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Top 10 coaching jobs in all of college basketball

Villian07 said:
My bad, I was totally misinformed. Had no idea they had titles under the McCracken fellow. Never even heard of him to be totally honest.

My mistake, I should have worded it, “basically Indiana hasn’t done anything since Bobby Knight was the coach.” And even UCLA has had more success post wooden than IU has post knight.
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Not many people outside of Indiana,have heard of Branch. Won 2 titles....Over 300 games. If not for the entire program being on probation in 1960, he very well may have won another title...Also, he left IU in 1943 fro military service----returning in 1946.
 
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boilerzz said:
Mark Few told me this when he turned down the Indiana job. I asked Few, 'Did you ever imagine you'd turn down $1.5 million to coach at Indiana.' He said, 'Dan, we can win more than Indiana because of our conference, we have a better setup in terms of facilities.' They have chefs, they have private planes, they win every game at home without question. They can play anybody, anytime, anywhere. I would put Gonzaga with what they've done with that program, into the great job category in college basketball."
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This makes me happy he did turn down IU...

Better facilities? Was he drunk?

Basically he turned down the job b/c he understood how much easier it is to win in the WCC, opposed to the Big 10. Kudo's to him.

And Gonzaga still isn't a Top 10 job.
 
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SIhoosier26 said:
I always love this argument, I mean it's not true but it sounds good at least.

"Basically all of IU's success came under one coach," really?

2 of IU's five titles were won with HOF'er Branch Mccracken (their court is named after him. IU was also coached by HOF'er Everett Dean who played at IU before coaching them to three conference titles.

As great as Bob Knight was (one of the best) IU's program is bigger than him and it had national success long before he showed up. Every bit of UCLA's success was with one coach, that's not the case at IU.
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No. Larry Brown, Ben Howland, and Lavin somewhat, were also quite successful. Howland should have won a NC with the talent he had on the floor for several years.
 
boilerzz said:
Certainly not ones from almost 4 decades ago.
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C'mon, brother....Why? Dude, there isn't a SOUL in West Laffy that wouldn't give their SOUL, to have 5 national titles....NO matter how old they are. Shit, most sell for just ONE. Laughing

I just do not get what you guys make these type of comments. NO titles....TWO FF's in your entire history...

TWO....

Your most lauded coach in history, isn't responsible for any of your TWO Final Fours.

Yet, here we are....
 
Crappy Davenpot said:
No. Larry Brown, Ben Howland, and Lavin somewhat, were also quite successful. Howland should have won a NC with the talent he had on the floor for several years.
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Brown was at UCLA for two seasons: His runner-up finish in 1980 was vacated. His second season,UCLA lost in the 2nd round.
Howland: Went to 3 straight FF's. Reached one title game. Outside of those 3 seasons, he was very, very meh..Never got past the 2nd round...missed the tourney 3X's
Lavin: BUnch of SW 16's---5 in his 7 seasons. One Elite 8

Harrick is the only coach to win a title not named Wooden, though. 1995. HIs only FF appearance at UCLA...Did go to the ELite 8 once.

Success has been there for other coaches...But it has been very sporadic..

Also, IU spanked their ass in the 1992 Elite 8...SmokinSmile
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
This is a subjective list.

Each coach has their own list and most of them are different.

Indiana is one of those jobs that some people are high on while others not so much.
Indiana basketball is a different animal. Good chance if you are from Indiana you are going to have the job much higher than others especially if you are a fan.

More than that...
History is only important if you know how to use it. You can have had great success in the past but if you aren't using it schools who are having success today don't have to sell it because the recruits see it.

To me this is the difference between Arizona and Indiana.

If you are under 40 you don't remember Indiana basketball as a consistent program
But you do with programs like Arizona.
Duke is probably the best example. Arizona to a lesser extent.

Indiana as of right now only has 8 first round NBA draft picks since 2000. Respectable but not to the level of others

Including Arizona. As of right now they have 11 with for sure another one this year.




