Wendell Carter's mom says......

[Dattier]

But blacks killing whites is more than twice the number than that of whites killing blacks.

I haven't denied the disproportionate % of crime by race. I've objected to a particular frame, which is only used as a comeback to any assertion of racism and as a means of blaming entire communities of color.

Even here, you think the big story is defending white people and blaming black people. Your entire justification of the term "black-on-black crime" is essentially that they deserve it.

Also, you're nitpicking again at the "black-on-black" phrase? A construct arrived at by supremacist thinking? Does it bother you when Ray Lewis and Deion Sanders mention it?

Like willful ignorance about the terms "privilege" and "systemic racism," a whole bunch of conservatives sure seem to be willfully ignorant about the use of the term "supremacist." None of the three is a slight or criticism against white people or any individual. That's b/c their very existence is systemic, institutionalized, implicit, subconscious, etc. No one has ill-intent. It doesn't matter, then, whether it's Ray Lewis or Billy Ray Cyrus.

Y'all got the idea of "institutionalized" just fine back when it was Red telling the boys in the yard at Shawshank about it. Ever since, you've been Floyd.

 

[Dattier]

I’m not a protesting type of guy, but if there was anything I would protest for it would be for increased teacher wages. I’m not even a teacher, but I think they need to get about double (average) what they are currently getting paid. I have no clue why we don’t value the people who are teaching our children. It’s really crazy. I’ve had multiple conversations with my local representatives about this very topic.

Thanks... but...

I've been in public ed my entire life, including the 9 months before that. My Mom was a teacher when she was pregnant with me. My Dad was a teacher until I was 7. I went to public school k-12, undergrad, and grad school. I was a teacher right out of college and I've worked in public schools ever since. (I was at Duke for 15 years, but it was my side job.)

I've heard people express support for public ed my entire life, too. I've rarely felt it. I appreciate words to that effect, but I don't often know if I can trust them. They ring hollow after enough years of the disconnect between what you hear and what you experience.

It's not you. It's me. I love your words... I'm just not in love with them... You don't wanna get mixed up with a guy like me. I'm a loner, Dotty; a rebel...

One second point. Most democrats/liberals (hell, there are multiple people on this board) are quick to make judgements about people who support Trump. There are so many examples of where people claim all people who support Trump are dumb, immoral, racist, etc. all because we have differing political ideas. My whole point is to say, both sides do it. Both sides are quick to call out the other. Both sides are quick to point out hypocrisy of the other side.

I hear you. I agree in principle. The way I see it work out here is that if liberals do make those kind of statements about Trump supporters, we get overwhelmed by the sheer number of Trump supporters -- or/and conservatives where they overlap -- and we therefore learn to choose our words more carefully. In my case, 4 suspensions have also worked toward that end.

Note in my very last post to dukedevlz: I didn't call conservatives dumb; I said "willfully ignorant," which is closer in meaning to "stubborn" than "mentally disabled," and even then, I parsed it as what it seems like. In a way, I'm grateful in that it has forced me to be more precise and accurate w/ what I say, and I always want to work in that direction. At the same time, I resent it b/c I don't see its reciprocation. Typically, a conservative here gets called on saying something both sides truly are guilty of, and other conservatives rally to defend them based on who they are, not based on what they said. It's evident whenever a liberal clarifies what they did or didn't mean and without even pausing, conservatives proceed to accuse them of the exact same thing they just addressed: "I'm not accusing white people." "Why are you accusing white people?!"

There are so many examples of where people claim all people who support Trump are dumb, immoral, racist, etc. all because we have differing political ideas.

I may have communicated this clearly already, so I'll be brief about the bold: I bet that when you or any conservatives choose to butt heads over what liberals believe, you see in it some deeper principle than mere disagreement. Well, same here. If I am inclined to suspect something you say sounds racist, it's not some catch-all cover-up for disagreement; it's b/c that's what it really seems like.

 

[lkc1234]

Thanks... but...

I've been in public ed my entire life, including the 9 months before that. My Mom was a teacher when she was pregnant with me. My Dad was a teacher until I was 7. I went to public school k-12, undergrad, and grad school. I was a teacher right out of college and I've worked in public schools ever since. (I was at Duke for 15 years, but it was my side job.)

