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If I'm Bob Huggins....

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I looked at some stats this morning about fouls on 3FG in the NBA. The stats bear out that you get fouled nearly exponentially less shooting jump shots than driving downhill at the rim. NBA teams get fouled 4% of the time on 3FGA. If you triple that number to 12% for anything outside 10 feet, WVU would have been fouled on 5.64 attempts. So the refs potentially missed 2-3 shooting fouls against Kansas on WVU jump shots. At first blush the numbers look bad, but when you start digging, it isn't shocking that WVU didn't shoot a lot of FTs.


You guys are failing to realize it's more than just shooting fouls. Ku got away with murder off the ball. Pushing and grabbing cutters. Freedom of movement applies to more than just a ball handler.

And yes we do the same thing. But we get called for a lot of them.
 
You guys are failing to realize it's more than just shooting fouls. Ku got away with murder off the ball. Pushing and grabbing cutters. Freedom of movement applies to more than just a ball handler.

And yes we do the same thing. But we get called for a lot of them.

You could be right, I just think you have zero credibility. You've shown no ability to be objective. I don't see any reason to take jilted fan at his word.
 
They actually called quite a few off the ball fouls on KU but they're such a physical team and that's their style. Can't expect the refs to call every one, ya know
 
We always take a lot of midrange shots. We don't have guards who attack the rim livke we've had in the past.

We've never only shot 2 ft's before.

And i won't even get Into how many fouls they got away with on cutters and away from the ball. Or all the offensive fouls by Azabuike.

The refs were horrible, but like I said before... We beat ourselves when we quit running offense and went to stall ball with 9 mins to go.
I wanted to post this BEFORE I responded:

Yiou are without a doubt, one of my favorite posters. I love your takes., And your knowledge.

I agree WVU should've shot more FT's. Probably 10 or more. WOuld it have made a difference? Maybe. IDK. But the disparity, though huge, has SOME merit to it. The shot chart shows that. Also, if we are being honest, WVU could've been and probably should've been called for than the 22 fouls they were whistled for. So it kinda of works both ways. In a nutshell, Kansas was a ton more aggresive offensively, thus got more shooting fouls called.

Good luck the rest of the year. Huggins is one of favorite coaches ever.
 
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You could be right, I just think you have zero credibility. You've shown no ability to be objective. I don't see any reason to take jilted fan at his word.

Hard to be objective when you shoot 2 ft's in a game. And the other team shoots 35.

Go back in thd the original thread. Amazingly... KU fans were the ones who started the crying about refs when you were losing. Pretty sure the ft total was 14-0 at that point. Now tell me who has no credibility.
 
Hard to be objective when you shoot 2 ft's in a game. And the other team shoots 35.

Go back in thd the original thread. Amazingly... KU fans were the ones who started the crying about refs when you were losing. Pretty sure the ft total was 14-0 at that point. Now tell me who has no credibility.

KU fans weren't the only ones complaining. The commentators during the game stated multiple times WVU should have been whistled for MORE fouls. I think we've all agreed KU got a favorable whistle, but you just can't stop posting the same stupid shit that has no merit.
 
Hard to be objective when you shoot 2 ft's in a game. And the other team shoots 35.

Go back in thd the original thread. Amazingly... KU fans were the ones who started the crying about refs when you were losing. Pretty sure the ft total was 14-0 at that point. Now tell me who has no credibility.
I mean, you can't argue this. If this were IU, I'd have a very hard time with it. Same if this were WVU that shot 35 and KU only 2. Kansas fans would be irate. It's always easier to be objective when you're on the other side of the objectiveness.
 
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KU fans weren't the only ones complaining. The commentators during the game stated multiple times WVU should have been whistled for MORE fouls. I think we've all agreed KU got a favorable whistle, but you just can't stop posting the same stupid shit that has no merit.

Youre rally gonna use jay bilas to try to prove your point? Laughing

I'm just responding at this point because you keep posting the same stupid shit about how we took too many jumpers. And I agree with that. But there are other ways to draw fouls in the game of basketball.
 
Youre rally gonna use jay bilas to try to prove your point? Laughing

I'm just responding at this point because you keep posting the same stupid shit about how we took too many jumpers. And I agree with that. But there are other ways to draw fouls in the game of basketball.
Jay Bilas, when it comes to officiating, is the dumbest dude behind a mic. He has zero understanding. Knowledge of the game is great. But his takes on the officiating is just brutal.
 