Hate to tell you but very few of these recruits even know who Indiana basketball is when you get outside of the Midwest.
They know Michigan State. Michigan always has hype same with Ohio State.
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This is absolute bull shit as usual, but if recruits somehow, "don't know who Indiana basketball is" IU can always point up to the five national championship banners and that will let them know pretty quick. If that isn't enough they can point to sellout crowds of raucous fans and millions upon millions worth of facilities from one of the 2-3 highest revenue producing college basketball schools.

Also, Indiana is a better job than Arizona and it's not close. If Arizona is such a great job what has Sean Miller won there? Absolutely nothing, I wouldn't even have them in the top 10. At IU even a horrific coach like Crean can have some success.

Indiana definitely hasn't been the same since Knight and needs to get back to their winning ways. That said, anyone pretending that IU isn't still an iconic basketball job is kidding themselves.
 
boilerzz said:
I was just sharing a quote from Few for Borden from when Few turned down the IU job.

Oh, I know Purdue isn't a top 10 job. There are an abundance of challenges Purdue coaches face which "bluebloods" do not. Which is why it's funny to me that Purdue has won 10 of 11 against IU (banners response in 3....2....).
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Exactly what "challenges" do Purdue coaches face?

What has winning 10 of 11 vs IU gotten you? See that is the difference in the expectations...We don't rest our laurels on beating Purdue....Want to, yes...But it ain't the pinnacle.

BTW, Purdue could be a Top 10 job. Or very close. Good tradition...facilities.....location. There isn't many jobs that are better.
 
Do you understand what subjective means...

You are from Indiana and are an Indiana fan so of course the school is still a big time basketball school.

But like I said the issue is that through a lot of people's lives they haven't been in terms of success.

History only means something if you can use it.

Just look at Indiana's recruiting rankings. I went over to 247 because they have a composite but looked back to 2014 and only saw one year in the Top 10....

Now compare that to the recruiting of Arizona.
Last 32 years Arizona has been a better program. Basketball fans under 40 for the most part would see Arizona as a better program.
Before 1990 they only had 2 first round picks in their history...
Things changed and they changed quickly.

Indiana has been a better program throughout history..
I don't think anyone would argue but history works in both ways.


If you ask me...
The history of IU just like UCLA is dragging them down.

While at Kansas, UNC and Kentucky it raises their level because they have continued to win.
 
Villian07 said:
I know you are an Indiana fan, but imo (and probably most others) IU is a helluva lot closer to the Zona/Louisville/Nova tier than they are to the UK, UNC, Duke, and Kansas blue blood tier. I wouldn’t even say IU is a much better job than Sparty at this point. But again I understand you think more fondly of IU just like I think more fondly of Louisville, bc that’s who we root for, respectively.

Also don’t understand the “stain of the ncaa” making you consider taking Louisville out of the top ten yet you still consider Kansas as one of the top 5 interchangeable jobs when they are staring at ncaa violations and uncertainty as well. Not to mention Zona Facing the same thing. Plus half of the programs on the list could have the stain of the ncaa, if the ncaa had to answer to anyone and show any type of consistency in their decisions, ie unc fake classes, Duke/Nike/zion. Then Louisville, Kansas, and Zona who have already been stained. And obv UK has been stained a time or two or three as has Indiana, although that texting stuff with Sampson was some petty ish to get bent over for.

As for the original list, I don’t see Florida as a top Ten job, nor Gonzaga. Also the homer in me doesn’t consider the Arizona job to be better than the Louisville job, especially since we are in the acc now, not hopping around mid majors like we were for a large part of our history.
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Just a few things....

1. Yes KU is starring at NCAA trouble...Key word: Starring. Meaning---NO sanctions yet. UL has been sanctioned, with more probably coming. That is why I didn't exclude KU. Same with Zona. Again, no sanctions. I don't see recruits leaving said schools due to NCAA issues...We have seen such at UL.

2. Indiana is a better job than MSU...MOF, any school in the Big 10. Don't confuse better program, success of late, etc, etc...with better job.

3. I am not putting IU in the same tier as UK, KU, UNC, Duke as far as success. We ain't talking about best programs(as of now). We are talking in terms of the job itself. IU belongs in that tier when it comes to the job itself..

