Top 10 coaching jobs in all of college basketball

[IUfanBorden]

IU dodged a bullet there.

100%......I mean I would've taken him...And probably defend him the way you guys do. Its allpart of the game...But JFC----him and Eric Gordon in the same b/c? With DJ White....

FUUUUUUCK ME....Probably would've been the first team though to vacate a title...Probably not though---Once KS was exposed, then resigned-- Dakich turned that team to shit.

One thing fo sure----Indiana as a team had the best ****ing weed in the Big 10....Facts right there.

 

[Villian07]

Henry went to KU, Wall wasn't committed to Memphis (very nearly committed to Miami until Cal went to UK, who knows really but it doesn't matter), and Bledsoe was an Ole Miss commit who flipped to UK. The only players who went from Memphis to UK were Cousins and Dodson.

*Also, Daniel Orton was a Gillispie commit but your "add 4 first round picks" point remains.

Good catch. My bad, I wasn’t angling at “he stole Memphis’s recruits” I just meant that the guys he brought in that first year came to play for Cal, not simply bc it was UK and the history/tradition/fanbase. Most kids commit to a coach rather than a school anyways, I think it’s stupid to think that if a college coach switches jobs, the kids he recruits should stay loyal to the school they committed or even signed to.

My point was just adding that hellacious class would/should turn any program around in a hurry, and none of them would have ended up at UK without cal except Orton, who turned out to be the worst of the bunch in a landslide.

And imo Wall was going wherever Cal was at, whether Memphis or UK. You live in Memphis correct? There was big time buzz before cal left on the premium boards about Wall being seen on campus with www during his OV and wall to Memphis was basically a “message board lock” before Cal left.

Which obv all could be BS, since the source is a message board. He had a strange recruitment to say the least. Number 1 player in the class, lived and played in NC but UNC and Duke didn’t recruit him much for whatever reason. I didn’t know he almost went to Miami, to play for Haith??, I can’t even remember who was there then but I don’t think it was larranaga. I thought Baylor was the main competition, bc of some kind of connection between Drew and some Clifton guy (aau coach maybe idk). But I’ve also read on here he nearly went to a hbcu which I don’t remember ever being mentioned so who knows, that’s been a while now, but still pretty weird.

 

[Villian07]

Wall did appear to lean towards Memphis, but I think it was more Calipari. However, after playing with Henry at the Nike Hoop, that could have changed. Here's an interesting story.

John Wall says he would’ve signed with Miami if Xavier Henry went to Kentucky

kentuckysportsradio.com

That is very interesting. Wall was the first to know Henry would be a bust lol. It’s crazy to me that players like that (selfish players) can’t see that in themselves and change their ways so to speak if nothing else to fit in and get along with teammates.

IMO that team would have went undefeated if Meeks had come back. (Gracious Jodie). A shooter was all they lacked, Dodson was a decent player, but he wasn’t in the same hemisphere as Meeks, especially when it came to shooting.

Wall was great and that’s what people remember, and rightfully so, but they were flat out nasty down low as well with Cousins and Patterson. Cousins was damn near unstoppable on the block. I mean they had 5 guys that not only got drafted, but 4 are all still in the league ten years later, with two being all-star caliber when healthy and in their prime. Super underrated team imo

 

[Crappy Davenpot]

I know----that was my intent. I wasn't disagreeing at all....

Sorry bro, think I started getting you and SI Hoosier intertwined. We’re on the same page lol.

IMO, growing up a Bruin fan, I’ve seen 3 teams that could have held their own against the best of the UCLA championship teams. ‘74 NCST who beat them, ‘76 Indiana great team, and Kentucky(can’t remember the year) when they nearly went undefeated and won the NC under Cal. All great teams. And yes, Indiana is a blue blood IMO.

 

[duckboy33]

I lived in Southern California for about 15 years.
This was right about the time Arizona was peaking with Lute Olson.
Arizona could compete with any school for any of the players on the West Coast.
Isn't as much about the National Championships as they spent so much of that time as a Top 10 program. At times a Top 5 program.

Oregon and Arizona State are beginning to challenge their supremacy and Arizona isn't really a fixture in Sweet 16s anymore but it really hasn't slowed down their recruiting.

Everything with that university is situated around basketball. Very similar to another Southwest fanbase in New Mexico the University of Arizona has a very knowledgeable fanbase that makes their presence known


All subjective. I can't argue with anyone who has them in their Top 10 though.

