Is the Summit the biggest news this offseason?
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No, you are a lib because you endorse a narrative that suggests people on the opposite spectrum of you have no compassion.
@LetsGoDuke301 if you keep chugging the koolaid like you have been, you're going to get a stomach ache.
I didn't say YOU had an agenda. There is a liberal agenda (and a conservative agenda) and your posts have been pushing the liberal agenda pretty heavily from that threads I've followed.
You claim to be independent/moderate so maybe I've missed the threads you argued conservative points lately.
Another cop out. You are the last one on this topic that needs to be accusing others of drinking the kool-aid. Your arguments have been spoon fed to you by the MSM.
Which is another example of you not knowing WTF you are talking about.
Doesn't "agenda" imply motives that color one's arguments, typically in a biased way? Somebody pushing a conservative or liberal agenda would walk into an argument knowing which side they're going to defend without knowing what the argument was about before they joined. That'd be like me opening up a politics thread and thinking to myself, "Alright, let's show these conservatives who's boss and defend the liberal position. Let me review my liberal talking points before I get started." That's not a thing I do. I have opinions that currently are on the left side of the argument. That's true. Maybe the difference is too nuanced.
I do hold opinions that wouldn't fall on the left side of the political spectrum, if that matters.
Give me an example of anything I have said that you can say shows my lack of compassion. You can't. You just learned to question other people's compassion from your lib playbook.
Not 100 examples about your lack of compassion, 100 examples of you not knowing wtf you're talking about.
Okay, I believe that isn't a thing you do but every political thread I've seen you in over the past few months is you slugging it out with the conservatives. Obamacare, immigration, the economy, letting men race against women, etc., etc. I can't recall a single topic lately where you've strayed away from the current liberal platform or supported the current conservative one. Has the been any?
Hey, I hold opinions that wouldn't fall on the right side of the political spectrum, too.
Okay, I believe that isn't a thing you do but every political thread I've seen you in over the past few months is you slugging it out with the conservatives. Obamacare, immigration, the economy, letting men race against women, etc., etc. I can't recall a single topic lately where you've strayed away from the current liberal platform or supported the current conservative one. Has the been any?
Hey, I hold opinions that wouldn't fall on the right side of the political spectrum, too.
I enjoy the political threads. I don't care about Kentucky's next big recruit and nobody talks about Syracuse, so I do disproportionately comment in the off-topic and political threads. I'm contrarian by nature and don't usually enjoy posting about how much I agree with somebody; I reserve posting for times when I disagree.
Obamacare - It wasn't great but it was an attempt to fix a problem. Getting rid of it without a replacement ready to go is reckless and not a solution. Deregulation has its place in a free market. Insurance and healthcare is not that place. Premiums were going to increase significantly with or without it. A Republican initiative to regulate healthcare in a meaningful and useful way would get my attention. A Republican initiative to let the healthcare providers and insurers figure it out for themselves would bother me.
Immigration - I never thought of it as a high priority issue that needed addressing; it certainly wasn't a big enough issue for a Presidential candidate to make it a pillar of his/her platform. So efforts to stop it don't really register with me. Where I get pissed, as you can see, is when humans are treated unfairly/unethically primarily because they're not 'ours'. Historically, protectionism is a bad foreign policy but outside of that, people in our care should be treated with similar levels of dignity as our citizens.
Economy - I'm a business guy (accountant) so this is where I'm most sympathetic to Republican initiatives. Lowering the corporate tax rate had to happen and I'm glad it did. Trickle-down economics doesn't work, though, and wealthy individuals were not due for a tax cut. Trump has done well to keep prior unemployment trends going, but I don't like when his 'record low' rates are touted as an achievement over Obama, when Obama's policies are the ones that got the rates moving significantly in the right direction. Reining-in China's trade dominance is a good idea. Getting in a pissing match with our allies because they tax our milk is a bad idea.
Trans athletes - Admittedly, not something I care all that much about. I presented a different perspective and ultimately suggested a solution that I think was pretty close to the middle.
Some extras:
Gun control and mass shooting mitigation - Arming teachers is a terrible and poorly thought out idea. Outright banning certain high-powered, high capacity weapons is an issue for states to decide, but would probably be ineffective. Making guns much tougher to get ahold of and increasing powers to take them away from individuals who might be threats, until the matter is investigated, is a good idea, especially young men.
Race - Police are overwhelmingly not racist, but racial bias does exist among officers and within certain departments at levels that aren't acceptable. And the results of that racism are dire. The powers of police officers to fvck with citizens without substantial penalty need to be limited. Idk how best to do that, but more rigorous training and psychological screening wouldn't be a bad place to start. As far as race issues outside of the policing perspective go, I don't think racial tension/disparity is as bad as advertised. The phrase, 'check your privilege' bugs the crap out of me and misidentifies the issue at hand. But racial divide does exist and does need to be addressed sooner than later. Creating an environment in which white nationalists feel emboldened to share their views is not a trend in the right direction. Violent protests on either side of the spectrum are obviously bad.