Indiana hasn't lost its tradition....money....facilities...fan base, etc, etc...They have just made piss, poor hires. Folks see the lack of success, and think Indiana isn't a premier job. It is. The amenities haven't been the problem...The problem is the people overseeing those amenities..
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
Do you understand what subjective means...

You are from Indiana and are an Indiana fan so of course the school is still a big time basketball school.

But like I said the issue is that through a lot of people's lives they haven't been in terms of success.

History only means something if you can use it.

Just look at Indiana's recruiting rankings. I went over to 247 because they have a composite but looked back to 2014 and only saw one year in the Top 10....

Now compare that to the recruiting of Arizona.
Last 32 years Arizona has been a better program. Basketball fans under 40 for the most part would see Arizona as a better program.
Before 1990 they only had 2 first round picks in their history...
Things changed and they changed quickly.

Indiana has been a better program throughout history..
I don't think anyone would argue but history works in both ways.


If you ask me...
The history of IU just like UCLA is dragging them down.

While at Kansas, UNC and Kentucky it raises their level because they have continued to win.
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I don't think you understand the concept of "better job". Not whos had more success---but what job(s) are the best. Indiana hasn't lost any of its history...fans....facilities, etc, etc...What they have lost is the ability to hire a competent coach.

Again---Recruiting---coach...Those kinda of go hand in hand, wouldn't you say? Indiana hasn't recruited well not b/c the program isn't good enough...They haven't recruited well b/c they haven't hired well. And when you don't hire well, you don't win to well....And when you don't win to well....Well, you don't recruit so well..Even then, IU has still produced multiple lottery, 1st round picks the past few seasons:

Oladipo, Zeller, OG Anunoby, Langford, Vonleh....Bryant was the 42nd pick...Eric Gordon was the 7th pick in 2008. Ferrell has made a nice living in the NBA as well....

The talent/recruiting isn't as bad as it seems. And under Miller, its getting better and better. He's gotten the past 3 Indiana Mr. Basketballs: Langford, TJD and now Leal. And had Lander not reclass----he would have gotten a 4th straight. Of those 4 listed, 3 have been 5 stars.

Again----we are not comparing success----We are comparing jobs. If success were THE factor, then ****, UConn would be a better job than both IU/AZ...Shit for that matter---Wichita State.

Don't confuse who is winning , or who has had nore success lately, to who the better job is...It ain't got nutting to do with me being an IU fan. Its simply looking at what a school has to offer...If you think AZ can offer what IU can offer---then fine. I can get on board with such...
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
Impatient fanbase...

Tom Crean didn't deserve to be fired.

The Sampson thing went bad quickly. I think if Sampson was still there you would be much better off.

We will see with Archie Miller..
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Yeah, ummmm, Crean deserved to be fired..

Sampson was a panic hire...A good hire as far as coaching ability. Everything else was an absolute tragedy...I agree though---If KS could've stayed clean, Indiana would no longer be mentioned as they are. PLus, I think they have another title...Sampson can flat out coach.

And no, there is nothing about this fan base that says, "impatient". I mean dude---we put up with Davis/Crean for 15 seasons....
 
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IUfanBorden said:
I don't think you understand the concept of "better job". Not whos had more success---but what job(s) are the best. Indiana hasn't lost any of its history...fans....facilities, etc, etc...What they have lost is the ability to hire a competent coach.

Again---Recruiting---coach...Those kinda of go hand in hand, wouldn't you say? Indiana hasn't recruited well not b/c the program isn't good enough...They haven't recruited well b/c they haven't hired well. And when you don't hire well, you don't win to well....And when you don't win to well....Well, you don't recruit so well..Even then, IU has still produced multiple lottery, 1st round picks the past few seasons:

Oladipo, Zeller, OG Anunoby, Langford, Vonleh....Bryant was the 42nd pick...Eric Gordon was the 7th pick in 2008. Ferrell has made a nice living in the NBA as well....