Arizona is still the top job in the PAC 12 but Oregon is much farther along in challenging that spot than ASU. In the last 5 years, you could make the argument that Oregon has surpassed Arizona on the court and in recruiting. However, Arizona is still a basketball school and has a much stronger following in hoops than Oregon. The big question for Oregon is how they do after Dana Altman retires.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Arizona is still the top job in the PAC 12 but Oregon is much farther along in challenging that spot than ASU. In the last 5 years, you could make the argument that Oregon has surpassed Arizona on the court and in recruiting. However, Arizona is still a basketball school and has a much stronger following in hoops than Oregon. The big question for Oregon is how they do after Dana Altman retires.

Oregon has been hit and miss. That has been for awhile.
Altman took them to the Final 4 in 2017. Hasn't been consistent enough IMO

Oregon does present a challenge to Arizona. That is true but it will have to be a lot more consistent than it has been .

 

[duckboy33]

Oregon has been hit and miss. That has been for awhile.
Altman took them to the Final 4 in 2017. Hasn't been consistent enough IMO

Oregon does present a challenge to Arizona. That is true but it will have to be a lot more consistent than it has been .

Since 2016:

Conference Regular Season Titles:
Oregon - 3
Arizona - 2

Conference Tournament Championships:
Oregon - 2
Arizona - 2

Tournament Runs (Sweet 16 or further):
Oregon - 1 Final Four, 1 Elite 8, 1 Sweet 16
Arizona - 1 Sweet 16

5 star recruits from 2016-2021
Oregon - 6
Arizona - 6

And the recruiting looks better if you go from 2018-2021 after Oregon had their breakthrough.

Point is, Oregon has done far more to challenge Arizona than ASU. And since 2016, you could easily argue they have surpassed the. Does that have staying power after Altman? That's the real question

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Since 2016:

Conference Regular Season Titles:
Oregon - 3
Arizona - 2

Conference Tournament Championships:
Oregon - 2
Arizona - 2

Tournament Runs (Sweet 16 or further):
Oregon - 1 Final Four, 1 Elite 8, 1 Sweet 16
Arizona - 1 Sweet 16

5 star recruits from 2016-2021
Oregon - 6
Arizona - 6

And the recruiting looks better if you go from 2018-2021 after Oregon had their breakthrough.

Point is, Oregon has done far more to challenge Arizona than ASU. And since 2016, you could easily argue they have surpassed the. Does that have staying power after Altman? That's the real question

I agree with some of what you said. Reason why I included Oregon.

But there is a chance UCLA overshadows you both if Mick Cronin takes the next step.
Very good chance they have a monster recruiting class in 2021.

 

[duckboy33]

I agree with some of what you said. Reason why I included Oregon.

But there is a chance UCLA overshadows you both if Mick Cronin takes the next step.
Very good chance they have a monster recruiting class in 2021.

My point is Oregon shouldn't have been thrown in with ASU. Oregon has turned the potential into results. ASU is still working with potential.

UCLA could happen. Mick was unlucky with his 2020 class but I expect he will recruit well and I think he's a good coach. The big question is how patient UCLA alumni will be. They seem to think the Wooden days are around the corner and they are not. I'm not sure how long they give Cronin if he's not winning big very quickly.

 

[sziegler]

The Lobos! They have coolest venue in all of college basketball. The Pitt

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

New Mexico St has passed them up recently...
Interested if someone will give Chris Jans a second chance. He is one hell of a coach.


I made the earlier comparsion to the fanbase at Arizona to New Mexico.

People who have never experienced New Mexico Lobos basketball will be surprised.

Passionate and knowledgeable fanbase.

 

[Villian07]

My point is Oregon shouldn't have been thrown in with ASU. Oregon has turned the potential into results. ASU is still working with potential.

UCLA could happen. Mick was unlucky with his 2020 class but I expect he will recruit well and I think he's a good coach. The big question is how patient UCLA alumni will be. They seem to think the Wooden days are around the corner and they are not. I'm not sure how long they give Cronin if he's not winning big very quickly.

My apologies I’m probly the only one that did that. Must admit I don’t pay much attn to PAC sports. Gave az st too much credit

 

[Crappy Davenpot]

My point is Oregon shouldn't have been thrown in with ASU. Oregon has turned the potential into results. ASU is still working with potential.

UCLA could happen. Mick was unlucky with his 2020 class but I expect he will recruit well and I think he's a good coach. The big question is how patient UCLA alumni will be. They seem to think the Wooden days are around the corner and they are not. I'm not sure how long they give Cronin if he's not winning big very quickly.

