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****Official B1G Off Season Thread****

Old B1G threads get deleted, do we keep everything as is?


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Yet, only one is the better player.

And unfortunately for closeted Michigan fans, like you, it’s Frazier.


Shows me who the casuals are.

How many have Curbelo on their team even though he’s a Top 2 guard in conference?
You can go back and look for yourself. Frazier is not better than Brooks.

No one has Curbelo, because everyone chose Ivey. Those two can’t co-exist in the ideal backcourt. Maybe if Curbelo pulled a Brooks and developed into a good shooter, he could be on people’s lists.
 
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We are just going to throw out Eli’s most recent season where he showed continued improvement? So odd.

Anyways, Torvik graded Brooks at 3.2 last year, Frazier at 2.8. You’ve cited that every stat for players all offseason.
I use Torvik for preseason predictions. Nothing else.

But sure use whatever metric you want.
 
You can go back and look for yourself. Frazier is not better than Brooks.

No one has Curbelo, because everyone chose Ivey. Those two can’t co-exist in the ideal backcourt. Maybe if Curbelo pulled a Brooks and developed into a good shooter, he could be on people’s lists.
I’m well aware, I also think it’s laughable.

Ivey over Curbelo is fine.
 
His preseason predictions have Eli Brooks higher than Frazier
So let me get it straight, you’d rather have a guy who’s best season points wise is lower than the others career average, all while being the the worse defender and ball-handler…

Because his last season is was at 39% versus 36% from 3.

Did I get your logic right?
 
So let me get it straight, you’d rather have a guy who’s best season points wise is lower than the others career average, all while being the the worse defender and ball-handler…

Because his last season is was at 39% versus 36% from 3.

Did I get your logic right?

Better shooter
More efficient scorer
Higher assist rate
Lower turnover rate


that is a nice pairing for Ivey.
 
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Better shooter
More efficient scorer
Higher assist rate
Lower turnover rate


that is a nice pairing for Ivey.
Whatever will get Eli Brooks on to a team, huh?

This is reminiscent a homeboard post where someone is trying to justify why the lower ranked recruit will be better than the higher one you missed on.
 
Whatever will get Eli Brooks on to a team, huh?

This is reminiscent a homeboard post where someone is trying to justify why the lower ranked recruit will be better than the higher one you missed on.
You are the only one going full homer here. No one else even mentioned Frazier let alone actually put him in their 5.
 
Whatever will get Eli Brooks on to a team, huh?

This is reminiscent a homeboard post where someone is trying to justify why the lower ranked recruit will be better than the higher one you missed on.

Those are skillsets that I think pair well with a ball dominant poor shooting scoring guard like Ivey. Non Michigan fans did, too. It’s not some crazy notion.
 
That's an interesting exercise. Given that a center is probably the centerpiece of any roster you create, it's best to surround that person with shooters (and maybe one slasher like Ivey). So, who are the best shooters at PG this year in the B1G? I don't know that there are many great shooting PG's in the B1G this year so Brooks might be the guy.

Quickly looking at it, I'd go:

Eli Brooks
Jaden Ivey
Caleb Houston
Donta Scott
Kofi Cockburn

^ Michigan homer
 
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Yet, only one is the better player.

And unfortunately for closeted Michigan fans, like you, it’s Frazier.


Shows me who the casuals are.

How many have Curbelo on their team even though he’s a Top 2 guard in conference?
A backcourt of Ivey and Curbelo has 2 guys who were garbage deep shooters last year. I think it makes sense to try to balance it out.
 
Statistically, Brooks has the edge. If you wanna take Frazier I understand. Their stats are really similar at the end of the day. The fact that we are wasting an entire page having to defend Brooks vs Frazier is wild.
 
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Those are skillsets that I think pair well with a ball dominant poor shooting scoring guard like Ivey. Non Michigan fans did, too. It’s not some crazy notion.
Next time they play maybe Brooks will show some of this “skillset” he has such an advantage in. Lol

Dude literally says “Quickly looking at it” in the post.

Maybe he’d take Brooks over Frazier, doubt it though.
 
A backcourt of Ivey and Curbelo has 2 guys who were garbage deep shooters last year. I think it makes sense to try to balance it out.
I was more so using that as an example of when he was asking me why Frazier was on no list’s.

As if not being on any list equaled not being a good player.

That point clearly failed as Trojan didn’t understand it either.
 
Next time they play maybe Brooks will show some of this “skillset” he has such an advantage in. Lol

Dude literally says “Quickly looking at it” in the post.

Maybe he’d take Brooks over Frazier, doubt it though.

Maybe, maybe not. They are really close statistically so I could understand either way.
 
I was more so using that as an example of when he was asking me why Frazier was on no list’s.

As if not being on any list equaled not being a good player.

That point clearly failed as Trojan didn’t understand it either.
Not only was he not on anyone’s list, no one even mentioned him. Many other players to choose from.
 
