ESPN's Way Too Early Top 25 (Updated Today)

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Difference between the Big 12 and Big East and everyone else is the Round Robin.

For example.
If you have four Top 20 teams in the Big 12

Compared to 7 in the Big 10

Not everyone is playing those teams twice. Might play them once or not at all.
In the Big 12 you play everyone twice.


Big 12 was down because you didn't have the depth 3-7 last year.

 

[MGC_07]

Believe what?

Shaka had Texas as a dangerous team going into the tournament. Problem is no tournament his plan gets sidetracked.

Regarding preseason rankings. For where Texas is at I think it is much better for them to be disrespected.
They haven't proven anything and they have to understand that.

Shaka was looking to turn last year into a big year for 2020-2021.

When you put Andrew Jones as the soul of your team that team is going to be tough and be able to handle adversity.

Dangerous team? You guys were out of the tournament unless you beat Texas Tech in the Big 12 tournament. You were 61st in Kenpom, return a lot and add a good recruit. That’s the makings of a top 25 or so team.

I’ll believe it when I see when Shaka actually has you guys as a great team.

 

[MGC_07]

Difference between the Big 12 and Big East and everyone else is the Round Robin.

For example.
If you have four Top 20 teams in the Big 12

Compared to 7 in the Big 10

Not everyone is playing those teams twice. Might play them once or not at all.
In the Big 12 you play everyone twice.


Big 12 was down because you didn't have the depth 3-7 last year.

That’s a 2 way street. You also may only play the crappy teams it’s easy to get wins against once, like a Northwestern or Nebraska, where as you guys have a guaranteed 2 games against the bottom of the barrel in your conference.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Dangerous team? You guys were out of the tournament unless you beat Texas Tech in the Big 12 tournament. You were 61st in Kenpom, return a lot and add a good recruit. That’s the makings of a top 25 or so team.

I’ll believe it when I see when Shaka actually has you guys as a great team.

Much easier to go into the tournament when you have already played those type of games.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

That’s a 2 way street. You also may only play the crappy teams it’s easy to get wins against once, like a Northwestern or Nebraska, where as you guys have a guaranteed 2 games against the bottom of the barrel in your conference.

There really isn't a bottom most years.
Kansas State had the ability to play with anyone in the conference this year.

There aren't teams on the level of Nebraska and Northwestern

Don't know how KenPom rated the conferences this year but since the Big 12 went to the Round Robin that site had them #1 every year
Since you are using data from KenPom we will use that site

 

[Kronic22]

Believe what?

Shaka had Texas as a dangerous team going into the tournament. Problem is no tournament his plan gets sidetracked.

Regarding preseason rankings. For where Texas is at I think it is much better for them to be disrespected.
They haven't proven anything and they have to understand that.

Shaka was looking to turn last year into a big year for 2020-2021.

When you put Andrew Jones as the soul of your team that team is going to be tough and be able to handle adversity.

Sorry, but Texas was not a dangerous team last year. Wins over two struggling teams in ttech and WVU are nothing to brag about, and a buzz beating prayer vs another fading bubble team in ou, and then getting run off the floor by a mediocre osu team, at home, on senior night, with the tourney on the line, doesn't instill fear in anyone.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Sorry, but Texas was not a dangerous team last year. Wins over two struggling teams in ttech and WVU are nothing to brag about, and a buzz beating prayer vs another fading bubble team in ou, and then getting run off the floor by a mediocre osu team, at home, on senior night, with the tourney on the line, doesn't instill fear in anyone.

Tournament wasn't on the line against Oklahoma State.
That is called a wake up game. You bring the team back to reality before you play must wins games.
The difference between Oklahoma State and the other games was offensive sets coming in from the bench.
Watch the OU game. Then watch the Oklahoma State.

You are the one claiming Texas should be a Top 15 preseason.

The reason they aren't is because of the reasons you just mentioned.
Pretty much made the argument against your post.

In regards to where Texas was at
We would never know. The season ended with two much left to be determined.

Shaka had complete emotionally control over that team. Something you want as a coach.

I think you see this by the entire team returning. You don't see players being pushed out or leaving on their own.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

In regards to Greg Brown.
He is closer to Myles Turner than Kevin Durant..
In terms of him being raw. He is an elite athlete but in terms of actual basketball he is very raw.

It is going to be the players already there and what Shaka Smart has developed more than a player coming in and taking over.

Brown isn't there yet. .
Both him and Kai Jones are what you call raw talents.

This isn't saying he isn't a special talent because his athleticism at 6-8 is unreal but saying he isn't what you refer to as a professional scorer like Durant.

 

[Kronic22]

Big 12 is not the toughest conference lol. The Big Ten had 12 of their 14 Teams ranked higher on KenPom than Texas last year.