Not sure why any Bruin fan would think “Wooden days are around the corner”? There will never be another JW. In today’s game with players going to Europe or the G-league out of HS, or 1 year of CBB, then NBA...No team will ever win 10 of 12 or 7 in a row again. Ever. Talent level diluted as well.

 

[Villian07]

Agreed, didn’t even Walton and Kareem spend multiple years at UCLA, where in today’s culture no way they woulda lasted pst their freshman season.

Edit: I have no idea how long Kareem and Bill Walton stayed around UCLA.

 

[lurkeraspect84]

Agreed, didn’t even Walton and Kareem spend multiple years at UCLA, where in today’s culture no way they woulda lasted pst their freshman season.

Edit: I have no idea how long Kareem and Bill Walton stayed around UCLA.

Kareem couldn't play his freshman year. (iirc '72 was the first year freshman could play), and he started on 3 Championship teams.

Walton also stayed all 4 and played 3.

 

[Villian07]

Kareem couldn't play his freshman year. (iirc '72 was the first year freshman could play), and he started on 3 Championship teams.

Walton also stayed all 4 and played 3.

I thought so but wasn’t certain. Now flash forward to today and Divincinzo probably wasn’t on draft radars then played out of his mind in the championship game and bolts as a first round pick. Probly 3-4th best player on Novas team.

 

[lurkeraspect84]

I thought so but wasn’t certain. Now flash forward to today and Divincinzo probably wasn’t on draft radars then played out of his mind in the championship game and bolts as a first round pick. Probly 3-4th best player on Novas team.

Imagine having players stick around four years and not have to worry about being recruiting over due to them all being paid (Walton's own words).

 

[Crappy Davenpot]

Kareem couldn't play his freshman year. (iirc '72 was the first year freshman could play), and he started on 3 Championship teams.

Walton also stayed all 4 and played 3.

Neither Kareem or Walton could play due to the freshman ineligibility rule back then. Imagine Kareem and co. being eligible as freshmen! Glory road and Texas Western likely would never have happened. Bruins were 18-8 in ‘66 w/o Kareem and co. With him??? 11 NC’s in 12 years? The freshman team with him beat the returnees from the NC team by 15 points before the season. Think Walton, Wilkes, and co did the same in ‘71 to the returning champs.

 

[duckboy33]

Not sure why any Bruin fan would think “Wooden days are around the corner”? There will never be another JW. In today’s game with players going to Europe or the G-league out of HS, or 1 year of CBB, then NBA...No team will ever win 10 of 12 or 7 in a row again. Ever. Talent level diluted as well.

I might have been a bit hyperbolic but UCLA fans believe they are going to be among the top tier of college basketball (Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, etc.) once they find the right coach. Those days are long gone. They need to be focused on winning back the west.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

I don't know that for sure.

Maybe with the G League things will change.

But if UCLA can lock down Southern California, Bay Area, Vegas and Seattle they can win a NC.
So winning the West....That is good enough to win at a huge level.

From what I have heard there has been an emphasis on defense.
IMO that was Ben Howland's biggest issue when bringing players in.
Mick Cronin will find it much easier if players come into his program wanting to make a huge impact on the defensive end.

No more Baron Davis and Gilbert Arenas type of guards.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Neither Kareem or Walton could play due to the freshman ineligibility rule back then. Imagine Kareem and co. being eligible as freshmen! Glory road and Texas Western likely would never have happened. Bruins were 18-8 in ‘66 w/o Kareem and co. With him??? 11 NC’s in 12 years? The freshman team with him beat the returnees from the NC team by 15 points before the season. Think Walton, Wilkes, and co did the same in ‘71 to the returning champs.

Ben Howland showed what you can do with current UCLA.
Howland needed either Westbrook or Love to say another year.
Just hard to predict players. Westbrook probably was originally slated for two years at least.

Wasn't the exact fit. When you are at UCLA you have to create offensive talent.
Funny thing is his entire era was created by Luc Mbah a Moute.
He he came to UCLA and he was raw talent.
UCLA basketball program made him a NBA player with Howland.

Always the key to those Howland teams.

 

[Crappy Davenpot]

I don’t know and hate to revisit history. But if I’m Howland and I have Russell Westbrook to go with the talent he had...get that damn ball into Westbrook’s hands and let him put pressure on the opponents D and break them down. He was a triple double waiting to happen every game. He’ll he was giving Kobe fits playing against him in the off season.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Collison came from a track family.
Collison was in the backcourt as well.

 

[Crappy Davenpot]

Collison came from a track family.
Collison was in the backcourt as well.

Jeez, forgot about Collison. Was Shipp a guard or forward? The talent on those teams was obscene.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Jeez, forgot about Collison. Was Shipp a guard or forward? The talent on those teams was obscene.

