NBA Bubble Thread
- Thread starter JimboBBN
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Very true....I like our banter...Its for the most part, clean...Just two dudes talking baketball smack....
But, just know......When it comes to knowledge.....
Just how it is.....
Bucks look like they are ready to become the first team to come back from 0-3 and win the series in 7.
Lets not go overboard now. They still need to win 3 more in a row possibly without Giannis.
I was watching Game 4 of the 1987 NBA FInals(Lakers/Celts). No way dudes today could have played back then...As soft as some dudes are today---getting mad over a "hard foul"...Shit, bro's. Lakers and Celtics got at it....And played a little basketball in between...Laughing
wow you are all over the place.
But most comical was saying 2007 wasn't short of talented dudes. I mean, yeah, they are NBA players so they can play basketball but they started Eric snow and Sasha Pavlovic much of the time at guard.
were you not among the many who referred to me as a Lebron nuthugger? The word of choice for anyone who dares not say MJ is the GOAT and it's not even close?
I'd have gone with the I'm playing chess and you are playing checkers.Very true....I like our banter...Its for the most part, clean...Just two dudes talking baketball smack....
But, just know......When it comes to knowledge.....
Just how it is.....
Where have I said its not even close? Go back and read, brother...I have given much due respect to LeBron. I just don't think he's on the level of MJ..
2007 Cav's had some dudes...
Ilgauskas---Avg 14/8 in 2007....Averaged that for his career...Scored over 10, 000+points.
Drew Gooden-----12 and 9 for his career....Top 4 pick...Solid 14 year NBA career.
Larry Hughes as well.....
It wasn't some trainwreck of a roster...There was some really good, solid NBA guys.
Both series tied today. I really enjoy everyday games. Better than non bubble...sports wise.
If Ilgauskas/Gooden are your 2 and 3 yes, it is a trainwreck of a roster...well, at least not one that has any business getting to the Finals.
Hughes was a mess that year. Either hurt or mental issues (or both). Going by memory, I think it might have been because of death of a brother.
LBJ left an even better roster and they became the worst team in the NBA.
Iggy and Gooden were solid....Not All-Stars, but solid, NBA players. Not journeyman, specialist..
Gibson was a decent addition....And had a decent Finals.
I mean with that being said, Its not Cleveland ran through some great teams, to get to the Finals....They beat two .500 teams in the Wizards and Nets, to reach the ECF vs Detroit. Who was led by.....Who---Chauncey Billups? Richard Hamilton? I will concede that Detroit had the better roster....better team. But its not like they had a roster full of gang-busters...
As for Hughes, he got hurt I believe in Game 2...Led to Gibson getting PT, and a start. He (Gibson) played well.
Detroit was playing with the same roster in which they won a championship and were clear favorites in the East. come on. Z, Hughes? I mean, they were decent at best. No Pippen in the bunch. Gooden was the epitome of dufus on the court. Exact oppositite of HOFer Gooden (and not on Grant's level, either.
Snow and Pavlovic starting.
I said Detroit was better....They were good. But its not as if they were loaded up...Starting 5 was good, but had some age...And real no stars(at the time).
Billups
Hamilton
Prince
Wallace
Weber
Rasheed and Web were in their 11th and 13th seasons respectively.. With that being said, no doubt Pistons were better. But again, its not like LBJ led the Cavs through a bunch of great teams....
And had just won a title and were favorites to get back in the East.
But I meant to say Rodman was exact opposite as Gooden as far as energy/smarts on the court.
Bro, quit trolling....Its beneath you. I mean, dude---I have said like, 10 times....Detroit was better....Detroit was good. They just wasn't some juggernaut...
For someone who thinks MJ is the GOAT....you sure go out of your way to discredit the dude---And at the same time, slurp on LBJ...
Time for you to come out the closet, bro.....You know you love you so LeBronda..
You youngsters are too spoiled.....Iggy and Gooden were solid NBA players. Gooden avg 12/8 for his career. Not great for a Top 5 pick...BUt not awful. Iggy avg. 14ppg for 13 NBA seasons...
But hey, you dudes see no further than LeBronda...Laughing
Uh...who said Detroit was a juggenraut? what I asked was how many games would the 2007 Cavs win without Lebron and you tried to make them out to be a juggernaut as opposed to the 20-win-if-they-are-lucky-team that they were.
They had a far better team in 2014 and fell off the map after Lebron left.
as for Lebron and MJ it's great to not be fanboy or critic of either. You are an MJ fanboy.
They are OK but not as arguably the #2 and 3 players on a Finals team. The type of players Mj had before scottie as 1 and 2...and he could never sniff a Finals pre Scottie. Before you play the he didn't have much time in the league card for MJ, Lebron was only 22 when he led those Cavs to the Finals in year 4. MJ was 27 in year 7.
