@jhmossy didn't this guy play for Terry Holland?
***NBA Draft Declaration Thread***
- Thread starter JimboBBN
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Quite a few of those guys have already graduated. They're just making it official that they're not taking advantage of the free COVID year. Many of them know they're not getting drafted, but they're ready to start getting paid whether that be in the G-League or overseas.
TCU's Damino Baugh is returning, FWIW. That should improve their odds at being a preseason top 10 team.
NC State's Terquavion Smith is returning. Some were projecting him to go in the first round. NCSU is still waiting to hear from Dereon Seabron. If Smith and Seabron both return, gotta imagine NC State will make the tournament.
NC State's Terquavion Smith is returning. Some were projecting him to go in the first round. NCSU is still waiting to hear from Dereon Seabron. If Smith and Seabron both return, gotta imagine NC State will make the tournament.
Idk. They weren’t great last year and lost a lot. And their incoming class is less than ideal.
They're also getting Ole Miss's best player, Jarkel Joiner and the Big South POY DJ Burns (former Tennessee commit and 4-star recruit). Terquavion Smith, Dereon Seabron, alongside Joiner and Burns is a very formidable quartet. Not necessarily top 25, but maybe in the 31-50 range. If Seabron stays in the draft, then they're likely not in the tournament.
I’m just not sold on building a cohesive team through transfers. At least not when the transfers are in their first year with the new team. Transfers are great to fill a missing piece, not establish the core of the team.
Plus, is anyone really taking Kevin Keatts seriously?
Yeah, I would agree Keatts has been wildly underperforming as a coach. So, that might be the biggest question mark. But, the two main cogs would still be Smith and Seabron. Joiner and Burns would be the 3rd and 4th options.
But FWIW, there were quite a few tournament teams that included 3+ starters that were transfers and new to the program. Looks like Houston, Texas, Texas Tech, Iowa State, Marquette, Auburn, Kentucky, Arkansas, and San Francisco all fit that description. And then Wake Forest, SMU and Texas A&M just missed the tournament. 5 of those schools were more than capable of making the Final Four - Houston, Texas Tech, Auburn, Kentucky, and Arkansas.
That's a pretty good sample size, IMO. Transfers have always supplemented programs in building a winning culture, but they've never really been the foundational pieces. The thing is, teams built on transfers is kind of a new concept. Previously, coaches had to wait 18 months to actually use these guys in a game. And not only are they immediately eligible now, but there's a deluge of players in the portal. We went from about 1,000 guys in the portal in 2020, to more than 1,700 names the past two seasons. If the transfers are talented enough, the team will be just fine. My biggest concern with State, as you mentioned, is can Keatts actually perform up to expectations?
AJ Green, David Roddy, Aminu Mohammed, Donovan Williams, Dereon Seabron, Caleb Houstan, and Moussa Diabate have all announced recently that they're staying in the draft.
Still waiting on Trevor Keels. I really, really, really want him back. Courtney Ramey is evidently a viable backup option for Duke, be he ain't Trevor Freaking Keels.
Still waiting on Trevor Keels. I really, really, really want him back. Courtney Ramey is evidently a viable backup option for Duke, be he ain't Trevor Freaking Keels.
Now that Sharpe's college career is officially over, where does he rank on the all time list as in terms of greatest players at Kentucky?
@JimboBBN @lurkeraspect84 @Kevin Bryan
@JimboBBN @lurkeraspect84 @Kevin Bryan
He's right up there with Shawn Kemp and Enes Kanter.
Depends if he get drafter higher than Kanter.
Keels stays in, but 6”4 fprmer 2023 G proctor reclassified. Is he a suitable replacement for keels or u think yall will still pursue ramey, bc i know we made his cut of 10 schools as well lol, and we need guards in the worst kind way. Ramey was committed to us under pitino 🤣 talk about a long ass college career.
Im still salty malachi smith would rather be the 5th(maybe)option at Gonzaga when he could have come to Louisville and played 35mpg and likely been our 1st or 2nd option smdh. Guess tho coming from a mid major, playing for contender is a big bonus. Just dont see how hes gonna increase his draft stock there any unless somehow he outplays strawther/Bolton/hickman two starters and a young 5 star but who knows. Their bc is deep as fk jeez
Difference being that Kanter was ineligible, Sharpe wasn't.
Ahhhh good point. Ncaa was actually right on that one, dude played for fenerbache, thats one of the biggest teams in turkey in basketball and soccer. They are kinda like the real madrid of turkey. He wasnt playing semi pro games for 50$ a pop. If he woulda been eligible someone shoulda recruited luka a few years before he was draft eligible
So seems he should be lower than kanter then, bc sharpe just chose not to play(or whatever the reason he didnt play) where as kanter def wanted to play but couldnt. He did help greatly improve josh harrelsons game imo though so not a total loss.