Better shooter
More efficient scorer
Higher assist rate
Lower turnover rate


that is a nice pairing for Ivey.
I agree with this. If your first assumption is Ivey then Brooks is definitely the better fit to share the backcourt with him. Frazier’s defense doesn’t come into play as much since Ivey is also expected to be a very good defender with his length and athleticism. A better argument would be Curbello + a non-Ivey SG than Ivey + Curbello IMO.
 
If your starting lineup includes Eli Brooks or Trent Frazier, then your lineup needs fixed.
 
I agree with this. If your first assumption is Ivey then Brooks is definitely the better fit to share the backcourt with him. Frazier’s defense doesn’t come into play as much since Ivey is also expected to be a very good defender with his length and athleticism. A better argument would be Curbello + a non-Ivey SG than Ivey + Curbello IMO.
Lol at still taking Brooks over Frazier…
 
Not only was he not on anyone’s list, no one even mentioned him. Many other players to choose from.
Which players?

You said Ivey and Curbelo can’t play together.

Other than Eric Ayala or one of the unproven transfers, there arent many good guards in Conference.
 
Yep, I’ll get at least a month to gloat when Underwood fails to accomplish anything again.

We’ll see! I’m optimistic. While our ceiling might not be as high, I think we’ll be more consistent this year. People froze and looked to (only) Ayo too often last year, and I was very impressed with how we played when he was out. He was so clutch that it usually worked out, but I think this year’s team would handle a Loyola-type situation much better.
 
CBS ranked Michigan 9th in the Big Ten last season.



9. Michigan
Michigan coach Juwan Howard is replacing the heart of the team's interior and exterior, Jon Teske and Zavier Simpson, but he's got leading scorer Isaiah Livers to help soften the blow after he punted on the opportunity to stay in the NBA Draft. Livers is one of only four returning players for Howard in Year Two, with his most daunting task yet in replacing Simpson at point guard made more difficult with David DeJulius, the expected replacement, transferring out. There's more questions than answers surrounding this team but building around Livers gives the Wolverines an advantage from occupying the cellar-dwellar territory.
 
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CBS ranked Michigan 9th in the Big Ten last season.



9. Michigan
Michigan coach Juwan Howard is replacing the heart of the team's interior and exterior, Jon Teske and Zavier Simpson, but he's got leading scorer Isaiah Livers to help soften the blow after he punted on the opportunity to stay in the NBA Draft. Livers is one of only four returning players for Howard in Year Two, with his most daunting task yet in replacing Simpson at point guard made more difficult with David DeJulius, the expected replacement, transferring out. There's more questions than answers surrounding this team but building around Livers gives the Wolverines an advantage from occupying the cellar-dwellar territory.
They didn’t give a 2nd year coach who had just finished 9th in the big ten the year before the benefit of the doubt after returning only 4 players from said 9th place finish?

giphy.gif

Sometimes you look for something that isn’t there. People would have been bat-shit crazy to rank Michigan in the top 3 in the big ten going into last season. Same with Purdue finishing top 4. Both Michigan and Purdue outperformed expectations, enjoy it. Doesn’t mean people were crazy to have them that low before the year began.
 
I’m going Curbelo, Ivey, Houstan, Liddell, Kofi. I’m not putting a role player on my team when I have the pick of the litter. You’re not stopping that team even without a second shooter.
The spacing is gross.

Who’s the first shooter. Mr. Low Release?
 
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The spacing is gross.

Who’s the first shooter. Mr. Low Release?
You have to respect Liddell and Houstan at the 3 point line. I’d bet Liddell raises his percentage to the 35-36% range this year. Ivey and Curbelo will probably be north of 30. It’s not great spacing, but that team is loaded.
 
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They didn’t give a 2nd year coach who had just finished 9th in the big ten the year before the benefit of the doubt after returning only 4 players from said 9th place finish?

giphy.gif

Sometimes you look for something that isn’t there. People would have been bat-shit crazy to rank Michigan in the top 3 in the big ten going into last season. Same with Purdue finishing top 4. Both Michigan and Purdue outperformed expectations, enjoy it. Doesn’t mean people were crazy to have them that low before the year began.


To be fair, when predicting finishes in high major basketball, prognosticators should also consider the incoming talent. And going into 20-21, Michigan was adding some elite talent.
 
And if you don’t like that, Sub Ayala for Curbelo. He ran point for a Maryland, at times and he’s not a tweener off-guard that is being shoehorned into this conversation because there are no other options. He’s a top 10-15 player in the conference.
 
To be fair, when predicting finishes in high major basketball, prognosticators should also consider the incoming talent. And going into 20-21, Michigan was adding some elite talent.
True but no one knows how that talent will translate right away. A lot of people thought Dickinson was going to be good but not near as good as he turned out to be right away.
 
Despite putting a second guy in the lineup with a low release, Bryce McGowens could play either the 1 or 2 depending on how you want to shift the lineup. Just no excuse to put a role player on this type of team.
 
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