Shipp came in with Farmer and Afflao if I remember right. Had injuries. Brother was a decent player in the PAC as well at Cal.

You could play him at forward and guard depending on the lineup.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

Howland had two chances to bring in additional talent.

His recruiting classes declined. Failure to evaluate.

Losing James Harden hurt. Harden should have been at UCLA. Then he brought in the wrong player from Riverside. Kawhi Leonard had attention from some PAC schools.

Then the second time was a complete failure. They had the supposed #1 player in the country. Shabazz Muhammad was good but not elite.
Lavine is another who left early. Lsvine probably would have been better served with an additional year in college.

This was right when UCLA threw money into their basketball program.
UCLA will put the money up in basketball.

 

[duckboy33]

I don't know that for sure.

Maybe with the G League things will change.

But if UCLA can lock down Southern California, Bay Area, Vegas and Seattle they can win a NC.
So winning the West....That is good enough to win at a huge level.

From what I have heard there has been an emphasis on defense.
IMO that was Ben Howland's biggest issue when bringing players in.
Mick Cronin will find it much easier if players come into his program wanting to make a huge impact on the defensive end.

No more Baron Davis and Gilbert Arenas type of guards.

It's tougher than ever to just recruiting regionally. Everyone has access to people around the country because of the AAU circuit. You could of course be fine if you theoretically got all the best players from the areas you mentioned but I'm not sure if that's realistic in this day and age. UCLA isn't just recruiting against Arizona, ASU, USC and Oregon, they will recruit against Kentucky, Duke, Kansas, etc. if the players are good enough.

Mick is the right guy though IMO. Alford's teams always had talent but lacked toughness and didn't play hard on the defensive end. You saw the changes Cronin brought in the 2nd half of their season. If he can elevate the recruiting, they will be a problem.

 

[hawkit3113]

Crap list

 

[Bert Higginbotha]

It's tougher than ever to just recruiting regionally. Everyone has access to people around the country because of the AAU circuit. You could of course be fine if you theoretically got all the best players from the areas you mentioned but I'm not sure if that's realistic in this day and age. UCLA isn't just recruiting against Arizona, ASU, USC and Oregon, they will recruit against Kentucky, Duke, Kansas, etc. if the players are good enough.

Mick is the right guy though IMO. Alford's teams always had talent but lacked toughness and didn't play hard on the defensive end. You saw the changes Cronin brought in the 2nd half of their season. If he can elevate the recruiting, they will be a problem.

The last time UK got a "UCLA" guy they paid with 3 years probation.

Come on. There ain't a damned basketball player in California worth three year of probation.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

UCLA is in play for a few elite recruits this cycle.
They already have one committed.

What duckboy said is correct but that isn't anything new.
Even when UCLA was winning at a high level they didn't get everyone.

Mainly because there is too much talent and coaches recruit their players that fit their system.

The ability for a coach to have his pick of players.
Not there yet for Mick Cronin but could be.
But at least he has the trust of the people at UCLA. They are going to give him the chance to build a team.

 

[ExitFlagger]

Crap list

Sorry, dude...maybe somebody will post the “Top 10 corn producing states” one of these days.

 

[hawkit3113]

Sorry, dude...maybe somebody will post the “Top 10 corn producing states” one of these days.

Kansas basketball

 

[ExitFlagger]

Kansas basketball

....will still be better than Iowa’s greatest team ever in a run of the mill year.

 

[hawkit3113]

....will still be better than Iowa’s greatest team ever in a run of the mill year.

We are going to take Kansas's wheat. Lol, get it, wheat.

I am so funny

 

[duckboy33]

UCLA is in play for a few elite recruits this cycle.
They already have one committed.

What duckboy said is correct but that isn't anything new.
Even when UCLA was winning at a high level they didn't get everyone.

Mainly because there is too much talent and coaches recruit their players that fit their system.

The ability for a coach to have his pick of players.
Not there yet for Mick Cronin but could be.
But at least he has the trust of the people at UCLA. They are going to give him the chance to build a team.

I might not have been clear. The biggest difference is they aren't going to pick and choose whoever they want on the West Coast (like they used to do). They are going to have to compete, not just with Arizona and Oregon, but with powers from all over the country. There's more competition and UCLA isn't as highly thought of as they used to be. That's going to make it tough for Cronin to quickly pass Arizona/Oregon and compete with the likes of Kentucky, Duke, UNC and Kansas.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

I might not have been clear. The biggest difference is they aren't going to pick and choose whoever they want on the West Coast (like they used to do). They are going to have to compete, not just with Arizona and Oregon, but with powers from all over the country. There's more competition and UCLA isn't as highly thought of as they used to be. That's going to make it tough for Cronin to quickly pass Arizona/Oregon and compete with the likes of Kentucky, Duke, UNC and Kansas.

