The 2020/2021 ACC regular season thread

WojoRising

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Not really sure where to put this, and didn’t want to start a new thread. It’s blown me away how far ahead of Moore’s play Stanley has been early. Moore has a tendency to get tunnel vision and kill ball movement at times. Hoping that gets sorted out.
 

GE Nole

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Patrick Williams will only be in Tallahassee one year if he keeps playing like the last couple games. Still looks like things are moving a tick fast for him, but his length and athleticism are ridiculous. And his hands are freaking massive. Not sure how the Big 4 let him get out of Carolina.

16 points, 3 assists, 3 boards, 2 steals, no turnovers tonight in 20 minutes. 2-3 from three.
 
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AWilli6995

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Patrick Williams will only be in Tallahassee one year if he keeps playing like the last couple games. Still looks like things are moving a tick fast for him, but his length and athleticism are ridiculous. And his hands are freaking massive. Not sure how the Big 4 let him get out of Carolina.

16 points, 3 assists, 3 boards, 2 steals, no turnovers tonight in 20 minutes. 2-3 from three.

It seems like Roy and K slept on him big time. I have a friend who’s connected with the AAU circuit here in NC and he said the kid is gonna do some things at FSU if given the chance. I hope the kid does well along with the others from NC.
 

dukedevilz

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Wake and NC State offered him. Not sure what the deal was with Roy and K. I know we had zoned in on Wendell Moore for awhile. But, it's not like K is afraid to use multiple wings. So it is puzzling. UNC could have had a leg up on other suitors, one would think, due to the West Charlotte connection with Kennedy Meeks and Jeff McInnis. Looks like a nice prospect. Wouldn't be surprised at all if he's a OAD.
 

GE Nole

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Wake and NC State offered him. Not sure what the deal was with Roy and K. I know we had zoned in on Wendell Moore for awhile. But, it's not like K is afraid to use multiple wings. So it is puzzling. UNC could have had a leg up on other suitors, one would think, due to the West Charlotte connection with Kennedy Meeks and Jeff McInnis. Looks like a nice prospect. Wouldn't be surprised at all if he's a OAD.
Let me ask you something—and this is a real question, no flame intended.

If there are two equal prospects, but one comes from a great family with comfortable money and the other comes from a low-income background with a less stable household, is Coach K going to go with the guy from a better background more often than not?
 

dukedevilz

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Let me ask you something—and this is a real question, no flame intended.

If there are two equal prospects, but one comes from a great family with comfortable money and the other comes from a low-income background with a less stable household, is Coach K going to go with the guy from a better background more often than not?
Idk. I suppose it's possible, maybe even probable. I know Chris Carrawell, a St.Louis kid, felt very uncomfortable his first few years at Duke. It was a little bit of a culture shock and he felt like he didn't belong there. I want to say Sean Dockery comes from a poor neighborhood, too. I wouldn't fault K if he did that. Academically and socially some guys might have a hard time adjusting to a Duke lifestyle. I take it that's how you compare the situation with Moore and Williams?
 

GE Nole

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Idk. I suppose it's possible, maybe even probable. I know Chris Carrawell, a St.Louis kid, felt very uncomfortable his first few years at Duke. It was a little bit of a culture shock and he felt like he didn't belong there. I want to say Sean Dockery comes from a poor neighborhood, too. I wouldn't fault K if he did that. Academically and socially some guys might have a hard time adjusting to a Duke lifestyle. I take it that's how you compare the situation with Moore and Williams?
I did hear that about Chris Carrawell.

It’s hard for me to say whether other coaches would or wouldn’t do the same because so few coaches are in position to pick and choose from the top of the top recruits. But some folks I know in the coaching industry have alluded to that about K.

I am not overly familiar with Moore’s family background, but I know Williams had a rough go of it at times. I also know that by January of last year, everyone I spoke with about Moore and Williams said Williams was clearly the better long term prospect and had begun to show signs of being the better player now too.