Youre rally gonna use jay bilas to try to prove your point? Laughing

I'm just responding at this point because you keep posting the same stupid shit about how we took too many jumpers. And I agree with that. But there are other ways to draw fouls in the game of basketball.

Absolutely there are, but you have to get more than 6 a half to get into the bonus for a common foul. If you're not being aggressive you aren't going to accumulate many fouls. If you shoot a bunch of jump shots you aren't going to accumulate fouls. Combine both of those and you really aren't going to accumulate many fouls. Conversely when you play an aggressive, gambling style defense you ARE going to accumulate fouls against you. Combine all that and you've got what played out last night. If the number was 10 FTA I'm sure it be easier for you to swallow, but that's still only four more whistles against KU or a couple of the 50/50s going their way.
 
That I agree with. WVU probably should have had around 10 FTA. There were just a couple obvious missed calls that would have resulted in FTA. Then you give then some of the 50/50 calls that would have resulted in FTA and they probably end up with around 10 FTA for the game. How that would have effected the game no one knows. 2 is pretty ridiculously low but there weren't many missed calls or even 50/50 calls that would have resulted in too many more FTA for WVU.

WVU shot 20 more FGA outside of the paint than KU. That's 20 possessions where they did not attack the basket to draw fouls. That does not include the 2-4 shot attempts by Carter where he drove into the lane and faded away from contact. I full heartedly agree that WVU deserved more than 2 FTA but the reason for a big discrepancy is right there for anyone to see.
 
Absolutely there are, but you have to get more than 6 a half to get into the bonus for a common foul. If you're not being aggressive you aren't going to accumulate many fouls. If you shoot a bunch of jump shots you aren't going to accumulate fouls. Combine both of those and you really aren't going to accumulate many fouls. Conversely when you play an aggressive, gambling style defense you ARE going to accumulate fouls against you. Combine all that and you've got what played out last night. If the number was 10 FTA I'm sure it be easier for you to swallow, but that's still only four more whistles against KU or a couple of the 50/50s going their way.

Again, there are ways to be aggressive offensively that don't involve having the ball in your hands and driving to the rim.
 
Officials don't "allow" for fouls. They call fouls based on the rule book. The player commits the foul, the ref just calls it.

you, sir, are full of shit.

Here is your man Higgins calling a foul based on who's rule book?


John_Higgins.gif
 
Doogie you're a solid poster and I have enjoyed going back and forth with you on threads over the last few years. That being said, if you want to go on an on and on over and over about what the officials missed, I can play this game too. After watching this game 3 more times, I tried like hell to see just how bad the officiating was from a WVU perspective.

1st Half Against WVU:

17:25- Carter shoving (w/2 hands) and hugging Graham trying like hell to deny the inbound pass.
16:53- Miles throws a lob pass to Konate with Doke standing right there ready to deflect the lob. He knocks the pas away and as Konate has his arms up begging for a foul, the other 9 players on the floor are busting their asses back to play on the other end.
12:33- West come on a hard hedge for Carter at the top of the key and bear hugs Garrett.
10:45- After a Bolden missed floater, now a loose ball along the baseline, Teddy Allen shoves Vick to the floor out of bounds.
10:20- Miles wraps up Garrett as he's cutting backdoor. Since Miles hugged the 1st option, Graham lobbed the ball to Doke.
9:03- Bolden catches a pass on the wing, takes 3 steps and then puts the ball on the floor.
8:13- After a Konate made jumper Bolden, once again wraps up Graham with both arms away from the ball on the inbounds pass.
7:36- Off a Carter missed fade away Bolden comes flying in and shoves Graham (who was waiting to grab the rebound) well out of bounds. Bolden goes on to grab the offensive board for an easy stick back.
7:31- After Bolden scored that easy stick back, he then goes on to bear hug Newman on the inbounds pass. That's not ball denial. That's called assault which is also a foul and once again, it wasn't called. The worst part of the play is instead of calling the foul, for some unknown reason Higgins felt the need to warn Bolden.
5:33- Garrett blows clean by Carter down the middle of the lane for a layup. However as Carter tries to sprint back & make an honest defensive play, he decapitates Garrett. Garrett missed the shot but instead of bitching and complaining, Garrett picked his ass up off the floor and busted his ass back on defense.
3:07- Carter reaches clear across Graham and damn near took Graham to the floor
0:34- Ensuing a Garrett airball Carter along with Svi hustled after the rebound and shoves Svi out of bounds with 2 hands. Carter grabbed the ball and the play moved to the other end.


