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Is the day of the "Blue Blood" over?

della

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You see famous Blue blood coaches hanging it up. You see blue blood teams securing #1 classes only to fall on their faces. You see former no names winning National Championships by beating teams that were former no names. Has parity arrived in CBB? Can anyone win it all with a good coach, team talent and chemistry?
 
I think the Bluebloods will still be in the thick of it but the days of them being virtually guaranteed top 10 ranks is diminishing for sure and winning national titles is getting even harder.

If you consider the bluebloods to be Duke, Kansas, Kentucky, North Carolina, UCLA and Indiana. (I'd call a couple of them "former" bluebloods but that's neither here nor there for this analysis).

Blueblood national champs by decade:

1951-1960 - 5
1961-1970 - 6
1971-1980 - 6
1981-1990 - 4
1991-2000 - 6
2001-2010 - 4
2011-2020 - 3
 
I think the Bluebloods will still be in the thick of it but the days of them being virtually guaranteed top 10 ranks is diminishing for sure and winning national titles is getting even harder.

If you consider the bluebloods to be Duke, Kansas, Kentucky, North Carolina, UCLA and Indiana. (I'd call a couple of them "former" bluebloods but that's neither here nor there for this analysis).

Blueblood national champs by decade:

1951-1960 - 5
1961-1970 - 6
1971-1980 - 6
1981-1990 - 4
1991-2000 - 6
2001-2010 - 4
2011-2020 - 3
Do you think the rules changes regarding players even weakens their position further?
 
11 out of the last 13 champions are top 10 programs. There have been 6 blue blood champions in the last 13 runs. To answer your question shortly, no.
 
11 out of the last 13 champions are top 10 programs. There have been 6 blue blood champions in the last 13 runs. To answer your question shortly, no.
6 in the last 13 but 3 of those 6 were 11, 12 and 13 years ago. Interesting cherry picking on those numbers.
 
Do you think the rules changes regarding players even weakens their position further?
I think the transfer rules weaken their position but I think NIL could strengthen it. In theory, the bluebloods should have the most NIL money available due to their larger followings.
 
11 out of the last 13 champions are top 10 programs. There have been 6 blue blood champions in the last 13 runs. To answer your question shortly, no.
According to Boilerzz the "Bloods" are sitting at 30% in the last decade. That is their worst showing in the last 70 years.
 
6 in the last 13 but 3 of those 6 were 11, 12 and 13 years ago. Interesting cherry picking on those numbers.
lol, sorry for posting facts? Nova and UConn aren't blue bloods but they are still top 10 programs. The big boys aren't going anywhere, you don't have to worry.
 
Depends on the Blue Blood. I’d argue Kansas, Kentucky and North Carolina are the only completely, 100% self-sustaining programs in the country today. A bad coach can wind up there, but he won’t last long and there will be a line of qualified replacements every time. I struggle whether or not to put Duke here, but we just have to see what they’re like post-Coach K.

The other “Blue Bloods” (whom I count to be UCLA, IU and Louisville) are elite jobs with tons of advantages, and they’ll attract good coaching candidates … but the gap in appeal to a coaching candidate between them and the top tier I listed vs. them and programs like Arizona, Michigan, Villanova, etc. is getting pretty close to even. And I think that will continue to be the case. It’s just as easy for the right coach/recruiter to win at Illinois or Ohio State as it is at Indiana at the moment, even though IU is a “better job” and clearly better program all-time … just my opinion. And I think that will continue to become even more true with NIL.
 
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I don’t think so honestly OP. It could be a down turn for a decade as Duke/UNC go through transition but to say the days are over is incorrect. They will all rebound at some point with the right coach.

Kansas is in prime position to strike for the next 10 years, especially once the NCAA allegations diminish. Recruiting is picking up again and Self is one of the 3 gameday coaches.

Bill Self has a lot of years left at Kansas his recruiting is starting to pick up again. Once the NCAA completely clears then he will get back to his elite classes. He’s molded himself as a coach and become less reliant on two bigs.
 
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I think the belief is the programs obtained the elite status over the course of decades so they won't be losing the status due to a "regression to the rest" in a short time frame.

I think the question can be revisited in about 25 years. Let's live long enough.
 
I think the belief is the programs obtained the elite status over the course of decades so they won't be losing the status due to a "regression to the rest" in a short time frame.

I think the question can be revisited in about 25 years. Let's live long enough.

Right, and I think UK, KU and UNC are likely in that tier. However, look at UConn in 2010 or so compared to now or IU going from Knight to 6 wins in 2009 and struggling to return to form. I don’t think “Blue Blood” (or near Blue Blood) is more of a term of respect rather than an insurance of future success if you’re not one of those aforementioned three.
 