Of course Hamilton isn’t your average recruiter from outside Carolina. He’s so revered in the Gastonia, Charlotte, Greensboro areas due to his own upbringing and “local boy who made good” story. I mean, the guy adopted his own brothers while in college in order to help feed them at Tennessee-Martin. First in family to attend college. Clearly he has a way with mamas from tough neighborhoods.

So maybe K never recruited Williams because he’s lost that battle to Ham before and didn’t want to waste his time?
 
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dukedevilz

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I did hear that about Chris Carrawell.

It’s hard for me to say whether other coaches would or wouldn’t do the same because so few coaches are in position to pick and choose from the top of the top recruits. But some folks I know in the coaching industry have alluded to that about K.

I am not overly familiar with Moore’s family background, but I know Williams had a rough go of it at times. I also know that by January of last year, everyone I spoke with about Moore and Williams said Williams was clearly the better long term prospect and had begun to show signs of being the better player now too.

Of course Hamilton isn’t your average recruiter from outside Carolina. He’s so revered in the Gastonia, Charlotte, Greensboro areas due to his own upbringing and “local boy who made good” story. I mean, the guy adopted his own brothers while in college in order to help feed them at Tennessee-Martin. First in family to attend college. Clearly he has a way with mamas from tough neighborhoods.

So maybe K never recruited Williams because he’s lost that battle to Ham before and didn’t want to waste his time?
I wouldn't be surprised if that is the case. I had wondered that at times too, to be honest. It makes sense, though. I mean, Duke is essentially an Ivy League school. And sure there is a talent waiver for the basketball players - and the team's academic advisors probably guide the players toward the easier classes. But, it's still Duke. The professors aren't just handing out free grades. And the social aspect of it is a very real thing. I think K is aware of that - and he probably tries to get a feel for how some of these guys might be able to transition into a preppy school. Jalen Rose certainly complained about it enough. He was a top 20 recruit. I think he was a little bitter that Duke never showed him any interest.

One thing I will say about K is he's very efficient with his recruiting. He will get out of the race quickly if he doesn't like his chances. His yield rate is extraordinary for guys that he recruits from start to finish. So yes, maybe he simply gave up on Williams knowing that he likely wouldn't sign him anyway.
 
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GE Nole

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I wouldn't be surprised if that is the case. I had wondered that at times too, to be honest. It makes sense, though. I mean, Duke is essentially an Ivy League school. And sure there is a talent waiver for the basketball players - and the team's academic advisors probably guide the players toward the easier classes. But, it's still Duke. The professors aren't just handing out free grades. And the social aspect of it is a very real thing. I think K is aware of that - and he probably tries to get a feel for how some of these guys might be able to transition into a preppy school. Jalen Rose certainly complained about it enough. He was a top 20 recruit. I think he was a little bitter that Duke never showed him any interest.

One thing I will say about K is he's very efficient with his recruiting. He will get out of the race quickly if he doesn't like his chances. His yield rate is extraordinary for guys that he recruits from start to finish. So yes, maybe he simply gave up on Williams knowing that he likely wouldn't sign him anyway.
All makes a ton of sense. A lot more sense than the line of thinking that would suggest K was simply unable to see the immense talent and potential possession by Williams. It's not like this was some under the radar 3 star kid.
 
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Quavarius

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All makes a ton of sense. A lot more sense than the line of thinking that would suggest K was simply unable to see the immense talent and potential possession by Williams. It's not like this was some under the radar 3 star kid.
And let’s be honest: K can be picky! That’s a luxury he has and many wish they had. But he built that because he didn’t always have that luxury (before he signed his first great class, he was recruiting everyone because, he couldn’t be picky).

It’s just like if you have the option to live in a mansion or the hood, which would you choose? No one is dying to move to the hood.

It does seem that folks (not you) who first would say Duke (basketball) is a “bunch of white boys”, which isn’t true. Then the goal post moves and it’s “oh the black people that play for Duke come from rich families.” So when one myth is disproven, another *concern* arises (thanks to Jalen Rose). I just wish men who were spurned by their favorite college would build a bridge and get over it.
 