Kanter's situation was a bit more complicated than that. He wasn't a full-time player for them. He played in 9 games when he was 16-years-old to get experience against the best his country had to offer and the only money he took from Fenerbache (at least that was documented) was $33K to cover expenses, which the NCAA found to be excessive. The family's reasoning for not taking a salary was specifically to maintain college eligibility and he ultimately turned down multi-million dollar offers from Fenerbache and some club in Greece. It was obviously a dumb decision and they should've known better since amateurism rules are pretty black and white, but the NCAA has given the green light to other players that have obviously broken amateurism rules and usually just made them pay back the money, donate the same amount to charity, and/or take a suspension that's usually no more than a handful of games.
Good point on the ncaa making other players sit games or payback money. But has there ever been a case when it was that much $$.
Plus you also have to look at rhe average income in turkey, 33k isnt a whole lot of money in some places in america like nyc or LA, but in turkey, it was way above the mean income iirc. And that was for 9 games? So a little less that 4k a game. Thats not exactly chump change anywhere.
Plus before nil if some kid had it documented that he receved 33k playing basketball before college he would be ruled ineligible as well. Hell they kicked wiseman out over 10k. I cant think of the largest amount theyve ever made a kid payback/sit and still play, but id guess its way less than 10k. But ive been proben wrong many times before.
def correct on it was a stupid move by the parents, him sitting didnt affect his draft stock anyways they shoulda took the millions from fenerbache, unless of course theh got mor from paypal cal 😉
The $33K was said to be an expense payment though, not income. It was just deemed to be excessive. I think it was excessive because they were claiming $20K of it was for education, but the NCAA bylaw says a pro sports organization can't include education as an expense. That was basically the kick in the nuts I think. Here's a huuuuge long write-up about the whole thing that explains it all in detail if you really want to read it. Captivating stuff. 😂 Actually not THAT long, like a 5 minute read. Details actual NCAA rules and why he was ruled ineligible.
https://www.aseaofblue.com/platform...ucky-basketball-examining-the-kanter-decision
Na dont care to read. But still traveling around europe with a pro team for free, is still an impermissible benefit. A turor provided by a pro team might be but idk.
i mean Cal caught heat for derrick rose brother flying on one team flight for free, but u think its ok for Kanter to fly/bus/train around europe with fenerbache for free, and that wouldnt be against NCAA rules/cost him his eligibility
Plus regardless what the $$ was for, he was onv on fenerbaches payroll, or they wouldnt have had to report it anyways.
Anyone know the most $$$ the ncaa has allowed an amatuer to pay back/donate/sit games and still play later? Cant imagine its anywhere near 5 digits.
either way we can agree to disagree and wuit beating this deadhorse. I will agree his family was stupid for taking such a small amount knowing it would raise eyebrows with the ncaa. And honestly decommiting from emerts alma mater to pick uk might have killed any snowballs chance in hell he did have of playing college ball.
The real question is where does jarred vanderbilt rank in the eyes of uk fans. Started some for the twolves, seemed to carved out a role despite only playing a handful of fames in college and quitting mid game iirc (mayeb that what whitney)
Speaking wtf ever happened to Khalil Whitney?? Did he go to Illinois or the gleage to never be heard of again. Seems like ida seen him at illini by now.
Speaking wtf ever happened to Khalil Whitney?? Did he go to Illinois or the gleage to never be heard of again. Seems like ida seen him at illini by now.
Article addresses all that, and you responded before I could edit to say the education aspect is what bit him in the ass. The pro team can't pay for education as an expense so that made the $33K total way too excessive. Article also addresses the Renardo Sidney situation for comparison (who was paid 5 figures) and he was eventually allowed to play.
I never had a problem with Vanderbilt. He was just injury prone. Whitney was the one that left mid-season. He entered the draft and went undrafted. Bounced around the G League for a second and now plays in Canada. 😂
Ahh yea i remmeber sidney, went to miss st, no one anywhere thought he would be eligible lol. Huge bust, always out of shape.
idk why but i thought vanderbilt was the one that quit mid game. I like dude, he plays hard and knows his role and excels at it. Did whitney quit mid game and threw a tantrum on the sidelines? I remember one frosh did but he might have ended up coming back. It was funny at the time, to a rival at least.