The Big Ten had 12 of the top 34 teams on a Kenpom. It wasn’t even a debate the Big Ten was the best conference last year.

The top spot was neck and neck between the conferences, according to the computers. BE, B10, AND B12.

B10 suffered from what usually plagues the b12, lots of depth, but few NC contenders.

That's why I have the edge to the b12, KU and Baylor were both legit final four teams.

I don't think the big 10 had anyone making it past the elite 8, if that far.

The tourney would have settled it.

 

[Kronic22]

Tournament wasn't on the line against Oklahoma State.
That is called a wake up game. You bring the team back to reality before you play must wins games.
The difference between Oklahoma State and the other games was offensive sets coming in from the bench.
Watch the OU game. Then watch the Oklahoma State.

You are the one claiming Texas should be a Top 15 preseason.

The reason they aren't is because of the reasons you just mentioned.
Pretty much made the argument against your post.

In regards to where Texas was at
We would never know. The season ended with two much left to be determined.

Shaka had complete emotionally control over that team. Something you want as a coach.

I think you see this by the entire team returning. You don't see players being pushed out or leaving on their own.

That osu game was absolutely to get in, after that loss Texas was on the wrong side of the bubble. They would have needed a tourney win to get in.

I claimed Texas would be a top 10 team if we had a competent coach, not shaka con. You missed the point.

If shaka had any control over this team, you wouldn't have seen injuries force his best lineup on the floor.

Sims and febres have no heart. Once those guys were replaced by Kai and Brock, the intensity on the team picked up significantly.

 

[Kronic22]

I think you see this by the entire team returning. You don't see players being pushed out or leaving on their own.

I think we might see someone leave with the addition of brown. Not enough minutes to go around.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Texas' best lineup is with Jericho Sims. Still is.
The intensity picked up because those were must win games. Not because of the lineup. I do agree Brock Cunningham and Royce Hamm are great guys to have on the court to provide energy but neither of them have the skill set of Jericho Sims.
Regarding Kai Jones. You saw glimpses of him during the season. He played his minutes even when the team was fully healthy.
Shaka knows basketball much more than me and I can tell that Kai Jones in terms of raw talent was the best player in the Big 12 last year.
That is how much upside he has. Shaka knows this. The reason he recruited him.



I don't know if there will even be a basketball season next year.

I do think you will have issues with minutes in the rotation.

What Shaka was trying to do was what Scott Drew did with Baylor in 2018-2019.
Baylor wasn't this unstoppable team that year and very much like Texas against OU this year Baylor lucked into a victory against Texas because Jaxson Hayes was called for a travel.

Problem is there wasn't a tournament for the Big 12 or NCAA.

Plus Baylor's run was only to the Round of 32. They just had a tough matchup.

 

[MGC_07]

The top spot was neck and neck between the conferences, according to the computers. BE, B10, AND B12.

B10 suffered from what usually plagues the b12, lots of depth, but few NC contenders.

That's why I have the edge to the b12, KU and Baylor were both legit final four teams.

I don't think the big 10 had anyone making it past the elite 8, if that far.

The tourney would have settled it.

I agree the Big 12 had better top end talent, but they had 4 teams in the top 34 of Kenpom, where as the Big Ten had 12(!).

 

[duckboy33]

I agree the Big 12 had better top end talent, but they had 4 teams in the top 34 of Kenpom, where as the Big Ten had 12(!).

It's all about how you want to evaluate the conferences. There's no doubt that Big Ten was the deepest.

 

[dragonhawk1855]

It's all about how you want to evaluate the conferences. There's no doubt that Big Ten was the deepest.

maybe the BT was so deep nobody could get seperation from the rest of the pack.

the BT only had 2 really bad teams. in NW and Nebraska,

NW was loaded with FR
Nebraska had a new coach who goes into his 2nd season with a completely new starting lineup as they have all moved on.

in this case the quality of the teams in the BT kept teams from seperating

the B12 only had a few teams that were any good so Baylor and Kansas fattened up their win loss records on weak teams.

 

[duckboy33]

maybe the BT was so deep nobody could get seperation from the rest of the pack.

the BT only had 2 really bad teams. in NW and Nebraska,

NW was loaded with FR
Nebraska had a new coach who goes into his 2nd season with a completely new starting lineup as they have all moved on.

in this case the quality of the teams in the BT kept teams from seperating

the B12 only had a few teams that were any good so Baylor and Kansas fattened up their win loss records on weak teams.

If this were true, the Big Ten would have had a really great OOC performance. And while they were decent, it basically showed what we all thought. A lot of really good teams.