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GE Nole

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And let’s be honest: K can be picky! That’s a luxury he has and many wish they had. But he built that because he didn’t always have that luxury (before he signed his first great class, he was recruiting everyone because, he couldn’t be picky).

It’s just like if you have the option to live in a mansion or the hood, which would you choose? No one is dying to move to the hood.

It does seem that folks (not you) who first would say Duke (basketball) is a “bunch of white boys”, which isn’t true. Then the goal post moves and it’s “oh the black people that play for Duke come from rich families.” So when one myth is disproven, another *concern* arises (thanks to Jalen Rose). I just wish men who were spurned by their favorite college would build a bridge and get over it.
Yes. I acknowledged above that it’s hard to say what other coaches would do because not many are in position to pick and choose.

But fwiw, the statements I’ve heard come from other coaches/peers, not spurned players. And none of them were in a negative light, just talking candidly about different recruiting preferences.
 

dukedevilz

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Clemson took down TCU last night. TCU squandered a 15 point lead with 7+ minutes to play. They actually didn't score a single point in those final few minutes and ended up losing in overtime.

I think Clemson is a little undermanned this year, but it would be cool if they were able to take down Colorado tomorrow night.
 

dukedevilz

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Decent night for the ACC.

Virginia Tech beats Michigan State
Pittsburgh beats Kansas State

Tough loss for Georgia Tech, unfortunately. Losing like this. Wow.

 
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FaithPlusOne

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FSU with a nice win against UT. UNC and Duke with bounce back wins after stubbing their toes, UVA’s defense looks insane, and NC State looks like they might end up on the bubble again. Will they get enough wins against good teams to get over the hump this year given their non-conference schedule is still on the weaker side?

Interesting year so far. Looking forward to the chaos within the conference.
 
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dukedevilz

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@GE Nole good couple wins for you guys against Tennessee and Purdue. My DVR didn't record the Purdue game for some reason. One more big game coming up tomorrow. That should be a good one, I would imagine.

Let me ask you about the Western Carolina game. I was surprised to see that was a close game. I work just a couple miles down the road from WCU - and I'll probably catch a few games this year. Do you think that was a game where FSU played poorly and/or WCU just played really, really well? Would be nice to see them compete for the Southern Conference title. Still a lot of good teams in that league with the likes of East Tennessee State, UNCG, Wofford, and Furman.
 

GE Nole

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@GE Nole good couple wins for you guys against Tennessee and Purdue. My DVR didn't record the Purdue game for some reason. One more big game coming up tomorrow. That should be a good one, I would imagine.

Let me ask you about the Western Carolina game. I was surprised to see that was a close game. I work just a couple miles down the road from WCU - and I'll probably catch a few games this year. Do you think that was a game where FSU played poorly and/or WCU just played really, really well? Would be nice to see them compete for the Southern Conference title. Still a lot of good teams in that league with the likes of East Tennessee State, UNCG, Wofford, and Furman.
The Purdue game is probably not worth watching, lol. Both teams looked worn out from the physical games the night before and the rims in that gym were bad. The entire tourney struggled to shoot. FSU went 1-17 from three against Purdue and the Boilermakers weren't much better. In fact, FSU didn't even make a FG in OT, but still won.

Western Carolina was a weird game. FSU led 11-4 early, then WCU got SMOKING hot. Tossing up 35 footers at the end of the shot clock that went in. Built up a 17 point lead with under 4 minutes to play in the first half, and it wasn't even FSU playing poorly, the Catamounts just were scorching the nets.

FSU quickly took that 17 point deficit down to about 8 by halftime and then just grinded out a steady, slow second half win. Patrick Williams scored the last 8 or 9 for FSU, most from the FT line as Western was fouling. Basically, FSU outscored WCU by 22 when you combine the first 5 minutes and the last 25 minutes. Then the 10 minutes between the 14 min mark and 4 min mark, WCU couldn't miss.

