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No 1 seed for Baylor

That has been covered, and you are running in circles. We both know that all the P5 teams play patsies.
True, so your winning % argument of the Big 12 is better due to an 81% win ratio is meaningless in determining Big 12 strength in relation to it's peers. The measurement requires a multivariate analysis

You make a broad statement about conference win %. I'm telling you winning % is only relevant to opponent strength. What is so hard for you to understand there?
 
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You make a broad statement about conference win %. I'm telling you winning % is only relevant to opponent strength. What is so hard for you to understand there?
They play enough games that your argument is irrelevant. If you feel the need to calculate winning % for the conferences against just P5 or tournament teams, then go for it. You appear to just want to run in circles when a number you don’t like is put out there. We both know that most nonconference P5 schedules have a mix of teams and the conference collectives will be close among all P5s.
 
They play enough games that your argument is irrelevant. If you feel the need to calculate winning % for the conferences against just P5 or tournament teams, then go for it. You appear to just want to run in circles when a number you don’t like is put out there. We both know that most nonconference P5 schedules have a mix of teams and the conference collectives will be close among all P5s.
You are just being simple minded here. SOS is the better determining factor of the competition played.
 
You are just being simple minded here. SOS is the better determining factor of the competition played.
And I am telling you that from top to bottom of a conference the schedule strengths will even out for the most parts, and P5 conferences as a whole will be relatively close. You say simple minded and I say the 30,000 foot view works when I have a decent understanding of the scheduling.
 
And I am telling you that from top to bottom of a conference the schedule strengths will even out for the most parts, and P5 conferences as a whole will be relatively close. You say simple minded and I say the 30,000 foot view works when I have a decent understanding of the scheduling.
If you have a decent understanding of scheduling then compare the conferences as it relates to SOS and wins. Take SEC vs Big12, otherwise the 81% point means nothing.
 
If you have a decent understanding of scheduling then compare the conferences as it relates to SOS and wins. Take SEC vs Big12, otherwise the 81% point means nothing.
The SEC won 74% of nonconference games for your information. We all know that Kentucky & Kansas have tougher nonconference schedules than Oklahoma St & Vanderbilt.
If you have a decent understanding of scheduling then compare the conferences as it relates to SOS and wins. Take SEC vs Big12, otherwise the 81% point means nothing.
How about the fact that the B12 was 9-7 against the SEC this year. Is that specific enough for you?
 
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The SEC won 74% of nonconference games for your information. We all know that Kentucky & Kansas have tougher nonconference schedules than Oklahoma St & Vanderbilt.

How about the fact that the B12 was 9-7 against the SEC this year. Is that specific enough for you?

For some reason, only the games played on that one Saturday matter. Just 'cause.
 
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Here are some of the Big 12's top OOC wins...

Texas Tech 57-52 over Tennessee
Texas 52-51 over Tennessee
Baylor 57-36 over Villanova
Iowa St 73-53 over Iowa
Oklahoma 88-66 over Arkansas
West Virginia 56-53 over Uconn
KU 87-74 over Michigan St
Baylor 75-58 over Michigan St
Iowa St 78-59 @ Memphis
Iowa St 64-58 @ Creighton
TCU 77-68 over LSU
TCU 68-64 over Texas A&M
Baylor 78-70 @ Oregon
Iowa St 82-70 over Xavier
Oklahoma 74-67 over Florida
West Virginia @ UAB 65-59
KU @ St John's 95-75

Notice that a lot of them were won by teams that would be considered underdogs. Some would be big underdogs. And a lot were blowouts.
 
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The SEC won 74% of nonconference games for your information. We all know that Kentucky & Kansas have tougher nonconference schedules than Oklahoma St & Vanderbilt.

How about the fact that the B12 was 9-7 against the SEC this year. Is that specific enough for you?
The SEC won the Big 12/SEC challenge which attempts to match equal strengths. Is that specific enough for you. Btw, Tennessee/Kansas played more compatible difficult schedules. Regarding non conference SOS Tenn played the 46th toughest and Kansas the 50th, which is almost equal.
 
So every team but kstate has a pretty nice ooc win? Thats Pretty impressive.

