***Champions Classic Thread***

MGC_07

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Jun 29, 2016
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Updated records
Duke 7-5
Kansas 7-5
MSU 5-7
Kentucky 5-7

Individual matchups

UK-MSU 2-2
Kansas-MSU 2-2
Duke-MSU 3-1
UK-Kansas 2-2
Duke-UK 3-1
Kansas-Duke 3-1
 

lurkeraspect84

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Mar 4, 2014
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Memphis
Team
Kentucky
Untitled.jpg
 
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SpartyGotSix

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Jun 25, 2020
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Michigan State
Could always make a 2nd champions classic or add on to it and make it a tournament.

UNC
Villanova
UCLA
Indiana

It’s not as flashy as the OG but would get a lot of viewers.
 

lurkeraspect84

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Mar 4, 2014
43,665
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Memphis
Team
Kentucky
Could always make a 2nd champions classic or add on to it and make it a tournament.

UNC
Villanova
UCLA
Indiana

It’s not as flashy as the OG but would get a lot of viewers.
8 conferences and who's the last champion gets to play in the next years Champions Classic?
 

dukedevilz

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Apr 3, 2002
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Some thoughts on the two games.

MSU/Kentucky
-That's the best I've ever seen of Joey Hauser. Shot is money.
-Mady Sissoko is like 27 times better than I remember. My only critique is, he was left with Sahvir Wheeler twice on switches, both late in the game. And he didn't post up either time!
-MSU will be a contender to win the Big Ten. It's a combination of the Big Ten not having upper echelon teams, but also because MSU appears to an be elite defense with a balanced attack on offense.

-Tshiebwe looks like an easy pick to repeat as NPOY. Nobody is stopping him
-Cason Wallace is a gamer. He's someone you want on your team. He can do a little bit of everything.
-Was expecting more offense from Kentucky. I thought with better shooters around Oscar, they'd be near unstoppable on offense. I'm sure that's partly because of MSU's defense. But, also thought some of the UK guys were a little too passive, letting Oscar and Wheeler do the bulk of the work.
-CJ Frederick is an amazingly horrible defender. He got murdered on a couple of blow by moves. He really epitomizes that staunch Iowa defense

Kansas/Duke
-Jalen Wilson is a boss. Dude is ready to straight attack, every time. Made Ryan Young look like a little girl once. Looks like a legit All-American to me. Showed some tenacity on the boards, too.
-Gradey Dick needs to be more involved in the offense. He was silent the majority of the second half. And then he took over the last couple minutes of the game. Kid is very skilled offensively. I'd call more plays for him if I were KU.
-Dajuan Harris, as expected, is the perfect floor general. Always seems to be in control. He can manage a game with the best of them
-For being a relatively small team, Kansas is actually kind of frightening on the defensive end. They have a lot of defensive versatility with all of those guys that are between 6'6 - 6'8. KU is crazy physical. They're going to punish a lot of teams this year

-Filipowski had a lot of negative reviews just a month ago. Looks like he's turned it around quite a bit. He's starting to look like a top 10 freshman.
-I love Roach, but Scheyer has got to get Proctor more involved. How many of Roach's shots were blocked or heavily contested? Seemed like every time he went to the basket. Proctor is longer - and I feel like they could at least share the load more with point guard duties. Would also love to see Proctor utilized more in the P&R. That's where I think he's the most dangerous.
-Ryan Young on defense is cringe. Sooooo slow. He's a good offensive talent, amazing footwork, but I don't think his defense can justify 20+ minutes.
-Not a whole lot of screens or ball reversals. Felt like it was a lot of players just driving straight to the rim.
-I feel somewhat encouraged with the result, knowing that we shot horribly (esp. from the perimeter), ball movement was lacking, and we turned it over incessantly. Yet, we still had a chance against a top 10 team. And arguably our best player hasn't even played yet.
 

KUhawks34

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Dec 29, 2006
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Some thoughts on the two games.

MSU/Kentucky
-That's the best I've ever seen of Joey Hauser. Shot is money.
-Mady Sissoko is like 27 times better than I remember. My only critique is, he was left with Sahvir Wheeler twice on switches, both late in the game. And he didn't post up either time!
-MSU will be a contender to win the Big Ten. It's a combination of the Big Ten not having upper echelon teams, but also because MSU appears to an be elite defense with a balanced attack on offense.