Being an Oregon fan your opinion of this subject is somewhat biased.

UCLA has been "down" the last 15 years but during this period they had more tournament success than Oregon.

Oregon has been to 5 Sweet 16s on a peak...
While UCLA has been to more in a down period including 3 Final 4s

 

[duckboy33]

Being an Oregon fan your opinion of this subject is somewhat biased.

UCLA has been "down" the last 15 years but during this period they had more tournament success than Oregon.

Oregon has been to 5 Sweet 16s on a peak...
While UCLA has been to more in a down period including 3 Final 4s

It all depends on when you decide to set the time frame. One can always set the time frame to fit their argument. Let's look at the last 10 years. UCLA has one conference title in the last 10 years and haven't made it past the sweet 16. Oregon has made the sweet 16 four times over that period (and an elite 8 and Final Four).

The point is Oregon has made major upgrades to their basketball facilities over the last 10 years. That commitment can be seen in Women's basketball as well, although it's much easier to rise quickly in Women's basketball because a lot of programs won't spend the money for women's hoops.

Obviously you can move the time frame further and further back and UCLA will look better and better. UCLA has more history than anyone in college basketball if you go back far enough.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

UCLA had three Sweet 16s under Alford in a down period...

As an Oregon fan you want to believe that somehow you passed up UCLA.

Could happen. Don't get me wrong.
But like I have said in regards to Arizona. You have to be more consistent.

You went to the Final Four and then had a two year down period. Became one because of a late season run.
You had a decent season last year and were poised to make a deep run


But going into 2020-2021 you are back in a low period

Too many ups and downs.

Oregon has to on a decade long run. With multiple Final 4's.

 

[SheriffBufordTJustice]

What Arizona did was go on a 15 year run when they were pretty much a Top 10 team every year.

That is why some people say that Arizona as of right now is the #1 program in the PAC 12

From about 88-2003 Arizona had the talent, went on deep tournament runs, brought in McDonalds All Americans and stayed in the Top 10.


Oregon would have to equal this or both of these programs would have to go into the shitter


From 1987-88 season to 2006-2007 season Arizona was a Top 10 program every year
Most of these years were in the Top 5

Arizona Wildcats Men's Basketball Index | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

Check out the Arizona Wildcats College Basketball History, Stats, Records, Polls, Leaders and More College Basketball Stats at Sports-Reference.com

www.sports-reference.com

 

[duckboy33]

What Arizona did was go on a 15 year run when they were pretty much a Top 10 team every year.

That is why some people say that Arizona as of right now is the #1 program in the PAC 12

From about 88-2003 Arizona had the talent, went on deep tournament runs, brought in McDonalds All Americans and stayed in the Top 10.


Oregon would have to equal this or both of these programs would have to go into the shitter


From 1987-88 season to 2006-2007 season Arizona was a Top 10 program every year
Most of these years were in the Top 5

Arizona Wildcats Men's Basketball Index | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

Check out the Arizona Wildcats College Basketball History, Stats, Records, Polls, Leaders and More College Basketball Stats at Sports-Reference.com

www.sports-reference.com

Nobody is arguing Arizona is the top job in the PAC 12 right now. They have the facilities, commitment and fanbase. Nobody else in the conference has all of those things. However, the prestige of that job has taken a dip since the mid 2000s. Sean Miller got them close to being back but the NCAA cloud over the program stalled that momentum.

I don't really want to change the time periods with you all day to compare UCLA and Oregon. However, since Altman has gotten to UO and UO made major investments in the program, they have surpassed UCLA on the court and are going toe to toe with anyone in the conference. I think everyone can agree on that.

Now can UCLA turn that around? Of course they can. I actually think it's likely that they will with Mick. But I think it's likely they compete with Oregon and Arizona at the top of the PAC.

USC can recruit but can't turn it into results. I will believe their hype when I see it. ASU and Stanford are the programs to watch. They are both improving on the recruiting trail and are elevating their programs. People will get on Hurley because they haven't had a lot of tournament success but they are getting closer. Stanford with Zaire Williams will be interesting to watch.

As for 20-21, it would be a mistake to assume Oregon is going to be down. They could easily win the PAC 12 again. But it will be close between Oregon, Arizona, UCLA, ASU and Stanford. I think it comes down to the wire.