2nd Half Missed Calls against WVU:


19:15- Carter slaps Graham twice going for the steal.
11:46- Carter takes the handoff, runs 3 steps and then dribbles.
4:34- Carter scores on a layup and is fouled. Before his shot goes through the basket Konate jumps up and grabs the rim with not just one, but with 2 hands. Offensive basket goaltend? Nope of course not.
0:46- Graham drives to the basket, head fakes and Carter grabs both arms trying for the steal. Somehow Graham maintained possession and KU was able to play on.

I'm sure I'm still missing a few but just for the thrill of it, I may just go back and watch the game for a 3rd or 4th time to see what else I missed. It's been said several times already and I agree that 35-2 from the FT line is lopsided. I also agree KU got the benefit of some calls as well.

What I don't understand is why WVU has turned into a team living off jump shots when they are bigger, more physical actually have the ability to bang around on the interior.

One more thing, Kansas has lost 3 games in Allen Fieldhouse as well as one in KC at the Sprint Center THIS SEASON!! Get the f**k out of here with AFH conspiracy theory bullsh*t.
 
You guys are failing to realize it's more than just shooting fouls. Ku got away with murder off the ball. Pushing and grabbing cutters. Freedom of movement applies to more than just a ball handler.

And yes we do the same thing. But we get called for a lot of them.

It's funny that you didn't bitch about officiating throughout the game, then seized the narrative like a shark to blood afterward. Likely because you didn't see anything outrageous aside from the no-call at the end (when it didn't matter).

Supposing KU did get away with murder. WV gets away with murder every night in Morgantown. Which is one reason they tend to look like worldbeaters at home and very pedestrian on the road. While KU's been better in the road and is traditionally a very good road team.

What it boils down to is that you think it's unfair that another team might get the same favorable whistle that yours enjoys. Just because they win the league every year. Well, tough titties.
 
Youre rally gonna use jay bilas to try to prove your point? Laughing

I'm just responding at this point because you keep posting the same stupid shit about how we took too many jumpers. And I agree with that. But there are other ways to draw fouls in the game of basketball.

You're right. And they drew 14. They average 17. Ohhh my God! Outrage!

Btw, it's humorous that Jay Bilas isn't credible, yet you continue to quote the losing coach (who probably would have flunked out of Duke after a semester).
 
Making a mistake isn't the same thing as allowing for fouls and you know it.
How can you even consider this a mistake? No way. If that was a mistake, then Higgins is incompetent as an official and should be fired.
 
It's funny that you didn't bitch about officiating throughout the game, then seized the narrative like a shark to blood afterward. Likely because you didn't see anything outrageous aside from the no-call at the end (when it didn't matter).

Supposing KU did get away with murder. WV gets away with murder every night in Morgantown. Which is one reason they tend to look like worldbeaters at home and very pedestrian on the road. While KU's been better in the road and is traditionally a very good road team.

What it boils down to is that you think it's unfair that another team might get the same favorable whistle that yours enjoys. Just because they win the league every year. Well, tough titties.

Same favorable whistle? Not sure if serious. 35 to 2?? I've never seen anybody get a whistle that favorable.

Wvu has shot 25 fewer free throws than their opponents at home in our last 5 games. Kansas has shot 67 more than their opponents in their last 5 home games. And yeah, we foul a lot. But nobody gets a home whistle like ku.

Nice try though.
 
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You're right. And they drew 14. They average 17. Ohhh my God! Outrage!

Btw, it's humorous that Jay Bilas isn't credible, yet you continue to quote the losing coach (who probably would have flunked out of Duke after a semester).

Huggs was actually an academic all American and magna cum laude in college.

But again... nice try.

By the way... what does being book smart have to do with basketball?
 
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How can you even consider this a mistake? No way. If that was a mistake, then Higgins is incompetent as an official and should be fired.