The talent/recruiting isn't as bad as it seems. And under Miller, its getting better and better. He's gotten the past 3 Indiana Mr. Basketballs: Langford, TJD and now Leal. And had Lander not reclass----he would have gotten a 4th straight. Of those 4 listed, 3 have been 5 stars.

Again----we are not comparing success----We are comparing jobs. If success were THE factor, then ****, UConn would be a better job than both IU/AZ...Shit for that matter---Wichita State.

Don't confuse who is winning , or who has had nore success lately, to who the better job is...It ain't got nutting to do with me being an IU fan. Its simply looking at what a school has to offer...If you think AZ can offer what IU can offer---then fine. I can get on board with such...
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UCLA was docked because of its high expectations. Their expectations are even higher than Indiana.
Other things had to do with Howland getting pushed out including them giving him everything he asked for but he stopped producing.
Ultimately they want National Championships and not just Final 4's.


I see it as a double standard because Indiana also has high expectations. Your history is working against you.
Reason why you claim Tom Crean should have been fired.

Regarding in state recruiting.
You don't have enough players in Indiana for him to recruit just in state. You need players to fit your style.

If Crean should have been fired at Indiana or not is debatable...
But the truth is he wouldn't have been fired by 99+% of college basketball.

But because of Indiana's history he was
Same as Ben Howland


I don't include Duke in this discussion because they only have had elite success with one coach....

But the people who have flamed out at Kansas, UNC and Kentucky
Flamed out quick.
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
UCLA was docked because of its high expectations. Their expectations are even higher than Indiana.
Other things had to do with Howland getting pushed out including them giving him everything he asked for but he stopped producing.
Ultimately they want National Championships and not just Final 4's.


I see it as a double standard because Indiana also has high expectations. Your history is working against you.
Reason why you claim Tom Crean should have been fired.

Regarding in state recruiting.
You don't have enough players in Indiana for him to recruit just in state. You need players to fit your style.

If Crean should have been fired at Indiana or not is debatable...
But the truth is he wouldn't have been fired by 99+% of college basketball.

But because of Indiana's history he was
Same as Ben Howland


I don't include Duke in this discussion because they only have had elite success with one coach....

But the people who have flamed out at Kansas, UNC and Kentucky
Flamed out quick.
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Respectfully, I don't think you know what the hell you're talking about. UCLA can't even fill that small stadium.
 
boilerzz said:
Mark Few told me this when he turned down the Indiana job. I asked Few, 'Did you ever imagine you'd turn down $1.5 million to coach at Indiana.' He said, 'Dan, we can win more than Indiana because of our conference, we have a better setup in terms of facilities.' They have chefs, they have private planes, they win every game at home without question. They can play anybody, anytime, anywhere. I would put Gonzaga with what they've done with that program, into the great job category in college basketball."
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I see this more as a coach saying---"Where I'm at is best for ME..."

Also, never realized Few turned down the job. BUt then I saw who the source was---SO, well, there is that...Dan Dakich.
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
UCLA was docked because of its high expectations. Their expectations are even higher than Indiana.
Other things had to do with Howland getting pushed out including them giving him everything he asked for but he stopped producing.
Ultimately they want National Championships and not just Final 4's.


I see it as a double standard because Indiana also has high expectations. Your history is working against you.
Reason why you claim Tom Crean should have been fired.

Regarding in state recruiting.
You don't have enough players in Indiana for him to recruit just in state. You need players to fit your style.

If Crean should have been fired at Indiana or not is debatable...
But the truth is he wouldn't have been fired by 99+% of college basketball.

But because of Indiana's history he was
Same as Ben Howland


I don't include Duke in this discussion because they only have had elite success with one coach....

But the people who have flamed out at Kansas, UNC and Kentucky
Flamed out quick.
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Expectations at UCLA are not, "even higher" than at Indiana. The same? Possible. I doubt it though. The fan bases are polar opposite---As in, one exist---the other(UCLA) does not.