Right, and I think UK, KU and UNC are likely in that tier. However, look at UConn in 2010 or so compared to now or IU going from Knight to 6 wins in 2009 and struggling to return to form. I don’t think “Blue Blood” (or near Blue Blood) is more of a term of respect rather than an insurance of future success if you’re not one of those aforementioned three.
Yeah, I can't lie I'm not even sure what the definition is. I think it applies to the top programs based on their overall win %, titles, F4s, etc over the time span of decades not just a decade or two. I'm sure there's more variables depending on who you ask. Maybe a program needs to show elite level under multiple coaches, etc.

I'm not sure it necessarily points to any predictions of the future per se, but is a belief of this is who they are overall as of right now based on decades of excellence.

IU and UCONN are strong programs. UCONN maybe not as much of a foundation though, so I'd leave them out of the conversation. I'd be more interested in looking at Villanova than UCONN, if Wright keeps it rolling...but again everybody has a different POV.
 
I think the belief is the programs obtained the elite status over the course of decades so they won't be losing the status due to a "regression to the rest" in a short time frame.

I think the question can be revisited in about 25 years. Let's live long enough.
That really wasn't the question. The question is more about rule changes (one and done, paying players) bringing parity to CBB.

The horse and buggy/cart had a several thousand year run, but were erased in a flash with the advent of the car truck.
 
That really wasn't the question. The question is more about rule changes (one and done, paying players) bringing parity to CBB.

The horse and buggy/cart had a several thousand year run, but were erased in a flash with the advent of the car truck.
Oh sorry if I misunderstood. I was unaware we were eliminating the results prior to the rule changes. This removes a couple failed marriages and really bad jobs off my resume. I like it.
 
I think the blue bloods will always have a high percentage of advantages. Every so often a Central Arkansas will produce a Scotty Pippen, but the blue bloods seem to have a lasting resume, even though it seems to be diluting. What’s old is new again. This day and age kids think they’re above the antiquated regimes and believe they can carry a no name to glory. The Cade Cunninghams and the Trey Youngs buck the trend by choosing elsewhere, accomplishing nothing. Then those schools are sifted back into obscurity.
 
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Oh sorry if I misunderstood. I was unaware we were eliminating the results prior to the rule changes. This removes a couple failed marriages and really bad jobs off my resume. I like it.
Glad I could help. 😀
 
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You see famous Blue blood coaches hanging it up. You see blue blood teams securing #1 classes only to fall on their faces. You see former no names winning National Championships by beating teams that were former no names. Has parity arrived in CBB? Can anyone win it all with a good coach, team talent and chemistry?
Since 2000, Duke has won 3 National titles....UNC has won 3. Kansas and Kentucky have one each...UCLA has been to 4, Final Fours... In other words, bluebloods have won 8 of the past 21 titles.

The only former "no name" to win a title has been Baylor. Villanova has been solid for many years...Gonzaga the same. UConn has 4 titles since 1999. They were always a threat under Calhoun. Virginia has been a power for quite some time.
 
That really wasn't the question. The question is more about rule changes (one and done, paying players) bringing parity to CBB.

The horse and buggy/cart had a several thousand year run, but were erased in a flash with the advent of the car truck.
Paying players is in its first year----And it sure the hell isn't going to create parity. If anything, it will widened the gap. One and done has been a non-issue as well. Baylor didn't win their title with any....Nor did Virginia....Or Villanova.

Bluebloods are just fine.
 
Yeah, there certainly isn’t going to be more parity in the new era. There will be less. Those small schools who have had semi-consistent success in recent years? Doomed to irrelevance.

The next Steph Curry ain’t staying at Davidson for three years. As soon as a player flashes potential, they’ll be poached by a bigger program.
 
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Paying players is in its first year----And it sure the hell isn't going to create parity. If anything, it will widened the gap. One and done has been a non-issue as well. Baylor didn't win their title with any....Nor did Virginia....Or Villanova.

Bluebloods are just fine.
We have seen UK, UNC, and Duke struggling at the same time. Has that ever happened before?
 
Since 2000, Duke has won 3 National titles....UNC has won 3. Kansas and Kentucky have one each...UCLA has been to 4, Final Fours... In other words, bluebloods have won 8 of the past 21 titles.

The only former "no name" to win a title has been Baylor. Villanova has been solid for many years...Gonzaga the same. UConn has 4 titles since 1999. They were always a threat under Calhoun. Virginia has been a power for quite some time.
One and done didn't begin until 2006. We are talking about Blue blood and not solid teams.
 
We have seen UK, UNC, and Duke struggling at the same time. Has that ever happened before?
They also have a combined 7 national titles, 14 Final Fours and 25 Elite 8's in that time frame. Last year was an outlier. I wouldn't count on what happened last season, becoming the norm.
 
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One and done didn't begin until 2006. We are talking about Blue blood and not solid teams.
You said, former "no names"---Villanova, Gonzaga, Virginia aren't former no names... Maybe you could make an argument with the Zags...But dudes have been very good for well over 20 years..Not to mention, All three have been fixtures atop CBB for quite some time. Same with UConn. AS I said, the only former no name making noise is Baylor. Other than that, everyone else has played at a high level, for a long time.