All that said, Western had a couple of cats who were quick and obviously they can stroke it well enough. Faulkner and Gibson were both really good, and Dotson was solid enough given the size mismatch he had. Wouldn't be surprised at all if they contend for the SoCon...IF they can stay healthy. Depth seemed really shallow. They led UGA with about 10 min to play in that game.
 
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dukedevilz

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The Purdue game is probably not worth watching, lol. Both teams looked worn out from the physical games the night before and the rims in that gym were bad. The entire tourney struggled to shoot. FSU went 1-17 from three against Purdue and the Boilermakers weren't much better. In fact, FSU didn't even make a FG in OT, but still won.

Western Carolina was a weird game. FSU led 11-4 early, then WCU got SMOKING hot. Tossing up 35 footers at the end of the shot clock that went in. Built up a 17 point lead with under 4 minutes to play in the first half, and it wasn't even FSU playing poorly, the Catamounts just were scorching the nets.

FSU quickly took that 17 point deficit down to about 8 by halftime and then just grinded out a steady, slow second half win. Patrick Williams scored the last 8 or 9 for FSU, most from the FT line as Western was fouling. Basically, FSU outscored WCU by 22 when you combine the first 5 minutes and the last 25 minutes. Then the 10 minutes between the 14 min mark and 4 min mark, WCU couldn't miss.

All that said, Western had a couple of cats who were quick and obviously they can stroke it well enough. Faulkner and Gibson were both really good, and Dotson was solid enough given the size mismatch he had. Wouldn't be surprised at all if they contend for the SoCon...IF they can stay healthy. Depth seemed really shallow. They led UGA with about 10 min to play in that game.
Thanks for the info. The 3-point field goal really is a complete game-changer. Crazy stuff like that is happening every week. Which makes it fun to watch, provided your team isn't in the thick of things.
 
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dukedevilz

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UNC and UVA both with brutal losses last night. Those teams face off against each other on Sunday in Charlottesville. Will be a rough week for whoever loses that one.
 
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jhmossy

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UNC and UVA both with brutal losses last night. Those teams face off against each other on Sunday in Charlottesville. Will be a rough week for whoever loses that one.
Both will be without key contributors too. Pretty important early season conference game too. Hoping the home court allows us to pull off the win but my expectations for any remaining game are pretty low. I think our defense will keep us in MOST games but we will have some blowout losses this year too simply because we can't score enough.
 

dukedevilz

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Both will be without key contributors too. Pretty important early season conference game too. Hoping the home court allows us to pull off the win but my expectations for any remaining game are pretty low. I think our defense will keep us in MOST games but we will have some blowout losses this year too simply because we can't score enough.
UNC's offense looks rough too, to be honest. Hard for anyone to score outside of Anthony and Brooks. And you guys usually double in the post really well, so just a matter of containing Anthony. Would be weird to see UNC in a 47-45 grind-it-out type game.
 
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jhmossy

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UNC's offense looks rough too, to be honest. Hard for anyone to score outside of Anthony and Brooks. And you guys usually double in the post really well, so just a matter of containing Anthony. Would be weird to see UNC in a 47-45 grind-it-out type game.
Football game this year was 38-31 Hoos. Give me the exact same score Sunday.
 

GE Nole

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So, fellas, any thoughts as ACC play is set to begin in earnest?

Feels like UL and Duke will battle for the 1 seed and any one of 4 or so teams will compete for the other two double byes.
 
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bignish

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So, fellas, any thoughts as ACC play is set to begin in earnest?

Feels like UL and Duke will battle for the 1 seed and any one of 4 or so teams will compete for the other two double byes.
I think so too, I have a hard time seeing Duke or UL losing more than a few games in conference play.

FSU and NC State should get the other 2 byes based on their rosters but I think UVA could sneak into the top 4 especially because the Wolfpack underperform their talent level nearly all the time.
 
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GE Nole

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I think so too, I have a hard time seeing Duke or UL losing more than a few games in conference play.

FSU and NC State should get the other 2 byes based on their rosters but I think UVA could sneak into the top 4 especially because the Wolfpack underperform their talent level nearly all the time.
That sounds about right.