Tom Crean won 2 Big 10 titles....Had IU ranked #1....Went to 3 SW 16's. That is good---until you look at the other 6 years, or so. There was absolutely zero stability under Crean. Went 56-16 with Zeller, Oladipo, etc, etc...After that group, he went 84-53...Yes won a Big 10 title, but the other 3 seasons he finished 7th, 8th and 10th. Missed the NCAAT 2x's in those 4 years after the Zeller froup left. I am thankful for what Crean did for Indiana...But it was well past time for him to go. He was still trating the job as it was Day 1----Cheerleading, instead of leading...Still using the, "Look where we were when I got here, to where we are now..." Ummm, well Tom, the only to go was up, brother....Anyways....it was time for a change.

No,Crean wouldn't have been fired at 99% of CBB. But well, 99% of CBB doesn't have the tradition, history, expectations of Indiana, either. If he does what he did at IU, for Georgia? They'll give him a lifetime contract, and build a statue of him.

You make an excellent point with UNC and UK---bad hires that flamed out quick. There lies the difference today with IU, vs the UK's, UNC's, etc,....They don't dick around. YOu lose---you are done. Caeolina showed that woth Doherty...UK with BCG. IU? Not so much. Cannot remember anyone in my lifetime flaming out at Kansas????

I like Miller. I think he is the guy. YOu are right, he needs more than just the state of Indiana---But not much more. THis state produces ridiculous talent. Keep the studs at home, snag a regional guy here and there---Or an east coast kid ---And you are fine. MOF, you are in god shape. He keeps the state on lockdown, I'll take my chances with that.
 
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HoosierstuckinIowa said:
Respectfully, I don't think you know what the hell you're talking about. UCLA can't even fill that small stadium.
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What does that have to do with expectations...
Called the Ghost of John Wooden...

Still alive and well...even though you don't think people care about their program
Casey Wasserman tried to pull Calipari.
Was willing to pay for a coach out of his own pocket
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
Considering he inherited a program in shambles I wouldn't count those first couple of years against him.
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Agree---And I don't. But year 3 was a red flag. No reason for that group to only win 12 games...

So just for convo, lets exclude years 1, 2 AND 3..

In 6 seasons....

4 NCAAT
1 NIT
1 no postseason at all(17-15 in 2013-14)

Now, that 2013-14 season is telling. You just went 56-16 in a two year span. You are coming off a season where you were a #1 seed. And you go 17-15 the following season.? Ok, he lost some god dudes...But then the following year, 2014-15, he goes 20-14.......Red flag----again(see 2010-11 seasons).

Then, two years removed from a Big 10 titles, he goes 27-8, wins the Big 10...Ok, maybe we being to hard on Tom....??

Nope. Following that Big 10 title team, he goes...18-16, and loses in the 1st round of the NIT...

That just ain't gonna get it done, brother...Not a place like IU. Georgia? Sure. Indiana?

No.
 
IUfanBorden said:
Expectations at UCLA are not, "even higher" than at Indiana. The same? Possible. I doubt it though. The fan bases are polar opposite---As in, one exist---the other(UCLA) does not.

Tom Crean won 2 Big 10 titles....Had IU ranked #1....Went to 3 SW 16's. That is good---until you look at the other 6 years, or so. There was absolutely zero stability under Crean. Went 56-16 with Zeller, Oladipo, etc, etc...After that group, he went 84-53...Yes won a Big 10 title, but the other 3 seasons he finished 7th, 8th and 10th. Missed the NCAAT 2x's in those 4 years after the Zeller froup left. I am thankful for what Crean did for Indiana...But it was well past time for him to go. He was still trating the job as it was Day 1----Cheerleading, instead of leading...Still using the, "Look where we were when I got here, to where we are now..." Ummm, well Tom, the only to go was up, brother....Anyways....it was time for a change.

No,Crean wouldn't have been fired at 99% of CBB. But well, 99% of CBB doesn't have the tradition, history, expectations of Indiana, either. If he does what he did at IU, for Georgia? They'll give him a lifetime contract, and build a statue of him.

You make an excellent point with UNC and UK---bad hires that flamed out quick. There lies the difference today with IU, vs the UK's, UNC's, etc,....They don't dick around. YOu lose---you are done. Caeolina showed that woth Doherty...UK with BCG. IU? Not so much. Cannot remember anyone in my lifetime flaming out at Kansas????

