you point out that hey, the kids aren’t doing HARD LABOR, right?
Just a little personal shot.
You can say that again.
Excuses.
And then... FINALLY... after telling everyone they are brainwashed and stupid, blaming Obama and coyotes, insisting nothing has changed at the border. after pointing out that hey, the kids aren’t doing hard labor or being sold into slavery...
(Oh, and more excuses. And lies.)
Honestly, Letsgo, if you don’t get how your first response to this situation should be a human one, and that because it never was, because you focused on telling people they were brainwashed and this is a liberal ploy and how Obama is as much to blame for this as Trump and SHEESH, it isn’t like we are selling the kids into slavery... you look pretty not-compassionate...?
Now, you could double down and insult someone or complain about how Obama didn’t do anything or bash me or whatever, go the whole “I’m not going read that!” route.
Or you COULD actually take a second and think ‘Shit. Okay, I get how, when I look at ALL of those posts, one after another after another, I come off as not actually caring about the real life people involved here and seem just combative and a bit uncaring.’ And then you could even say something like that, actually reach out an olive branch.
I honestly hope you do that, because I think *not* doing that... well, it would change my opinion of you a bit.
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The GOP has the nuclear option to get anything passed they want. Democrats can't stop a thing and you're repeating our President's blame-shifting, irresponsible lie to claim otherwise.
He can do it by EO (not law) today. He has done so in other situations. And if it works, getting a law passed to make it permanent will be easier. But it isn't priority, just like condemning white supremacists wasn't priority. Priority #1 is always himself, which means playing to his base, which includes you.
Literally a post of facts, and YOUR QUOTES.
I guess that tells us a bit about who you are.
I bet you’d get along better with Corey Lewandowski than we thought.
That’s your side. I’m glad I am not on it. Enjoy.
Yeah, that ought to hold the line until the rest of the MAGA chorus is awake to drown out the smackdown you just got.
I don't think I've ever seen someone devote this much time to someone else on message board.
Rustled? Owned?
His post has really got to you.
Have you ever spent that much time devoted to one member? Besides your own?
And I wouldn't quite call that P3ing. He basically quoted a bunch of post and typed "excuses, sympathy, insults" afterwards.
I never blamed Clinton. The only thing I have done is point out facts that this outrage is only happening because of who the president is. Not because it is a new issue. I am not going to waste my time on discussing the horrible fact that families are being separated. It is something we agree on. You just think that no matter the circumstances, families should never be separated. I disagree. I think we should have a policy that enforces laws but keeps families together in any circumstance that is reasonable. The number of adults crossing the border illegally with children has increased by almost 400% since this time last year. So something needed to be done to stop that. And obviously it has led to the increase in detentions. Which you guys keep focusing on the number of childrem detained without considering the whole story.
The incredible thing about Dude and Dat is that they can do posts like that in 15 minutes. It would take me 5 days and I’d still **** it up.
Your side exploits children to get emotional reactions in hopes of winning elections. Glad I am not on it.
This is our wheelhouse. If there's a deep discussion of economy, watch me shut up and listen, which others ought to do more when they don't know what they're talking about.
I gave Letsgo as much time as it took me to enjoy my morning shit. Literally.
I think he is worth it, because I have a hard time accepting that he thinks pulling kids away from their parents is a legit way to get new laws passed.
#missingtheforestforthetrees
Always! I do try to be careful to say what I mean. It’s a great personal failing
Always! I do try to be careful to say what I mean. It’s a great personal failing
Great personal failing. Gotcha.
As schooner pointed out, it doesn't take as much time as you might think. We all have our skills, and this happens to be one of TheDude1's.
He actually did exactly what any decent writing teacher will tell you to do, which is to surround quotations with context, application, a lead-in, and a follow-up. It was pretty textbook.
Ah, life.
As I was reading this and brushing my teeth, the bathroom door swung open. It was my three year old daughter, just waking up, wearing only her diaper because... I don’t know, little kids are like nudists. I crouched down and gave her a big hug and a kiss. She is a FEROCIOUS hugger. Then I picked her up. (“You are getting HEAVY, Lulu!” “That’s because I growed when I was sleeping, daddy.”). She had a tough night.. fell out of bed and banged her head pretty badly. Then I flopped down on the bed and she just lay on my chest for a minute and we snuggled. My son is in his room, playing with some MUSCLES I got him (remember those little pink figures?)
And I thought about how ****ing lucky I am. How absolutely ****ing lucky.
And I thought about how shitty it is that so many people on the world are not so lucky.
I hope everyone takes a minute to appreciate what they have today.
As I was reading this and brushing my teeth, the bathroom door swung open. It was my three year old daughter, just waking up, wearing only her diaper because... I don’t know, little kids are like nudists. I crouched down and gave her a big hug and a kiss. She is a FEROCIOUS hugger. Then I picked her up. (“You are getting HEAVY, Lulu!” “That’s because I growed when I was sleeping, daddy.”). She had a tough night.. fell out of bed and banged her head pretty badly. Then I flopped down on the bed and she just lay on my chest for a minute and we snuggled. My son is in his room, playing with some MUSCLES I got him (remember those little pink figures?)
And I thought about how ****ing lucky I am. How absolutely ****ing lucky.
And I thought about how shitty it is that so many people on the world are not so lucky.
I hope everyone takes a minute to appreciate what they have today.
I can’t help but think these things are connected, you know?
Which is a de facto defense of WHO OUR PRESIDENT IS. It's also wrong: the systemic separation of families as official, voluntarily chosen policy is completely new.
No, what you'll waste time on is obscuring that conversation by equivocating and repeating lies.
Wrong (but consistent, at least, as this fits with the basic, basic questions about why liberals didn't complain when this happened under previous Presidents). When it happened before, it was not the result of predetermined, official, voluntarily chosen policy being used as a weapon of intimidation and terror.
We already did. Now we don't.
Gosh, so all that tough talk and keeping track of President Obama's golfing didn't fix it? Whodathunk?!
Actually, I keep focusing on the immorality of a predetermined, official, voluntarily chosen policy being used as a weapon of intimidation and terror. You keep leaving that out of the "whole story."
It seems so simple.
Do we need immigration reform? Obviously. We’ve discussed that a lot before.
Had a child ever been taken from their illegal immigrant parents before? Obviously.
Should we be using children and their families as pawns for legal changes? No.
If you can point out the lies, that would be nice. Here's a lie from your post. "We already did. Now we don't." No we didn't. It was catch and release, not detention. The number of immigrants flooding our border using children as tools of entry needed to be addressed. You disagree.
It’s getting there. The off-season gets worse and worse each summer
We didn't have detention before? Deportation under President Obama accelerated. I didn't care for it. I criticized him. I didn't make excuses for him or point at other Presidents.
You are obscuring the truth when you do not focus on the here and now. You are lying when you imply this is the same thing that has happened before. You are lying when you claim it is only b/c of who our President is that anyone is criticizing him. When the President lies and you repeat it, then get corrected, then still repeat it, you are lying.
This board is like Jekyll and Hyde. It couldn't be more different between in season and off season.
Edit: I think some posters post more in the off-season.
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This will be a test of wills. I am going to try my best to only engage in positive threads from here on out. Let's see how long I can hold off.