We could send a camera crew to your place of work. Betcha we could catch you making a few mistakes. Maybe even one that made you look incompetent. I'm not sticking up for the guy, I'm just saying it's probably harder than you think. Especially when we have the benefit of watching it over and over and over.
 
Same favorable whistle? Not sure if serious. 35 to 2?? I've never seen anybody get a whistle that favorable.

Wvu has shot 25 fewer free throws than their opponents at home in our last 5 games. Kansas has shot 67 more than their opponents in their last 5 home games. And yeah, we foul a lot. But nobody gets a home whistle like ku.

Nice try though.

That should tell you something. Since we all know WV benefits from home cooking. But clearly it couldn't be style of play and strategy. Look at the shot chart for god's sake.

And once again, KU's home whistle isn't even the most favorable in the B12 in general, much less other top programs. I don't have the numbers but I remember that their disparity is lower than Kentucky's and far lower than Duke's. If you don't believe that, find some numbers.

Also, let's see some gifs of all these blatant shooting fouls that weren't called. Aside from the one at the end that didn't really matter.
 
Once again, Kansas has lost 3 times in Allen Fieldhouse and 1 in KC at the Sprint Center (which is considered another home floor game for KU) this season. Washington, Arizona State, Texas Tech and Oklahoma State all found ways to beat us soundly on our home floor. Too bad WVU didn’t take the fight right at us like the four teams mentioned above did.
 
That should tell you something. Since we all know WV benefits from home cooking. But clearly it couldn't be style of play and strategy. Look at the shot chart for god's sake.

And once again, KU's home whistle isn't even the most favorable in the B12 in general, much less other top programs. I don't have the numbers but I remember that their disparity is lower than Kentucky's and far lower than Duke's. If you don't believe that, find some numbers.

Also, let's see some gifs of all these blatant shooting fouls that weren't called. Aside from the one at the end that didn't really matter.

Does every ku fan think shooting fouls are the only type of fouls in basketball? Blows my mind how you guys continue to say this.

I'm done talking about this. And you're too dumb to argue with. Moving on.
 
Does every ku fan think shooting fouls are the only type of fouls in basketball? Blows my mind how you guys continue to say this.

I'm done talking about this. And you're too dumb to argue with. Moving on.

Lol.

We were discussing a lack of calls in favor of WV players who were in the act of shooting. Is that not what this is all about? KU didn't enter the bonus until a few minutes remained and they had a several point lead. If that's not what you're arguing, all that's left is a foul disparity that is similar to their road average.

But yeah, move on and dry your tears, moron.
 
Lol.

We were discussing a lack of calls in favor of WV players who were in the act of shooting. Is that not what this is all about? KU didn't enter the bonus until a few minutes remained and they had a several point lead. If that's not what you're arguing, all that's left is a foul disparity that is similar to their road average.

But yeah, move on and dry your tears, moron.


No fouls just in the act of shooting is not what we were discussing.

But for the final time... nice try.

Move along Now, farm boy.
 
No fouls just in the act of shooting is not what we were discussing.

But for the final time... nice try.

Move along Now, farm boy.

Fine, inbred. But tell me, how did you expect all these FTs to materialize if not by fouls in the act of shooting, considering they weren't in the bonus until late?
 
Oh nevermind, they ate your lunch for that garbage.

Lol to those three idiots who agreed.

JuliaRobertsHugeMouthLaugh.gif
 
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Same favorable whistle? Not sure if serious. 35 to 2?? I've never seen anybody get a whistle that favorable.

Wvu has shot 25 fewer free throws than their opponents at home in our last 5 games. Kansas has shot 67 more than their opponents in their last 5 home games. And yeah, we foul a lot. But nobody gets a home whistle like ku.

Nice try though.

Dude, we've been telling you for over 24 hours, your boys don't drive to initiate contact at the rim. WHY?!!
Why not let Konate and Co. go at it?!

And it's not a Last Night Problem, obviously.
 
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35-2

No way you KU fans can defend this. WV fouls and they foul a lot, and do not get called for most of them. On that we agree, but 35-2 is not defensible. I hope the Big 12 officials are happy, the whole country is now laughing at what a joke they are, for allowing this to keep happening.

Again, two top Division one teams playing a highly contested game, one shoots 35 FT, and the other shoots 2. That is called getting hosed. Period. You KU posters are sounding a lot like the UNCheats, making excuses and deny, deflect ,excuse.
 
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