Laughing....Damn, drama queen...I never tried to make Cleveland out to be a juggernaut(w/o LBJ). That would be just plain dumb. I just pointed out there was some pretty good, solid NBA talent----And, well, there was.
I think you got your years mixed-up with that 2014 reference...
Not a "fanboy" of MJ. Just think hes the GOAT. Seems 99% of his peers feel the same. Guess that makes dudes like Magic, Bird, etc, etc..."fanboys" as well...
TBH, at 48, I;ve been blessed. Saw Magic, Bird and MJ in their primes. And FTR, I don't think LeBron is better than any of those three. And TBH, I think Magic is 1A to Jordan. As I have gotten older, of course I have gotten to see guys like Durant and LBJ. Those dudes are on another planet. LBJ is just a crazy, insane basketball phenom..Unreal agility, athletic ability for a dude his size. But his lack of "killer instinct", early in his career, and even midway through it, to me, sets him behind dudes like Bird, Magic...and of course the GOAT---Jordan.
TBH, I hated MJ vs Pacers. Loved him when it wasn't the Pacers he was tormenting. I was a senior in HS when MJ started his run....Of course no one knew what we were witnessing...Never seen nothing like it....
Still haven't.
So if that makes me a "fanboy", then so be it. But for as much as folks like you try and discredit him, and place LBJ above----What does that make you when it comes to LBJ?
Have a good one....
Drama queen? Just pointing out you deflected because, well ya did.
Only ones who are fanboys are those who say MJ clearly the GOAT and Lebron could never catch him.
Everyone entitled to an opinion, but Lebron being behind Magic because he lacked killer instinct is absurd. Couldn't just be these guys won (MJ included) because they were very good and had very good teammates. Lucky for the rest of the league MJ does not care if he wins as an exec...or Magic didn't care if he won as a coach or Pres.
Yep...meant 2010, not 2014.
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TBH, I just wish you'd come out and say, " I think LBJ is better". Hard to respect someone who cannot stand on their own thoughts. Or well, maybe you are just trolling?
As for LBJ getting to the Finals quicker, and at a younger age? Great. I mean hell, if you wanna take that approach, then why not go with Magic? Dude won an NCAA title in March of 1979, then was the MVP of the NBA Finals, as a ROOKIE, the following year. And did so at the age of 20. So,I mean, what----is magic better b/c he found success quicker?
As for Jordan, pre- Pippen....? C'mon, bro. Jordan was drafted by a terrible franchise. Prior to Jordan's arrival, Chicago had missed the playoffs 6 of the past 7 seasons. Year before his arrival, Chicago was 27-55, finished 10th. As a rookie, MJ led the Bulls to 38 wins, and their first playoff appearance in 4 years. Bulls never missed the playoffs again with MJ. I'm not gonna list the talent he had through his early years...But I'll say this----If you think what LeBron had was putrid, well............
I think you need to let the boded part set in......
Sure they could have won b/c well, they were good. And that certainly is a big reason. But look bro, its not like I'm the only dude talking about MJ's killer instinct, and LBJ's lack thereof....I mean if ya have a problem with that, then asides from me, you need to take that up with the dudes that played with MJ, Magic, etc, etc....And those well, who claimed LBJ QUIT on the Heat...and the Cavs.
I never said LBJ couldn't overtake MJ...Go back and read---I said IF LBJ were to go on some crazy title run, then he would have one hell of an argument. Look, LBJ is easily one of the Top 5'ish players I have ever seen. MJ, Magic, Bird.....LeBron is in that company. I just don't think he's better. Its just an opinion. An opinion based on watching all of those dudes, for a span of 30 years...Doesn't make me right, though. And thats cool.
"Good for the rest of the league that MJ doesn't care if he wins as an exec...."
Man, you really dislike the dude don't ya...??Laughing Cannot help yourself can ya...Laughing
Easier to respect someone with an agenda who cannot see both sides in a discussion? Ok, sport.
I think you need to let your comment about jordan pre-Pippen sink in and maybe think to yourself what the cavs were like pre MJ. Cavs had the #1 pick before Lebron arrived with the worst record in the league at 17-65. To help with the math that would make the team MJ joined 10 games better.
27 to 38 wins, huh? The Cavs went from 17 wins to 35. so MJ improved them by 11, and Lebron improved the Cavs by 18. Lebron was also 19, and not coming off 3 years under dean Smith (guessing age 22 for MJ).
You were saying?
well, like Lebron, cannot say I care all that much for MJ, so that's true.
But I'm using facts to make my point. Did MJ (and Magic) just forget how much they cared about winning as team execs.? Or could it they won as players because they were very good at their "jobs" (as were their teammates), and didn't win as execs because they were not?