I've heard people express support for public ed my entire life, too. I've rarely felt it. I appreciate words to that effect, but I don't often know if I can trust them. They ring hollow after enough years of the disconnect between what you hear and what you experience.

It's not you. It's me. I love your words... I'm just not in love with them... You don't wanna get mixed up with a guy like me. I'm a loner, Dotty; a rebel...


I hear you. I agree in principle. The way I see it work out here is that if liberals do make those kind of statements about Trump supporters, we get overwhelmed by the sheer number of Trump supporters -- or/and conservatives where they overlap -- and we therefore learn to choose our words more carefully. In my case, 4 suspensions have also worked toward that end.

Note in my very last post to dukedevlz: I didn't call conservatives dumb; I said "willfully ignorant," which is closer in meaning to "stubborn" than "mentally disabled," and even then, I parsed it as what it seems like. In a way, I'm grateful in that it has forced me to be more precise and accurate w/ what I say, and I always want to work in that direction. At the same time, I resent it b/c I don't see its reciprocation. Typically, a conservative here gets called on saying something both sides truly are guilty of, and other conservatives rally to defend them based on who they are, not based on what they said. It's evident whenever a liberal clarifies what they did or didn't mean and without even pausing, conservatives proceed to accuse them of the exact same thing they just addressed: "I'm not accusing white people." "Why are you accusing white people?!"


I may have communicated this clearly already, so I'll be brief about the bold: I bet that when you or any conservatives choose to butt heads over what liberals believe, you see in it some deeper principle than mere disagreement. Well, same here. If I am inclined to suspect something you say sounds racist, it's not some catch-all cover-up for disagreement; it's b/c that's what it really seems like.

It is easy to find racism when you are a racist.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Thanks... but...

I've been in public ed my entire life, including the 9 months before that. My Mom was a teacher when she was pregnant with me. My Dad was a teacher until I was 7. I went to public school k-12, undergrad, and grad school. I was a teacher right out of college and I've worked in public schools ever since. (I was at Duke for 15 years, but it was my side job.)

I've heard people express support for public ed my entire life, too. I've rarely felt it. I appreciate words to that effect, but I don't often know if I can trust them. They ring hollow after enough years of the disconnect between what you hear and what you experience.

It's not you. It's me. I love your words... I'm just not in love with them... You don't wanna get mixed up with a guy like me. I'm a loner, Dotty; a rebel...


I hear you. I agree in principle. The way I see it work out here is that if liberals do make those kind of statements about Trump supporters, we get overwhelmed by the sheer number of Trump supporters -- or/and conservatives where they overlap -- and we therefore learn to choose our words more carefully. In my case, 4 suspensions have also worked toward that end.

Note in my very last post to dukedevlz: I didn't call conservatives dumb; I said "willfully ignorant," which is closer in meaning to "stubborn" than "mentally disabled," and even then, I parsed it as what it seems like. In a way, I'm grateful in that it has forced me to be more precise and accurate w/ what I say, and I always want to work in that direction. At the same time, I resent it b/c I don't see its reciprocation. Typically, a conservative here gets called on saying something both sides truly are guilty of, and other conservatives rally to defend them based on who they are, not based on what they said. It's evident whenever a liberal clarifies what they did or didn't mean and without even pausing, conservatives proceed to accuse them of the exact same thing they just addressed: "I'm not accusing white people." "Why are you accusing white people?!"


I may have communicated this clearly already, so I'll be brief about the bold: I bet that when you or any conservatives choose to butt heads over what liberals believe, you see in it some deeper principle than mere disagreement. Well, same here. If I am inclined to suspect something you say sounds racist, it's not some catch-all cover-up for disagreement; it's b/c that's what it really seems like.

So it was YOU in the womb the 9 months prior to your mother giving birth, eh? Imagine that......

 

[Dattier]

So it was YOU in the womb the 9 months prior to your mother giving birth, eh? Imagine that......

Weak deflection. I used 446 words in my post and you react to 6 of them that had nothing to do w/ the actual point.