#MeToo - This has turned into the Salem Witch Trials. I also don't think a rich and powerful guy asking a young hot woman to have sex and then having sex with her is rape. No matter the position of power, you always have the ability to say no, imo. Might your career get ruined? It might, but what value do you place on your sense of self-worth? Now, if blackmail is involved, that's a separate issue and a separate crime. I'm also not a fan of the affirmative consent initiative. It's important to foster an environment where sexual assault victims feel safe coming forward with allegations but it's also important not to assume the alleged attacker is guilty. For instance, a school suspending or expelling an accused student without due process is nucking futs.
Idk, what other issues should I opine on?
I think you are a smart guy and I like reading your posts (contrary to what you may think), so continue to opine on any and all topics. For someone who convinced me he was independent/moderate and admittedly likes to argue, I'd just like to see you slap TheDude/Dattier/Q around with toonces/LetsGo/SNU every once in awhile. I'm more of an observer and color commentary in these things nowadays.
Couching it as "policy" while pointing to a previous law is cowardice. There are all kinds of obsolete laws still on the books and other laws with a wide range of flexibility in how they're enforced. There is no immigration law requiring the separation of children and parents and no moral justification for doing so indiscriminately, to the point asylum seekers are separated, as well.
This type of shit ruins all discourse. And it’s a card the right loves to play. It’s almost a white flag. Like, anyone that says snowflake, I immediately just forget about their opinion. So lame. You’re doing good work in here brooky, but you’re dealing w two dudes who can’t get their heads out of Trump’s ass. What a gross place to live, and not just because it’s his ass.
They know the risks of staying put are worse.
It is not required that they be separated. That is a decision our administration has made and since they will not accept responsibility for their choice, the rest of us must hold them responsible, rather than pointing fingers elsewhere and blaming parents that their desperate choice triggered a deliberately cruel and unnecessary reaction.
So we agree that it is unproductive and deliberately deflective to point fingers at previous Presidents when addressing new policy?
No, you're not. You're just a troll.
I love how you never slap letsgo, bert, or any other conservative around, but have the hypocritical audacity to request someone left of you slap liberals around. It's like the sick, twisted, immoral extortion you offer every time a person in power gets called out for abusiveness: You won't acknowledge it unless someone agrees to your pork rider about bu-bu-bu-but Milwaukee!
The difference is I am conservative, so I don’t disagree or argue with the conservative posters much at all. Brooky says he is an independent and moderate but lately I see him aligned with the far left posters ~always.
Well, in fairness to brooky, many of the discussions here seem to be on social/human issues and a lot of you conservative guys seem to take the Breitbart approach to anything being talked about. He's already admitted he's usually in agreeance with most conservatives on economic issues.
Yes, brooky already explained himself and I had moved on. Dattier woke up from a night of not getting laid again and came here with vengeance.
I think I've met 10-12 people in the last few years who claim to be moderate. But, I'm quite certain that every single one of them has political views that more closely align with Bernie Sanders-type socialism.
Now with that being said, I'm definitely not a fan of separating children from their families. To me, it's the equivalent of not offering help to someone who fell down a well, because they shouldn't have been there in the first place. "Well, sucks for you Clifford, but you got yourself in that mess." Not a fan at all of separating kids, unless abuse is involved. In times like these, we need to strengthen families more than ever.
Now with that being said, I'm definitely not a fan of separating children from their families. To me, it's the equivalent of not offering help to someone who fell down a well, because they shouldn't have been there in the first place. "Well, sucks for you Clifford, but you got yourself in that mess." Not a fan at all of separating kids, unless abuse is involved. In times like these, we need to strengthen families more than ever.
I think 'moderate' is somewhat misunderstood. Some people think it means that you agree with 10 things that are on the conservative end of the spectrum and 10 things that are on the liberal end of the spectrum. I don't think it means that. The times when I've said I'm a moderate/independent, I usually add the caveat that I'm left-leaning. The real test, imo, is whether or not you could see yourself voting for the 'other side' without necessitating that the candidate on that side be the next JFK or Jesus. I could do that. I could have voted for a qualified, level-headed Republican over Hillary (if I ever vote).
I mentioned this is another thread, but my mother-in-law told me she was a moderate when I first met her 7 or 8 years ago. But I could never see her voting for a Democrat and she watches Fox News as her lone source of news. I can't think of a single liberal idea, social or otherwise, that she agrees with me on. People like that, on both ends of the spectrum, are fooling themselves.
You must mean we can't show you any example you won't deny. Since this sub-topic has come up alone...
"It's pretty disgusting what you hypocritical losers are doing by making an issue that has been a problem for well over a decade a Trump problem. But hey, when you're desperate to find anything to discredit someone, you will go as low as it takes." (page 17)
This is lacking compassion because: You are ignoring the inherent cruelty of a current, chosen policy to pretend it's just one-way bipartisanship.