I like Miller. I think he is the guy. YOu are right, he needs more than just the state of Indiana---But not much more. THis state produces ridiculous talent. Keep the studs at home, snag a regional guy here and there---Or an east coast kid ---And you are fine. MOF, you are in god shape. He keeps the state on lockdown, I'll take my chances with that.
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I get where you are coming from.
But you have to understand not everyone has that same opinion about Indiana Basketball.
Something you care about and you are probably frustrated by this entire ordeal.
People who aren't from Indiana or aren't connected to that program see things a little differently.
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
What does that have to do with expectations...
Called the Ghost of John Wooden...

Still alive and well...even though you don't think people care about their program
Casey Wasserman tried to pull Calipari.
Was willing to pay for a coach out of his own pocket
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UCLA didn'r have a strong fan base when Wooden was winning 900 NCAA titles...They sure as hell do not now. They never have. Its been a knock on UCLA basketball for a long, long time---And that includes the years under Wooden. YES they sold out their home games. But bro they traveled like Gypsies...

We are all aware UCLA wanted, Cal...But who the **** doesn't? Of course UCLA wants to win---Again, who the **** doesn't. But the two programs(IU/UCLA) couldn't be further apart when it comes to fan base, fan support, and ho they travel...UCLA gets more fans for a road game in ****ing softball, than they do for basketball...
 
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IUfanBorden said:
UCLA didn'r have a strong fan base when Wooden was winning 900 NCAA titles...They sure as hell do not now. They never have. Its been a knock on UCLA basketball for a long, long time---And that includes the years under Wooden. YES they sold out their home games. But bro they traveled like Gypsies...

We are all aware UCLA wanted, Cal...But who the **** doesn't? Of course UCLA wants to win---Again, who the **** doesn't. But the two programs(IU/UCLA) couldn't be further apart when it comes to fan base, fan support, and ho they travel...UCLA gets more fans for a road game in ****ing softball, than they do for basketball...
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That doesn't change expectations...

Most fanbases don't have a say if a coach stays or goes.
It is the people with money. A lot of people connected with UCLA feel like the program should be elite.

Can be 100,000 or 10,000 of them it doesn't matter just as long as they feel like the basketball program deserves to be elite.
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
I get where you are coming from.
But you have to understand not everyone has that same opinion about Indiana Basketball.
Something you care about and you are probably frustrated by this entire ordeal.
People who aren't from Indiana or aren't connected to that program see things a little differently.
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If someone see's Indiana basketball different than me, then they probably are not worth listening to. It has zero to do with me being from Indiana---rooting for Indiana, etc, etc...Look, I don't follow Texas football....But trust me---I get it. Why? Because folks in Texas look at football, the way folks in Indiana, look at basktball....AND----people who follow sports, know what these sports mean to both states. It doesn't need explained.

When I talk to folks about "best jobs", and they start with, "Well they haven't won much lately...", I tend to tune those people out. I know right away they just don't know. Places like Notre Dame, Texas, Nebraska------those places are ALWAYS going to be great jobs....Always. Same with places like Indiana. Places like those are hallowed grounds, man...Nothing changes that.
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
That doesn't change expectations...

Most fanbases don't have a say if a coach stays or goes.
It is the people with money. A lot of people connected with UCLA feel like the program should be elite.

Can be 100,000 or 10,000 of them it doesn't matter just as long as they feel like the basketball program deserves to be elite.
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Are you trolling?
 
IUfanBorden said:
If someone see's Indiana basketball different than me, then they probably are not worth listening to. It has zero to do with me being from Indiana---rooting for Indiana, etc, etc...Look, I don't follow Texas football....But trust me---I get it. Why? Because folks in Texas look at football, the way folks in Indiana, look at basktball....AND----people who follow sports, know what these sports mean to both states. It doesn't need explained.

When I talk to folks about "best jobs", and they start with, "Well they haven't won much lately...", I tend to tune those people out. I know right away they just don't know. Places like Notre Dame, Texas, Nebraska------those places are ALWAYS going to be great jobs....Always. Same with places like Indiana. Places like those are hallowed grounds, man...Nothing changes that.
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Maybe...