But all in all, All this conference honking is for losers, if you make the final four or cut down the nets i guarentee no one will give a damn how strong or weak your conference was during the regular season.
 
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The SEC won the Big 12/SEC challenge which attempts to match equal strengths. Is that specific enough for you. Btw, Tennessee/Kansas played more compatible difficult schedules. Regarding non conference SOS Tenn played the 46th toughest and Kansas the 50th, which is almost equal.
LOL!!
 
The SEC won the Big 12/SEC challenge which attempts to match equal strengths. Is that specific enough for you. Btw, Tennessee/Kansas played more compatible difficult schedules. Regarding non conference SOS Tenn played the 46th toughest and Kansas the 50th, which is almost equal.
Your #4 team hosting the last-place Big 12 team is not matching strengths. Nor is your top team hosting the #8 team. Among others.

The SEC had the favorite in a majority of the 16 games played and still lost 9 of them.
 
Your #4 team hosting the last-place Big 12 team is not matching strengths. Nor is your top team hosting the #8 team. Among others.

The SEC had the favorite in a majority of the 16 games played and still lost 9 of them.
Are you arguing that they don't attempt to match strengths, cause that is what I posted? The SEC did not lose 9 in the challenge. Who did the Big 12 beat outside of the challenge and who beat them?
 
Are you arguing that they don't attempt to match strengths, cause that is what I posted? The SEC did not lose 9 in the challenge. Who did the Big 12 beat outside of the challenge and who beat them?

Why should anyone care what they're attempting to do? The bottom line is there were a lot of mismatches on paper that favored the SEC over those 16 games. The Big 12 had a few (like Tech hosting Miss St and KU hosting Missouri), but not many.

The only game the Big 12 lost outside of the challenge was K-State losing to Arkansas. Oklahoma blew out Arkansas and beat Florida. Texas Tech beat Tenn. TCU beat A&M. KU beat Missouri.
 
Why should anyone care what they're attempting to do? The bottom line is there were a lot of mismatches on paper that favored the SEC over those 16 games. The Big 12 had a few (like Tech hosting Miss St and KU hosting Missouri), but not many.

The only game the Big 12 lost outside of the challenge was K-State losing to Arkansas. Oklahoma blew out Arkansas and beat Florida. Texas Tech beat Tenn. TCU beat A&M. KU beat Missouri.
It is relative to the desire to make the challenge the most competitive, that is why you should care.
 
Until they start having a mid season sec/big12 tournament theres gonna be no settling this ridiculous back and forth.

what i dont get is who cares???? Do yoy think if the big12 had won every game except the KU/UK game would that be some kind of solace for the shellacking UK put on them. Who roots for their in conference rivals to do well period.

The only thing that matters is yet to happen. No one will give a flying fk about the sec or big12s strength of conference if neither gets a team to the final four. Just like the sec/big12 challenge results will be meaningless if one conf gets more teams in the SS/E8/FF and even then unless one wins it all, it will still be rather pointless (hence the pac12s run lst year and how it didnt even slightly change the average outlook of the pac12 being a trash league)

Besides yall act like youd care if every other team in ur conf lost first round as long as it meant ur team is going to the final four. Conference honking is for losing teams to have something to brag about. If ur winning tourney games in march, the rest of your conference will be the last thing on your mind.
 
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They are going to be in jail anytime.
Ur probly one of the few that thinks the whole premise of paying recruits started in 2016, and it only started to keep players away from UK bc cal was on such a roll recruiting the good ole fashioned way 🤣
 
It is relative to the desire to make the challenge the most competitive, that is why you should care.
Outside of the challenge:

(N) Ark over KSU - Ark favored
(@) KU over Mizz - KU favored
(N) TCU over aTm - TCU favored
(N) TT over Tenn - Tenn favored
(@) OU over FLA - FLA favored
(N) OU over Ark - OU favored

Big 12 went 5-1 outside of the challenge with the SEC favored in half the games. Interesting how I indicated the overall nonconference winning % of the B12 was 7% higher than the SEC, and the B12 won 56% of the games against the SEC. I think you get the point.
 