-Tshiebwe looks like an easy pick to repeat as NPOY. Nobody is stopping him
-Cason Wallace is a gamer. He's someone you want on your team. He can do a little bit of everything.
-Was expecting more offense from Kentucky. I thought with better shooters around Oscar, they'd be near unstoppable on offense. I'm sure that's partly because of MSU's defense. But, also thought some of the UK guys were a little too passive, letting Oscar and Wheeler do the bulk of the work.
-CJ Frederick is an amazingly horrible defender. He got murdered on a couple of blow by moves. He really epitomizes that staunch Iowa defense

Kansas/Duke
-Jalen Wilson is a boss. Dude is ready to straight attack, every time. Made Ryan Young look like a little girl once. Looks like a legit All-American to me. Showed some tenacity on the boards, too.
-Gradey Dick needs to be more involved in the offense. He was silent the majority of the second half. And then he took over the last couple minutes of the game. Kid is very skilled offensively. I'd call more plays for him if I were KU.
-Dajuan Harris, as expected, is the perfect floor general. Always seems to be in control. He can manage a game with the best of them
-For being a relatively small team, Kansas is actually kind of frightening on the defensive end. They have a lot of defensive versatility with all of those guys that are between 6'6 - 6'8. KU is crazy physical. They're going to punish a lot of teams this year

-Filipowski had a lot of negative reviews just a month ago. Looks like he's turned it around quite a bit. He's starting to look like a top 10 freshman.
-I love Roach, but Scheyer has got to get Proctor more involved. How many of Roach's shots were blocked or heavily contested? Seemed like every time he went to the basket. Proctor is longer - and I feel like they could at least share the load more with point guard duties. Would also love to see Proctor utilized more in the P&R. That's where I think he's the most dangerous.
-Ryan Young on defense is cringe. Sooooo slow. He's a good offensive talent, amazing footwork, but I don't think his defense can justify 20+ minutes.
-Not a whole lot of screens or ball reversals. Felt like it was a lot of players just driving straight to the rim.
-I feel somewhat encouraged with the result, knowing that we shot horribly (esp. from the perimeter), ball movement was lacking, and we turned it over incessantly. Yet, we still had a chance against a top 10 team. And arguably our best player hasn't even played yet.
Agreed with your comments.

A lot was made of Dukes height (and rightfully so). But Kansas isn’t small. We are only small if we play KJ Adams at the 5. He plays a lot taller than he is. He’s playing because our freshman bigs have a long way to go. Every game they show flashes and they will get there when it matters most.

To your point: Wilson, Gradey and Kevin are all about 6’7 to 6’8. They all are smart, quick and really good defenders besides Gradey but he is a smart player and is active. Harris isn’t tall but is so good defensively. For the most part we can switch 1-5 which nobody can do. This is not going to be our best offensive team.

As long as our big men develop, this will probably be an elite defense and be the best in the country. The offense and the bigs will develop.

We had 13 blocks on a team that is much taller
 
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FaithPlusOne

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Mar 18, 2017
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Some thoughts on the two games.

MSU/Kentucky
-That's the best I've ever seen of Joey Hauser. Shot is money.
-Mady Sissoko is like 27 times better than I remember. My only critique is, he was left with Sahvir Wheeler twice on switches, both late in the game. And he didn't post up either time!
-MSU will be a contender to win the Big Ten. It's a combination of the Big Ten not having upper echelon teams, but also because MSU appears to an be elite defense with a balanced attack on offense.