FYI, it is funny you need to play the "well look what this guy said" to try and make your argument. funny you spoke of respect when you need the opinion of others to form your opinion.
Ya gotta love this forum.
Yeah, ummm, he had Orlando Woolridge and Quentin Dailey. Two guys who had nice, solid NBA careers...Two guys who's numbers are eerily close to the two dudes you crucified in Clev----Gooden and Iggy.
BTW, LBJ didn't have to contend with the likes of Celtics, either. You know, that team that would won 2 NBA titles and made 4 straight NBA Finals, in Jordan's first 4 seasons...Celtic team that had some dude named Bird....another cat named Mchale...And this "decent" big in, Robert Parrish. Certainly that didn't play a role of MJ not getting to the finals....Good luck beating those Celtics teams with Orlando Woolridge and Quentin Daily...Laughing
You actually just made my point for me. Never mind I did not crucify z and Gooden. Only said they should not be the #2 and 3 players on a Finals team.
But tell me, like Lebron did with z and Gooden, did MJ ever get to the Finals with Daley and Woolridge as his 2 and 3.
Game.....set....match. and I'm out.
Yo are trolling----that are you don't read very good. I have said, what, like 15 times now---LBJ is in the convo with MJ....Magic, and Bird. I have said multiple times IF LBJ were to win a few more titles, that his argument would be solid....Explain to me how that is not seeing both sides of the discussion?
Its you who is discrediting everything MJ has done....With you,its always, "Well, until Pippen:". Over and over and over.
Great, LBJ lead a greater of the worse, to more wins...Ok. Fine. How about since that is seemingly so important, we just drop both behind Magic, and call it a day? After all, at 20 years of age, Magic was MVP of the Finals, leading the Lakers to the title----As a ROOKIE.
But hey, lets leave out MJ getting hurt; career threatening injury...Or the fact that one of the greatest teams ever was in the midst of dynasty, was standing in MJ's way...
I 'm starting to think you are stupid....Did MJ get to the Finals with those dudes? Nope. But, Did LeBron have to go through a team like the Celtics?
Nope.
Problem is, you only see one side of the equation....I think you need a nap.
You are trolling, and that cool...Conversation is conversation. BUt the bolded shows either you are trolling, or you are a tad slow...I'm going with trolling.
Well, lets discuss this....
Yep, LBJ was 22, and made it in Year 4...Some 4-5 years younger than MJ, and a few years quicker...Cannot argue that. As you said, "You are using facts". And well, brother, thems are the facts.
BUT........................Lets continue.
Yes LBJ led Clev to the Finals in a mere 4 years as a Pro...Great. But, he also missed the playoffs in 2 of his first four seasons...MJ never missed the playoffs---And yes, before you ask, that was before AND after Pippen.
So there is that...
But there is more..
In his first 7 seasons, LBJ went to the Finals----ONE TIME. And was swept.
In Jordans first 7 seasons, he went to the Finals ----ONE TIME. And won the title, 4-1
So,there is that.....But I know, I know....Scottie Pippen. Which , OK, is fair, so well it leads to this....
In 2010 LBJ, as we know, took his "talents" to South Beach, and teamed with Chris Bosh and DWade.....And lost in the NBA FInals, 4-2.
So, 2 NBA Finals.....Two losses. Firs time, OK, I get it---had a bunch of turds. But seocnd time around? Dude---He had his own "Pippen", in DWade----And lost.
MJ in his 2nd NBA Finals----Won 4-2. I know, I know----Pippen...
Lets flashback....
2008-09, and 2009-10 Season....Clev wins 66 games and 61 games...How far those teams go? I'll help----66 win team lost in ECF.....61 win tem lost in ECSF...
Just an interesting tid-bit...
So, anyways.....Back to the "getting to the Finals, quicker, thingy....."
So afer going to Miami, and creating a "super team", LBJ and the Heat went to 4 NBA Finals, in 4 years....Winning 2 titles. Losing to the Mavs in 6 games, and the Spurs in 5..Tell me, when Jordan got his Pippen, how many Finals did he lose? LBJ had Chris Bosh, Wade, and even Ray Allen....Went 2-2.
How? He had DWade, bro. I mean, that dude is Pippen level, right? Or no?
Anyways....I mean at the end of the day, well...
LBJ did get to the Finals quicker...
Hardly a youngster, but whatever makes you feel better about your scorching takes.
Well, that sucks....Now you don't have THAT excuse. Better stick to golf...SmokinSmile
Not enough time to golf. Maybe when the kids are gone, but that’s a decade-plus away still. Thank god. Rather em never leave. Ha.
Id say they are pretty comparable to Theo Ratliff and Aaron Mckie who Iverson drug to the finals.
Your flaw in logic in this line of thinking is that getting to the finals is not the same as winning the finals.
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