Until they start having a mid season sec/big12 tournament theres gonna be no settling this ridiculous back and forth.

what i dont get is who cares???? Do yoy think if the big12 had won every game except the KU/UK game would that be some kind of solace for the shellacking UK put on them. Who roots for their in conference rivals to do well period.

The only thing that matters is yet to happen. No one will give a flying fk about the sec or big12s strength of conference if neither gets a team to the final four. Just like the sec/big12 challenge results will be meaningless if one conf gets more teams in the SS/E8/FF and even then unless one wins it all, it will still be rather pointless (hence the pac12s run lst year and how it didnt even slightly change the average outlook of the pac12 being a trash league)

Besides yall act like youd care if every other team in ur conf lost first round as long as it meant ur team is going to the final four. Conference honking is for losing teams to have something to brag about. If ur winning tourney games in march, the rest of your conference will be the last thing on your mind.
Dude...it's called passing time while working. Is it any more ridiculous than any other back and forth on here? 🤣
 
Until they start having a mid season sec/big12 tournament theres gonna be no settling this ridiculous back and forth.

what i dont get is who cares???? Do yoy think if the big12 had won every game except the KU/UK game would that be some kind of solace for the shellacking UK put on them. Who roots for their in conference rivals to do well period.

The only thing that matters is yet to happen. No one will give a flying fk about the sec or big12s strength of conference if neither gets a team to the final four. Just like the sec/big12 challenge results will be meaningless if one conf gets more teams in the SS/E8/FF and even then unless one wins it all, it will still be rather pointless (hence the pac12s run lst year and how it didnt even slightly change the average outlook of the pac12 being a trash league)

Besides yall act like youd care if every other team in ur conf lost first round as long as it meant ur team is going to the final four. Conference honking is for losing teams to have something to brag about. If ur winning tourney games in march, the rest of your conference will be the last thing on your mind.
Interesting take as recent history suggests that the B12 will be there. Baylor wins the title last year and Tech loses the championship game in OT in the prior tournament.
 
Outside of the challenge:

(N) Ark over KSU - Ark favored
(@) KU over Mizz - KU favored
(N) TCU over aTm - TCU favored
(N) TT over Tenn - Tenn favored
(@) OU over FLA - FLA favored
(N) OU over Ark - OU favored

Big 12 went 5-1 outside of the challenge with the SEC favored in half the games. Interesting how I indicated the overall nonconference winning % of the B12 was 7% higher than the SEC, and the B12 won 56% of the games against the SEC. I think you get the point.
However, you are discounting the facts that y'all lost the challenge and your flagship team got the brakes beat off them at home
 
However, you are discounting the facts that y'all lost the challenge and your flagship team got the brakes beat off them at home
I will take the overall ass kicking as opposed to a one day slate every time. You are mistaken about flagship team as the B12 has sent other teams to the title game recently. The B12 obviously isn’t a one team conference, but I am not sure you can say that about the SEC. I guess Auburn did get to a F4 the year Tech went to the final.
 
I will take the overall ass kicking as opposed to a one day slate every time. You are mistaken about flagship team as the B12 has sent other teams to the title game recently. The B12 obviously isn’t a one team conference, but I am not sure you can say that about the SEC. I guess Auburn did get to a F4 the year Tech went to the final.
I'll take the match up of strength rated match ups every time. Finally, this discussion is not about history of the past. It is about this year and Kansas is the Flagship this year, so you are wrong.
 
I'll take the match up of strength rated match ups every time. Finally, this discussion is not about history of the past. It is about this year and Kansas is the Flagship this year, so you are wrong.
Are they now? There is a #1 seed defending National Champion and a finalist two years ago that just don’t agree with you. BTW, how high of seed is the SEC top team?
 
Are they now? There is a #1 seed defending National Champion and a finalist two years ago that just don’t agree with you. BTW, how high of seed is the SEC top team?
Don't be an idiot, Kansas is the highest rated Big12 team using any metric this year. Seeds have no bearing on how good a team is and that is proved by the fact that Tennessee is a better team than Baylor based on grading measurements. What some team did in 1973 or 1985 has no bearing on how good/bad a team is this year.

We are talking about this year, got it?
 