"Just stop. Seriously. Do some research and quit blaming a decade long issue on a new policy. Not a new law, just a new policy to enforce the law." (page 17)
This is lacking compassion because: You said this in dismissing the notion that it is wrong to separate parents and kids, then pretended it was "just" enforcing existing law in defense of an inherently cruel, unnecessary policy.
"It has been stated that when families enter at ports of entry, and not illegally, children will not be separated as long as they are with family or legit guardians. So if this is true, aren't the parents of these kids being irresponsible by entering illegally, or paying smugglers to bring them in? Why are they not being held responsible for 'tearing families apart'?" (page 17, appropriately the 666th post ITT)
This is lacking compassion because: You are ignoring the unnecessary, cruel nature of a bad policy and blaming the victims of that bad policy. You've been told repeatedly that they are making desperate choices that are better choices than staying put, but continue to blame them.
"It's a horrible situation at the border. It has been for a long time. But our immigration laws need to be enforced and measures need to be taken to resolve the crisis. That needs to happen by both parties coming together to resolve it. Not by one party hypocritically blaming the other." (same post as cited above)
This is lacking compassion because: You have completely ignored the blame our President has dishonestly pointed at "one party" for a law that he lied about and you've even run with that lie yourself. The layers of irony and hypocrisy to this are apparently never-ending. You're also couching this as a need for enforcement when it isn't.
"Again, at the risk of coming off as unsympathetic, let's discuss this scenario..." (page 18)
This is lacking compassion because: This is basically a cowardly attempt to avoid responsibility for something by acknowledging it up front. It's akin to, "Not to sound racist/sexist/offensive/etc, BUUUUUUUUUUT..." Why are you challenging us to prove you lack compassion when you're admitting to sounding like you lack compassion and taking that risk? If these parents just have to deal w/ it b/c they allegedly knew the risk, why not you? You are acknowledging you know the risk, then whining about it when that risk indeed reflects negatively on you? And that's without the desperate circumstances influencing your choice that they have, so more hypocrisy on your part, as well.
That's not even a full page worth of your posts demonstrating your disgusting, immoral lack of compassion. That last one I cited could be cited about 4 more times for more examples, but you'll deny every last one of them b/c you knew your challenge was chicken [not salad] spewing from your chicken fingers on your chicken keyboard from the very beginning: You aren't willing to see how lacking in compassion you are. You'd actually have to have compassion to care about that perception in the first place. You don't.
brooky and hail both liked this (before I liked it). I liked it for the second half, and professionally speaking, the second point in a two-point sequence usually gets the emphasis. I suspect that's behind brooky's like, too.
What about yours, hail? You haven't acknowledged the exact same point made by liberals in this very thread. You've fought it even. Now you're liking it? Or were you just liking the first point and ignoring the second point?
Examples?Hey, I hold opinions that wouldn't fall on the right side of the political spectrum, too.
I believe in more gun control.
I am pro gay marriage/rights.
I am not against all abortion.
While I think smaller government is better, I’m against the libertarian ideology of freedom and rights. Regulation is needed.
I am for pathways to citizenship for illegal immigrants already living here.
Look, dickhead. I do have compassion for families who are separated. I do have compassion for people who are in such bad situations that they have to take these risks. My whole issue is that we are ignoring facts to make this about Trump. 12,000 kids sit in detention centers and only 2,000 even fit the narrative of our government separating families. You claim I was pointing fingers or deflecting blame. I have acknowledged that Trump is in position to do something about it and sbould immediately. I was only pointing out that this is not a new issue. I didn't say it was Obama's fault, I only mentioned that he didn't do a damn thing about it because you people are falsely claiming that it didn't happen before. Or that it wasn't as bad.
So what about the fact that the majority of these kids are separated from their families before they ever crossed the border? What about the fact that they were treated as bad or worse 5 years ago without any outrage? What about tge fact that there can be something done about it right now but nobody will come to the table. Both sides are exploiting these kids and it's disgusting.
Yeah. My head is so far up Trump's ass because I can see that it is a false narrative to suggest he is responsible for what is happening on the border.
I just want to take this out of context for a moment, so I can laugh.
I'm not saying that necessarily, but you do tend to defend him, a lot, unless I'm thinking of a different poster. If so, my apologies.
Anyway, he just sucks. I realize Hilary may not have been any better, even worse. But, that doesn't mean we need to just back the guy now that he's our President. While that's a common sentiment, and needed at the beginning of any President's term, this dude sucks.
I mean, pretty much every single news source out there mentions that the Bush and Obama administrations were morally and pragmatically opposed to separating children from their families, even if some adult immigrants were clearly taking advantage of that. So everything that you're hearing lately about the large numbers of kids being detained separately is absolutely because of the zero tolerance policy that the Trump administration implemented a couple of months ago. I won't defend the idea that it never happened in the past but the only reason people are talking about it now is because it's happening on a scale like we've never seen before.
You've mentioned before that you don't think the mainstream media is ever being truthful (which I tend to agree with sometimes), but just curious, where do you go to get your information from that you use to discuss topics on this board?
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