Urban Meyer said a quote he heard from Mack Brown after the 2005 season this weekend.
Meyer visited Austin and Brown told him he had good news and bad news. He had just won a NC was the good news and the bad news was that he just won the NC.

All these great jobs in college sports have a cost.
If you can't handle losing at Texas you can't handle winning because the fans become even worse after they win. Wins are expected and the fanbase cannot tolerate even one slip up.

Don't know if this is the case at Indiana but I do know for sure that every coach has to walk through hell when they take that job.
Because the fans want to win and those wins don't just happen all the time.
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
Maybe...

Urban Meyer said a quote he heard from Mack Brown after the 2005 season this weekend.
Meyer visited Austin and Brown told him he had good news and bad news. He had just won a NC was the good news and the bad news was that he just won the NC.

All these great jobs in college sports have a cost.
If you can't handle losing at Texas you can't handle winning because the fans become even worse after they win. Wins are expected and the fanbase cannot tolerate even one slip up.

Don't know if this is the case at Indiana but I do know for sure that every coach has to walk through hell when they take that job.
Because the fans want to win and those wins don't just happen all the time.
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But, well except, they do(mostly). Tell me the last time Kansas had a losing season....Or Kentucky....North Carolina just had their first losing season in 18 years.....Duke's under K last had a losing season in........1983; Yes I know, they went 13-18 in 1995. But K only coached 12 games that year. They were 9-3 in those games. BTW, the last KU losing season? 1983.. Kentucky's last losing season....1989; Though Pitino did go .500 in his first year(14-14).

And look, before Knight left in 2000, Indiana hadn't had a losing season in 30 years(1971)....Up until Creans first season, Indiana had not had a losing season in 37 years. In other words, from 1972(Knights first year), to 2009, IU had a winning record. In those 37 years, they missed the NCAAT 4 times. Thats it. And one of those years(73-74), IU tied for the Big 10 title, but the NCAA only took "A" conference champ. So IU and Michigan met in a "playoff" game, with the Hoosiers losing. They went on to play in the CCAT, beating #15 USC in the title game.

Look coaches at Kentucky.....Indiana.....UNC....Kansas, etc, etc....They know what they are getting into. They know the expectations. It ain't some kind of surprise. Some can handle that---some cannot. Same with football places like Texas....Like a Notre Dame....USC...Oklahoma. These places aren't the same as others. They are just not. Rather its fair, or not, is irrelevant. Its how it is.

And look, if coaches are bypassing IU b/c they are afraid of getting fired----Good. I don't want someone like that anyways.

Edit: I made a mistake. Indiana actually had a losing season under Mike Davis---2003-04.
 
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SheriffBufordTJustice said:
Every writer has subjective opinions on what schools to list.

Indiana is a weird one. People knowledgeable to the situation can speak on it better than me.

But I see it as a job coaches want to stay away from. Because they will end up getting fired.

I think there are numerous B1G schools that could be listed
Michigan
Maryland
Michigan State
Ohio State

They may not have the prestige of Indiana but they have the brand name, recruiting area but with less expectations..

Maybe not Michigan State after Izzo.
But Izzo showed what a good coach can do at a brand name B1G school.
Click to expand...
You omitted the school with the highest winning % and 2nd most wins in the B1G.
 
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SheriffBufordTJustice said:
What does that have to do with expectations...
Called the Ghost of John Wooden...

Still alive and well...even though you don't think people care about their program
Casey Wasserman tried to pull Calipari.
Was willing to pay for a coach out of his own pocket
Click to expand...

Jesus dude...that's what expectations are all about...fan support. Something Indiana has never lacked. Again, all due respect, you're not getting this.
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
Every writer has subjective opinions on what schools to list.

Indiana is a weird one. People knowledgeable to the situation can speak on it better than me.

But I see it as a job coaches want to stay away from. Because they will end up getting fired.

I think there are numerous B1G schools that could be listed
Michigan
Maryland
Michigan State
Ohio State

They may not have the prestige of Indiana but they have the brand name, recruiting area but with less expectations..