Don't be an idiot, Kansas is the highest rated Big12 team using any metric this year. Seeds have no bearing on how good a team is and that is proved by the fact that Tennessee is a better team than Baylor based on grading measurements. What some team did in 1973 or 1985 has no bearing on how good/bad a team is this year.

We are talking about this year, got it?
LOL!! You are right as the committee put Tenn on the 3 line because they are so strong. Keep in mind that Tenn played multiple B12 teams this year and didn’t beat any. Sorry, your argument just doesn’t hold water. But I guess the feather in their cap is they split with KY.
 
LOL!! You are right as the committee put Tenn on the 3 line because they are so strong. Keep in mind that Tenn played multiple B12 teams this year and didn’t beat any. Sorry, your argument just doesn’t hold water. But I guess the feather in their cap is they split with KY.
It is obvious that you are just not very smart. Tennessee beat Arizona (top overall seed), UNC, Auburn and Kentucky Twice (the same UK that boat raced Kansas at home).
Tennessee is currently ranked 5th in the nation. Tennessee is 4-1 against the Top 5 before Championship games.

Not does Tennessee hold water, they are drowning you in it.:cool:
 
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It is obvious that you are just not very smart. Tennessee beat Arizona (top overall seed), UNC, Auburn and Kentucky Twice (the same UK that boat raced Kansas at home).
Tennessee is currently ranked 5th in the nation. Tennessee is 4-1 against the Top 5 before Championship games.

Not does Tennessee hold water, they are drowning you in it.:cool:
I can see you at the stage when they were handing the National Championship trophy to Scott Drew saying “ but..but…but”;)
 
I can see you at the stage when they were handing the National Championship trophy to Scott Drew saying “ but..but…but”;)
I can see you're at the stage when you can't refute facts so you're left mumbling some BS.🤣
 
Don't be an idiot, Kansas is the highest rated Big12 team using any metric this year. Seeds have no bearing on how good a team is and that is proved by the fact that Tennessee is a better team than Baylor based on grading measurements. What some team did in 1973 or 1985 has no bearing on how good/bad a team is this year.

We are talking about this year, got it?
You're starting to sound a lot like a certain Auburn fan.

“Only games that help my argument matter”
“Only metrics that help my argument matter”

Which metric shows Tennessee as better than Baylor? Not Kenpom, and that’s the one you’ve been citing.

For the record, I think Tennessee is better than Baylor right now, but there’s no need to make up facts.
 
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I can see you're at the stage when you can't refute facts so you're left mumbling some BS.🤣
Just goes to show you how strong the B12 is that the juggernaut Tenn couldn't handle the 3rd or 4th place B12 teams, but beat other conferences' strong teams. Are those the facts you want?
 
You're starting to sound a lot like a certain Auburn fan.

“Only games that help my argument matter”
“Only metrics that help my argument matter”

Which metric shows Tennessee as better than Baylor? Not Kenpom, and that’s the one you’ve been citing.

For the record, I think Tennessee is better than Baylor right now, but there’s no need to make up facts.
I have already stated them earlier in the thread. if you think UT>Baylor then why enter into. Just for the sake of arguing?

I said Kansas is the Flagship Bi12 program this year. I also said history has nothing to do with this year. Agree or not?
 
Just goes to show you how strong the B12 is that the juggernaut Tenn couldn't handle the 3rd or 4th place B12 teams, but beat other conferences' strong teams. Are those the facts you want?
Tennessee beat UK which beat y'alls best team like a drum. That fact work for you?

SEC won Challenge
 
I have already stated them earlier in the thread. if you think UT>Baylor then why enter into. Just for the sake of arguing?

I said Kansas is the Flagship Bi12 program this year. I also said history has nothing to do with this year. Agree or not?

Because you’re saying the metrics show that Tenn is better than Baylor. I haven’t seen any that have Tennessee ranked higher.
 
Tennessee beat UK which beat y'alls best team like a drum. That fact work for you?

SEC won Challenge
Once again shows you how strong the B12 is. That 81% should be looking better and better to you. We get to see a glimpse of how the conferences may fare against each other right off the bat as my Clones face LSU on Friday.
 
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