-Tshiebwe looks like an easy pick to repeat as NPOY. Nobody is stopping him
-Cason Wallace is a gamer. He's someone you want on your team. He can do a little bit of everything.
-Was expecting more offense from Kentucky. I thought with better shooters around Oscar, they'd be near unstoppable on offense. I'm sure that's partly because of MSU's defense. But, also thought some of the UK guys were a little too passive, letting Oscar and Wheeler do the bulk of the work.
-CJ Frederick is an amazingly horrible defender. He got murdered on a couple of blow by moves. He really epitomizes that staunch Iowa defense

Kansas/Duke
-Jalen Wilson is a boss. Dude is ready to straight attack, every time. Made Ryan Young look like a little girl once. Looks like a legit All-American to me. Showed some tenacity on the boards, too.
-Gradey Dick needs to be more involved in the offense. He was silent the majority of the second half. And then he took over the last couple minutes of the game. Kid is very skilled offensively. I'd call more plays for him if I were KU.
-Dajuan Harris, as expected, is the perfect floor general. Always seems to be in control. He can manage a game with the best of them
-For being a relatively small team, Kansas is actually kind of frightening on the defensive end. They have a lot of defensive versatility with all of those guys that are between 6'6 - 6'8. KU is crazy physical. They're going to punish a lot of teams this year

-Filipowski had a lot of negative reviews just a month ago. Looks like he's turned it around quite a bit. He's starting to look like a top 10 freshman.
-I love Roach, but Scheyer has got to get Proctor more involved. How many of Roach's shots were blocked or heavily contested? Seemed like every time he went to the basket. Proctor is longer - and I feel like they could at least share the load more with point guard duties. Would also love to see Proctor utilized more in the P&R. That's where I think he's the most dangerous.
-Ryan Young on defense is cringe. Sooooo slow. He's a good offensive talent, amazing footwork, but I don't think his defense can justify 20+ minutes.
-Not a whole lot of screens or ball reversals. Felt like it was a lot of players just driving straight to the rim.
-I feel somewhat encouraged with the result, knowing that we shot horribly (esp. from the perimeter), ball movement was lacking, and we turned it over incessantly. Yet, we still had a chance against a top 10 team. And arguably our best player hasn't even played yet.
Your last point is the one that seems pretty standard for most teams in the event every year (except maybe when Kentucky got housed by 30+). Some optimism whether they won or lost on the idea that the other team is really good, which sometimes just isn’t true. I think KU probably feels the same optimism today about playing horribly and still getting the win against a top 10 team. So what you have is two teams that played almost equally poorly and both feel good about it.

I do think each team that played is going to have a good season, and I am glad that marquee names play each other early in the season because I think it’s good for the sport. But there is a tendency to read into potential positives.
 

dukedevilz

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Apr 3, 2002
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Agreed with your comments.

A lot was made of Dukes height (and rightfully so). But Kansas isn’t small. We are only small if we play KJ Adams at the 5. He plays a lot taller than he is. He’s playing because our freshman bigs have a long way to go. Every game they show flashes and they will get there when it matters most.

To your point: Wilson, Gradey and Kevin are all about 6’7 to 6’8. They all are smart, quick and really good defenders besides Gradey but he is a smart player and is active. Harris isn’t tall but is so good defensively. For the most part we can switch 1-5 which nobody can do. This is not going to be our best offensive team.

As long as our big men develop, this will probably be an elite defense and be the best in the country. The offense and the bigs will develop.

We had 13 blocks on a team that is much taller

Right. Kansas isn't small, just compared to Duke at the 4/5 positions when Flip and Lively are out there together. Your wings are about as long as it gets in college basketball.

Only thing I would add is, 8 of those 13 blocks came against our guards. Roach got swatted 5 times. Which is partly why I think Proctor needs to carry a bigger load. Roach is usually pretty good at blowing by defenders, but that wasn't happening a whole lot last night. Proctor is more suited for finishing with contact and against taller defenders.
 
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dukedevilz

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Your last point is the one that seems pretty standard for most teams in the event every year (except maybe when Kentucky got housed by 30+). Some optimism whether they won or lost on the idea that the other team is really good, which sometimes just isn’t true. I think KU probably feels the same optimism today about playing horribly and still getting the win against a top 10 team. So what you have is two teams that played almost equally poorly and both feel good about it.

I do think each team that played is going to have a good season, and I am glad that marquee names play each other early in the season because I think it’s good for the sport. But there is a tendency to read into potential positives.

Yes, but we were missing our most gifted offensive player. And that's where we struggled the most. And Lively is just returning from injury, so not exactly up to speed himself. If that was us at full strength, I'd say a 4 seed might be our ceiling.
 