Find a pro-choice person who finds out they are expecting by choice who doesn't call the fetus a "baby" from the word go. There's a big difference between the emotion of willingly having a child and the scientific/medical definition of what constitutes a child. I bet you shut up at work b/c you know you'll get your hat handed to you on this subject.

 

[Dattier]

[Liberals] therefore learn to choose our words more carefully...It's evident whenever a liberal clarifies what they did or didn't mean and without even pausing, conservatives proceed to accuse them of the exact same thing they just addressed: "I'm not accusing white people." "Why are you accusing white people?!"

...If I am inclined to suspect something you say sounds racist, it's not some catch-all cover-up for disagreement; it's b/c that's what it really seems like.

It is easy to find racism when you are a racist.

@SNU0821 See what I mean?

 

[Bert Higginbotha]

Weak deflection. I used 446 words in my post and you react to 6 of them that had nothing to do w/ the actual point.

Find a pro-choice person who finds out they are expecting by choice who doesn't call the fetus a "baby" from the word go. There's a big difference between the emotion of willingly having a child and the scientific/medical definition of what constitutes a child. I bet you shut up at work b/c you know you'll get your hat handed to you on this subject.

.... being an old chemistry major, I call a zygote a baby even if it was not planned.

I am pro-choice as I feel the government should not interfere with your early choices on pregnancy or even birth control; however, I will never have anything to do with abortion of a child because I consider abortion murder of a human being.

 

[toonces11]

I haven't denied the disproportionate % of crime by race. I've objected to a particular frame, which is only used as a comeback to any assertion of racism and as a means of blaming entire communities of color.

Even here, you think the big story is defending white people and blaming black people. Your entire justification of the term "black-on-black crime" is essentially that they deserve it.


Like willful ignorance about the terms "privilege" and "systemic racism," a whole bunch of conservatives sure seem to be willfully ignorant about the use of the term "supremacist." None of the three is a slight or criticism against white people or any individual. That's b/c their very existence is systemic, institutionalized, implicit, subconscious, etc. No one has ill-intent. It doesn't matter, then, whether it's Ray Lewis or Billy Ray Cyrus.

Y'all got the idea of "institutionalized" just fine back when it was Red telling the boys in the yard at Shawshank about it. Ever since, you've been Floyd.

View embedded media

The problem is people insist on using the same argument/counter argument on a loop. Until people decide to change the way they communicate, change will come at a slow pace.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Weak deflection. I used 446 words in my post and you react to 6 of them that had nothing to do w/ the actual point.

Find a pro-choice person who finds out they are expecting by choice who doesn't call the fetus a "baby" from the word go. There's a big difference between the emotion of willingly having a child and the scientific/medical definition of what constitutes a child. I bet you shut up at work b/c you know you'll get your hat handed to you on this subject.

But it was you?

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Why are people getting so worked up over this answer?

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4729714/president-trump-calls-gang-members-animals



edit: I see a video on Facebook being circulated implying he is talking about all immigrants and not specifically MS-13 gang members.

 

[lkc1234]

Why are people getting so worked up over this answer?

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4729714/president-trump-calls-gang-members-animals



edit: I see a video on Facebook being circulated implying he is talking about all immigrants and not specifically MS-13 gang members.

Fake news as normal.

 

[JimboBBN]

Why are people getting so worked up over this answer?

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4729714/president-trump-calls-gang-members-animals



edit: I see a video on Facebook being circulated implying he is talking about all immigrants and not specifically MS-13 gang members.

Gotta hear both sides

 

[Bert Higginbotha]

The problem is people insist on using the same argument/counter argument on a loop. Until people decide to change the way they communicate, change will come at a slow pace.

If you are a conservative or in particular a white conservative then the liberals will call you a racist.

Why are people getting so worked up over this answer?

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4729714/president-trump-calls-gang-members-animals



edit: I see a video on Facebook being circulated implying he is talking about all immigrants and not specifically MS-13 gang members.