Maybe not Michigan State after Izzo.
But Izzo showed what a good coach can do at a brand name B1G school.
Click to expand...

Wait so your knock is if they don’t do well enough they’ll get fired? When you get these lists I don’t think it’s what job you’d actually want to have but more of where can you win at? It’s not necessarily, Arizona because of the weather and they won’t fire you if you suck for a few years. It’s more about where can you win and win big.
 
IUBtown said:
Wait so your knock is if they don’t do well enough they’ll get fired? When you get these lists I don’t think it’s what job you’d actually want to have but more of where can you win at? It’s not necessarily, Arizona because of the weather and they won’t fire you if you suck for a few years. It’s more about where can you win and win big.
Click to expand...

You aren't getting it....

Indiana believes that you should win big there and if you can't you aren't a good coach

The difference between Indiana and Arizona is Arizona has been winning.

I can give you the numbers

Indiana since 2000 has finished ranked in the top 10 once
Has only spent 7 of those seasons ranked in the Top 10

Tournament results
1 Final 4
1 Elite 8
4 Sweet 16

Arizona
Finished in the Top 10 seven times
Spent 15 seasons in the Top 10

1 Final 4
6 Elite 8
10 Sweet 16


That is the difference between Indiana and the other schools as of right now.


Indiana has the expectations to be like Kentucky, Kansas, Duke and UNC

But the results haven't been there.


This thread perfectly explains why the IU job gets docked by some when they create these rankings
 
The difference between revenue and fan support isn't much.
Arizona has the second longest streak of leading their conference in attendance. Only behind Kentucky. Been almost 40 years

Plus the last 35 years Arizona has had a lot more history
History is only important if people remember it.

Even if you look at recruiting....
Indiana does have their state, Ohio, Illinois and Michigan

But Arizona has the West Coast.
I spent some time out there around basketball. Arizona was a huge name with the top rated recruits

California and Vegas have a lot more talent than the state of Indiana
 
SheriffBufordTJustice said:
You aren't getting it....

Indiana believes that you should win big there and if you can't you aren't a good coach

The difference between Indiana and Arizona is Arizona has been winning.

I can give you the numbers

Indiana since 2000 has finished ranked in the top 10 once
Has only spent 7 of those seasons ranked in the Top 10

Tournament results
1 Final 4
1 Elite 8
4 Sweet 16

Arizona
Finished in the Top 10 seven times
Spent 15 seasons in the Top 10

1 Final 4
6 Elite 8
10 Sweet 16


That is the difference between Indiana and the other schools as of right now.


Indiana has the expectations to be like Kentucky, Kansas, Duke and UNC

But the results haven't been there.


This thread perfectly explains why the IU job gets docked by some when they create these rankings
Click to expand...
If Arizona had played Indiana's schedule they would suck to high heavens.

God bless man the Pac "whatever" sucks.
 
Bert Higginbotha said:
If Arizona had played Indiana's schedule they would suck to high heavens.

God bless man the Pac "whatever" sucks.
Click to expand...

Must be the schedule.
The last 25-30 years Indiana has struggled because the B1G is too tough for them...

Indiana would have done much better in the PAC
Would have made more Final 4s than you can count


Is this what you are attempting to explain
 
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SheriffBufordTJustice said:
Must be the schedule.
The last 25-30 years Indiana has struggled because the B1G is too tough for them...

Indiana would have done much better in the PAC
Would have made more Final 4s than you can count


Is this what you are attempting to explain
Click to expand...
Yes. The pac 'what ever' sucks.

That is what I mean.

The Big 10 is hard to win.
 
This is the last I am going to say on the subject

A lot of has to do with recruiting...

Sampson tried to change this with Eric Gordan and IU was slapped on their hand.

IU got into trouble for something that pretty much all programs do.

Someone said it has been the coaches.
But for the most part Indiana hasn't been bringing in Top 5/10 recruiting classes.


Until this changes no matter how big of a name some people think IU is they won't be up there with Duke, Kentucky, UNC and Kansas
 
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