FaithPlusOne

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Yes, but we were missing our most gifted offensive player. And that's where we struggled the most. And Lively is just returning from injury, so not exactly up to speed himself. If that was us at full strength, I'd say a 4 seed might be our ceiling.
I didn’t say Duke wouldn’t be a good team. I’m not even saying that you shouldn’t feel positive about their season. I’m simply saying that every year expectations are built up in this event on the assumption that the other team is as good as it’s preseason ranking. Or that they at least partially played to that ranking.

I think in a lot of cases that just hasn’t been the case. I thought both teams looked pretty rough for most of it. If either Duke or KU plays a B level game they would have probably ran away with it. I don’t think either really showed what they’re capable of.

I’m just saying that both playing badly and being competitive with each other isn’t really something that should necessarily give you a boost of confidence.

I will say though that KU inserting Dick late in the second half was big.
 

ravenman10

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I keep hearing the Whitehead is Dukes best player. How can you possibly know that? Hasn’t he been out since before the first game of the year?
Have you even seen him play a college game?
 

Crums Bald Spot

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Just wanted to tip the cap at the masterful coaching clinic Izzo put on vs UK. Multiple times, including several bigtime out of bounds plays, he put clown shoes on Calipari. Well done my man, well done.
 

Big_C_KU

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May 27, 2004
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My thoughts on the 4-teams.

You can see what UK is going to be with Tshiebwe on the floor. At the same time we saw how they were when he is off the floor. Not bad but no where near maybe the top team in college basketball when he’s on the floor. Dude is clearly the NPOY. That said they definitely need guys to step up as the season goes along. I’m never a fan of teams that rely so much on one player come tournament time.

I really think that Zags game helped MSU win last nights game. Realizing how and why they must keep up the intensity in the game. They executed their offense better than any of the 4 teams I watched last night. Returning 3-4 starters they had the most continuity of any of the returning teams so that shouldn’t be a surprise. Continuity is overlooked so much when we compare these top teams. With the transfer portal it should be one of the most important areas to consider.

I hope for Duke that Whitehead is the real deal freshman. I think if Whitehead can be that guy then there’s some real scoring potential on Duke with Roach, Filipowski, and Proctor but I don’t see any of them as a #1 scoring option. Didn’t see much out of Lively as he didn’t even look at the basket outside of putbacks. Duke defense should be good with the rim protection but they could run into some matchup problems when teams go small at the 5 and spread them out. KU had success at times especially late in the game spreading Duke out and getting driving lanes.

KU defense is incredible and will lead to a lot of offense. Will keep competitive in a ton of games with that defense. That said the shooting was expected to be an issue entering the season and it was bad last night. Have to figure out how to get Gradey a few more clean looks. Wilson always aggressive is huge for the offense. Need a guy who is a clear #1. McCullar has struggled offensively so far with his shot but I expect him to get better as the season goes along. KU reaching their potential will be all about the freshman bigs though learning their roles and positioning.
 

tw3301

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I just wish we would have gotten a 6 point win at home against Gardner Webb instead of a loss to Kansas.
 
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Kevin Bryan

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I just wish we would have gotten a 6 point win at home against Gardner Webb instead of a loss to Kansas.
Hey, believe me, a 6 point win at home against Gardner Webb is better than a 16 point loss at home to Gardner Webb. 😬
 
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ExitFlagger

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I keep hearing the Whitehead is Dukes best player. How can you possibly know that? Hasn’t he been out since before the first game of the year?
Have you even seen him play a college game?
He's ranked #1 by Rivals.

But then, Duke has two others in the top 5 too.
 

coryfly

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Duke with Whitehead will be legit. I think that is without a doubt true. It should be enough for them to battle with and possibly even be better than their big rival (UVA I guess??? IDK).
 

IUfanBorden

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Having him even attempt the screen in that circumstance was stupid, when he had 4 fouls during a critical juncture in the game. You don't put your bell cow in that position, ever.
With 4 fouls, you don't put your best player in a position to foul,i.e. PNR. Just fukin post him up. It ain't hard.
 
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Scotty00

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Just wanted to tip the cap at the masterful coaching clinic Izzo put on vs UK. Multiple times, including several bigtime out of bounds plays, he put clown shoes on Calipari. Well done my man, well done.
Speaking of clowns, why did UL schedule so many hard games for y'all's first three???