 

[dragonhawk1855]

If this were true, the Big Ten would have had a really great OOC performance. And while they were decent, it basically showed what we all thought. A lot of really good teams.

that is a not a true measure to use, considering who they played take Iowa for example
they lost their 2nd game of the season to DePaul who was playing their 5th game in the Gavitte games BE vs BT challenge
then they beat TT then lost to SDSU on Neutral sites
playing @Syracuse W
Nuetral site vs Cincinnati W
a solid OOC schedule considering who they had to replace
Cook leading scorer and rebounder
Moss 5th in scoring
Baer 6th in scoring, 3rd in rebounding,1st in steals and 1st in blocks.
then Nunge and Jordan.

maybe just maybe the BT was/is much better than you want to give them credit for. to think the BT had 12 teams in contention for the NCAAT
that's more teams than the B12 has total plus the BT plays 20 conference games vs the BT that only plays 18. that means the top teams played the bottom teams twice vs some teams only playing NW and Nebraska once for teams to fatten up their wins.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

These arguments are completely biased.

If you want to use KenPom...

I haven't seen their ratings of conferences yet and don't believe they will because the season never ended.
Regarding the Big 12 KenPom has rated the conference #1 I believe six years in a row.


If you believe in KenPom you also should believe that their opinion of the conferences is correct as well.

The difference between the Big 12 and everyone else in basketball is the round robin schedule and the lack of bottom feeders.

Kansas and Baylor were good teams but it wasn't due to the conference
3-6 in the Big 12 would have been able to compete in other conferences as well.

But last year those teams weren't as good as they traditionally are.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Recruits have spoken in regards to the B1G as well.
Don't even believe they have one single elite recruit coming in.

Elite Recruits usually tell you where the basketball is being played.
Big 12, ACC and SEC

 

[duckboy33]

Recruits have spoken in regards to the B1G as well.
Don't even believe they have one single elite recruit coming in.

Elite Recruits usually tell you where the basketball is being played.
Big 12, ACC and SEC

3 of the top 10 guys (247 composite) are playing in the PAC 12

 

[GE Nole]

Difference between the Big 12 and Big East and everyone else is the Round Robin.

For example.
If you have four Top 20 teams in the Big 12

Compared to 7 in the Big 10

Not everyone is playing those teams twice. Might play them once or not at all.

There is no scenario where a team doesn’t play every other team in their conference at least once.

 

[dragonhawk1855]

There is no scenario where a team doesn’t play every team in their conference at least once.

fixed it for you

 

[Big_Blue79]

In regards to where Texas was at
We would never know. The season ended with two much left to be determined.

Shaka had complete emotionally control over that team. Something you want as a coach.

This reminds me of something I heard on a podcast this week re: HOF and draft stuff: the sooner you have to go to soft factors like "this NBA player won an Olympic gold medal" or "players really look up to him," the weaker your case is. Shaka allegedly having "complete emotional control" over his team sounds similar.

 

[Slickd0gg]

A10:
Richmond (25th nationally)

AAC:
Houston (14th nationally)

ACC:
Virginia (4th nationally)
Duke (7th nationally)
North Carolina (16th nationally)
Florida State (22nd nationally)
Louisville (Next in line)

Big 12:
Baylor (3rd nationally)
Kansas (6th nationally)
Texas Tech (11th nationally)
West Virginia (23rd nationally)
Texas (Next in line)

Big East:
Villanova (1st nationally)
Creighton (12th nationally)

Big Ten:
Iowa (5th nationally)
Michigan State (8th nationally)
Wisconsin (9th nationally)
Ohio State (17th nationally)
Rutgers (24th nationally)
Michigan (Next in line)

PAC 12:
Arizona State (10th nationally)
Oregon (18th nationally)
Stanford (20th nationally)
UCLA (Next in line)

SEC:
Tennessee (13th nationally)
Kentucky (15th nationally)
Florida (19th nationally)
Arkansas (21st nationally)
LSU (Next in line)

WCC:
Gonzaga (2nd nationally)

Where’s Nebraska??????

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

This reminds me of something I heard on a podcast this week re: HOF and draft stuff: the sooner you have to go to soft factors like "this NBA player won an Olympic gold medal" or "players really look up to him," the weaker your case is. Shaka allegedly having "complete emotional control" over his team sounds similar.

Have to understand coaching first.

What coaches want to do is be able to get the most out of their teams. Be able to control their highs and lows. More importantly use the lows to get the team to play better.

Very few teams can win without every getting punched in the mouth.

 

[duckboy33]

the Irish and oregon fans are the biggest blowhards in the country.

what's truelly sad is Oregon can't even win the weakass P12. a conference that just 1 team in Arizona runs just like how 1 school in the B12 in Kansas that runs that conference.

the BT has 12 teams that have a realist shot proven by having 12 team having a shot at the NCAAT this past season and have 9 team the most in the D1 Conference in the to early brackets.

Freezing cold takes. I'm sorry but I had to do it Iowa fans. Y'all talked a little too much shit about Oregon basketball