The big boys, I.e KU, UNC, Duke, UK, are just fine. They have 8 titles in the past 21 seasons. UCLA has 4 FF's...Shit even Indiana has played for a title.
 
You said, former "no names"---Villanova, Gonzaga, Virginia aren't former no names... Maybe you could make an argument with the Zags...But dudes have been very good for well over 20 years..Not to mention, All three have been fixtures atop CBB for quite some time. Same with UConn. AS I said, the only former no name making noise is Baylor. Other than that, everyone else has played at a high level, for a long time.
UVA has not been a fixture for quite some time, or played at a high level for a long time. They have been to 3 FFs two of those in the 80s, and the last 8 yrs or so have been strong. They have had a few decent teams here and there prior to Bennett but nothing memorable. They are certainly doing great now but have avg to below avg tradition.

UVA probably makes the point the OP is trying to make, a team with relatively avg tradition can excel in today's game.
 
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Yeah, there certainly isn’t going to be more parity in the new era. There will be less. Those small schools who have had semi-consistent success in recent years? Doomed to irrelevance.

The next Steph Curry ain’t staying at Davidson for three years. As soon as a player flashes potential, they’ll be poached by a bigger program.

In terms of mid majors, I agree. But the really good mid major players transferring out will probably add more parity to say top 25 programs. Programs than couldn’t often get instant impact freshman will get their fair share of good transfers because there are only so many blue blood scholarships to go around.
 
It was also during a global pandemic, that effected everything about everyone.

Young teams didnt stand much of a chance last year from the jump imo.
That is a solid point.
 
In terms of mid majors, I agree. But the really good mid major players transferring out will probably add more parity to say top 25 programs. Programs than couldn’t often get instant impact freshman will get their fair share of good transfers because there are only so many blue blood scholarships to go around.
Yeah, I think the top 30 or so will be stronger and deeper than ever, but I don’t necessarily think it’s going to allow average programs to close the gap with the top teams.
 
My definition of Blue blood

Legacy - Decades of winning
All time wins
Conference titles
Players put in the NBA
Final Fours
Titles

All of these combine equal - Tradition

Duke has been great since the 80's but UK, UNC and KU have been top tier since the invention of basketball. Thus blue bloods. I think UCLA belongs
 
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My definition of Blue blood

Legacy - Decades of winning
All time wins
Conference titles
Players put in the NBA
Final Fours
Titles

All of these combine equal - Tradition

Duke has been great since the 80's but UK, UNC and KU have been top tier since the invention of basketball. Thus blue bloods. I think UCLA belongs
Thing to remember with Duke is, they were in it with a chance to win it, multiple years prior to K. 1966 UK beat their all white team in the Final Four. 1978, UK Goose Givens put up 41 to keep them from winning it. That's all I can recall due to bias, but they've had a good team for years prior to K.
 
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Also think IU has to be brought up in any blue blood conversation. For the life of me, I can't understand their string of bad luck or bad hires, but I still bet on them winning a title before Tennessee.(teasing)
 
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Last 2 titles won by average programs that prior to their title win had 2 F4s and 0 titles.

75% of the last 2 F4s consisted of average programs.

So it will be interesting to see if it's a trend or a hiccup. Of course F4 and titles is just one metric.
 
Last 2 titles won by average programs that prior to their title win had 2 F4s and 0 titles.

75% of the last 2 F4s consisted of average programs.

So it will be interesting to see if it's a trend or a hiccup. Of course F4 and titles is just one metric.
The modern era is always reinventing itself.
 
My definition of Blue blood

Legacy - Decades of winning
All time wins
Conference titles
Players put in the NBA
Final Fours
Titles

All of these combine equal - Tradition

Duke has been great since the 80's but UK, UNC and KU have been top tier since the invention of basketball. Thus blue bloods. I think UCLA belongs
People seem to forget, or simply ignore Duke, before K...Lot of very good coaches---Cameron won 226 games, at a 70% clip. He coached before the advent of the NCAAT. Otherwise, he would have had quite a few trips...Vic Bubas won 76% of his games.. Went to 4 NCAAT....2 FF's...runner-up, and an E8....Foster took over a struggling program...His first few seasons were rough. But after that, in his last 3, he went to 3 straight NCAAT's: Runner-up and a regional final. He also won a combined 3 ACC titles(2 tourney/ 1 reg. season.

Prior to K, Duke had over 1,000 wins, 4 Final Fours, 2 Runner-ups and 5 Elite 8 appearances. Keep in mind this was in an era when making the NCAAT was quite difficult. They were cerratinly one of the stronger programs of those era's.
 
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i agree about IU and UL, next tier down from blueblood imo

also from Phogs post im not sure what putting people in the nba has to do with blue blood status. If a program is cuting down the nets regularly, who cares if their players are nba quality or not. I dont get that as a criteria imo.
 
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