Yeap, it is fake news very similar to the NBC, CBS and ABC coverage of the Palestinians riots in the Gaza Strip where 69 were killed. Those sources indicated that the riots were caused by Trump moving the U.S. embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem. Ends up 66 of the 69 killed were militants. The folks in the large crowd were PAID to go there. The NBC, CBS and ABC coverage was fake because they lead you to a false conclusion based on not giving you enough informationt to come to the correct conclusion.


Gang members are animals.

 

[Dattier]

The problem is people insist on using the same argument/counter argument on a loop. Until people decide to change the way they communicate, change will come at a slow pace.

Who are you referring to?

 

[Dattier]

But it was you?

I won't entertain your trolling deflection.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

I won't entertain your trolling deflection.

Interesting to see someone so far left give refer to them as being oneself 9 months prior to birth. So at what point did you become you?

 

[toonces11]

Who are you referring to?

Basically....all of us.

 

[Dattier]

Why are people getting so worked up over this answer?

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4729714/president-trump-calls-gang-members-animals
edit: I see a video on Facebook being circulated implying he is talking about all immigrants and not specifically MS-13 gang members.

If you don't hear the woman who prompted his reply mention MS-13 specifically (she does, but it's not very loud) you can lose that context. I saw a headline misrepresenting it and my first thought was to assume it was true. I didn't do anything other than think it, and I'd have investigated more fully before any comment.

Hopefully people will have that context provided and shut up about criticizing it on that level.

 

[Dattier]

Interesting to see someone so far left give refer to them as being oneself 9 months prior to birth. So at what point did you become you?

Not today, troll.

 

[Dattier]

Basically....all of us.

I think it's best to save that point for a time when it's clear everybody is doing it. To bring up all of us at a point where only one side is is basically avoiding addressing the people doing it at that moment.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Not today, troll.

Well you said 9 months prior to your birth soooooo

 

[toonces11]

I think it's best to save that point for a time when it's clear everybody is doing it. To bring up all of us at a point where only one side is is basically avoiding addressing the people doing it at that moment.

Point taken--

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Catch a lib off guard and you catch them admitting something they usually try to stick to their guns about. Dat accidentally reffered to himself as himself 9 months prior to birth. Poor guy forgot the lefty talking point about when life begins and babies in utero just being a clump of cells.

 

[Dattier]

I was in the middle of all this yesterday.

It was cool. Very inspiring, encouraging. But there were two interactions I want to share here...

1. I was there early for training to be one of the organizers/directors/what-have-you. Part of my morning involved handing out cheer sheets with various chants on them. I was partnered with a young teacher I'd never met. She was black. At one point a lady approached us and asked about a cheer including the line "black lives matter," which was one of about 12 cheers on the handout. My partner and I tried to explain context, purpose, connection to broader goals, but it was pretty clear she had already made up her mind and wasn't open to any explanations. I found it pretty troubling that she was essentially rejecting an explanation from (A) a fellow white person who didn't feel slighted in the least by the cheer, and more importantly, (B) a black woman, over the statement that black lives matter.

2. At one bottleneck in the march route, I was standing still next to a couple police officers who were there protecting and serving. I struck up a conversation w/ them about their kids in public schools and thanked them for being there before I moved on. 2-3 seconds later, another marcher came up beside me and said, "You shouldn't thank them." I shrugged and moved on.

If you don't agree that both of them were out of line, I think you're blind and hypocritical.

 

[Dattier]

Catch a lib off guard and you catch them admitting something they usually try to stick to their guns about. Dat accidentally reffered to himself as himself 9 months prior to birth. Poor guy forgot the lefty talking point about when life begins and babies in utero just being a clump of cells.

Why don't you acknowledge the actual point for once and engage on a respectful level instead of this constant trolling?

 

[KyFaninNC]

I was in the middle of all this yesterday.

It was cool. Very inspiring, encouraging. But there were two interactions I want to share here...

1. I was there early for training to be one of the organizers/directors/what-have-you. Part of my morning involved handing out cheer sheets with various chants on them. I was partnered with a young teacher I'd never met. She was black. At one point a lady approached us and asked about a cheer including the line "black lives matter," which was one of about 12 cheers on the handout. My partner and I tried to explain context, purpose, connection to broader goals, but it was pretty clear she had already made up her mind and wasn't open to any explanations. I found it pretty troubling that she was essentially rejecting an explanation from (A) a fellow white person who didn't feel slighted in the least by the cheer, and more importantly, (B) a black woman, over the statement that black lives matter.

2. At one bottleneck in the march route, I was standing still next to a couple police officers who were there protecting and serving. I struck up a conversation w/ them about their kids in public schools and thanked them for being there before I moved on. 2-3 seconds later, another marcher came up beside me and said, "You shouldn't thank them." I shrugged and moved on.

If you don't agree that both of them were out of line, I think you're blind and hypocritical.

Every damn one of you should be fired, protest on your own time. You only work like 18 days a month, 9 months a year.

 

[Dattier]

Every damn one of you should be fired, protest on your own time. You only work like 18 days a month, 9 months a year.

It was our own time. We took personal days off.
Fire all of whom? I heard it was just a bunch of out-of-state paid protesters from Sorosland.
NC has a 2000 teacher shortage. They're not firing them.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Why don't you acknowledge the actual point for once and engage on a respectful level instead of this constant trolling?

Why not discuss with me when you think you became you?

 

[Dattier]

I've entertained your trolling enough.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

I've entertained your trolling enough.

You’ve avoided admitting what you implied about personhood. Not shocking. It contradicts liberal talking points so you can’t bring yourself to admit it.

 

[JimboBBN]

You’ve avoided admitting what you implied about personhood. Not shocking. It contradicts liberal talking points so you can’t bring yourself to admit it.

He still hasn't changed his name either I'm sure it still offends you hail

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

He still hasn't changed his name either I'm sure it still offends you hail

It does.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

If you don't hear the woman who prompted his reply mention MS-13 specifically (she does, but it's not very loud) you can lose that context. I saw a headline misrepresenting it and my first thought was to assume it was true. I didn't do anything other than think it, and I'd have investigated more fully before any comment.

Hopefully people will have that context provided and shut up about criticizing it on that level.

The video I've seen shared by libs starts after the MS-13 question is asked so the viewer doesn't get the context.

 

[LetsGoDuke301]

The video I've seen shared by libs starts after the MS-13 question is asked so the viewer doesn't get the context.

It is a scare tactic that will work on the people who get their news from social media. But chances are, it won't change their minds on anything. At this point, people's opinions on Trump are pretty much in place.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

It is a scare tactic that will work on the people who get their news from social media. But chances are, it won't change their minds on anything. At this point, people's opinions on Trump are pretty much in place.

Yeah, I wanted to reply to her status as nicely as possible and let her know that he was referring to MS-13. I didn't feel like it would accomplish anything and bit my tongue.

 

[Bert Higginbotha]

The video I've seen shared by libs starts after the MS-13 question is asked so the viewer doesn't get the context.

Occupy Democrats are an organization who actually use Nazi tactics to spread their own propaganda. I have yet to see one of their posters on Facebook that actually represents the truth. Zuckerberg should seriously consider not posting their shit.

 

[Dattier]

OccupyDemocrats is crap.

 

[bkingUK]

This conversation spun off into endless bullshit 15 pages ago. You all realize that right?

 

[dukedevilz]

I haven't denied the disproportionate % of crime by race. I've objected to a particular frame, which is only used as a comeback to any assertion of racism and as a means of blaming entire communities of color.

Even here, you think the big story is defending white people and blaming black people. Your entire justification of the term "black-on-black crime" is essentially that they deserve it. [/MEDIA]

I think you're focusing too much about the implications of people's words. I say "black-on-black crime" because frankly, it's four words that are all mono-syllabic. It's easier to say. Anyone is welcome to say "white-on-white crime." It won't bother me one bit. I mention those statistics because I think focusing on the behaviors, the culture, and the socio-econmoic factors within the African-American community is much more important than the behavior of cops. I mean the ratio of cops killing blacks versus blacks killing blacks is something like 1 to 30.

And nobody deserves to die. Every death is a tragedy. Whoever said black lives don't matter? It certainly wasn't me. When you don't have a logical argument to stand on, go ahead and build a straw man.

 

[hailtoyourvictor]

Very first comment? The race card.