Back to Kanter, seems like traveling around with a pro team for free multiple times would be a bigger red flag than the tutor, but its the ncaa so nothing suprises me with them. Regardless coming in everyone knew it was a long shot that hed get to play. Plaued in 9 games for a professinal team, nonproblem, free travel with a pro team for 3 years, nonproblem, pro team provides a tutor so he could graduate high school, no beuno lol wtf ncaa is so stupid
But at least he got to practice and help the other bigs. Josh harrellson owes him every dime he ever made in the nba imo 🤣
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Sidney was so fat. I bet he's like 800 pounds now. I don't ever recall Vanderbilt quitting in the middle of a game, but he played at UK like 5 years ago and I can't even remember what I had for dinner tonight. If he did it was probably injury related. He wasn't a bad kid and didn't have a bad attitude from what I remember. You gotta ask @lurkeraspect84 about that. He remembers everything. You might be thinking of Cam'Ron Fletcher whining like a little bitch on the bench because he wasn't getting enough playing time. He got suspended after that. Or there was a misunderstanding about Terrence Clarke leaving the bench after he fouled out against UNC. Maybe that's what you mean. He came back and was the last one to leave after that though.
Kanter traveling with and even being on the pro team was not the issue, apparently.
12.2.3.2.1 Exception—Competition Before Initial Full-Time Collegiate Enrollment—Sports Other Than Men’s Ice Hockey and Skiing. In sports other than men’s ice hockey and skiing, before initial full-time collegiate enrollment, an individual may compete on a professional team (per Bylaw 12.02.4), provided he or she does not receive more than actual and necessary expenses to participate on the team. (Adopted: 4/29/10 effective 8/1/10; applicable to student-athletes who initially enroll full time in a collegiate institution on or after 8/1/10)
The issue was with education funds mostly, and that is why the $33K for expenses ended up being deemed excessive (you could've saved us both time by spending 5 mins to read the article I linked which explains all this). 😂
2.1.2.1.3.1 Educational Expenses or Services—Prior to Collegiate Enrollment. A prospective student-athlete may receive educational expenses or services (e.g., tuition, fees, room and board, books, tutoring, standardized test preparatory classes) prior to collegiate enrollment from any individual or entity other than an agent, professional sports team/organization, member institution or a representative of an institution’s athletics interests, provided the payment for such expenses or services is disbursed directly to the individual, organization or educational institution (e.g., high school, preparatory school) providing the educational expense or service. (Adopted: 4/25/02 effective 8/1/02, Revised: 1/14/08)
Kids travel around the US for free with the AAU circuits. Free shoes, free food, free entry into the tourneys. Kids who participate for the US U18 team go to all that for free. Trips to Mexico or Canada or wheverver the games are played. Trips to Colorado Springs for the US training camp stuff. Kids who go to the McDonalds and Jordan Brand all American games get that for free. Free swag, free trip, tickets for family.
I don’t see the difference. NCAA just likes to be hypocrites.
Yes def Fletcher, that was it. Fot super emotional and wuit mid game. Surprised he hasnt dont well at fsu, he def fits their style of lanky athletes.
And sorry i wasn’t meaning to argue with you on the kanter traveling thing,(well i was at first until u probed me wrong) just that it seems crazy that the travel is allowed but the tutor is what cost him his eligibility. And without the tutor he likely wouldnt qualify for admissions anyways. What a dumbass rule. Between the student visa nil thing and that the ncaa loves rhe eff the foreigners geeze. We had to appeal to get gorgiu dieng eligible and he spoke 5 languages coming into college lol.
And sorry again im not clicking of seaofblue anything 🤣
Thats like the diff in traveling with an aau team vs the traveling with the new york knicks though. Fenerbache is a big deal in turkey, usually always at the top of the table, and i doubt they have many “amatuers” kanter was prolly like a unicorn as turkey is not known for producing alot of big time basketball talent…….so maybe knicks was a bad choice, say like traveling with the miami heat.
but yes def hypocritical, esp if the travl wasnt the problem, but providing a 16 yr old a tutor was, wtf:
Fletcher did pretty well last year. Shot the three well, real good defensive impact, solid rebounder. He’s gonna be a big part of our rotation this year.
Last year was his first year at FSU and he missed time with a broken face bone, and then wore a mask for a while. Little early to say he’s not done well.
Id say traveling with the USA team is equal to some pro team in Turkey. Besides, money doesn’t care who gives it to you. What’s the difference between free flights, hotels, food, and swag in US vs Turkey?
So you think aau teams travel in the same fashion as professional european Teams likely on private jets?
The diff to me is id be willing to bet european pro teams have nicer flights/hotels/food service than any amatuer aau team or prep school in america. I mean its a team full of professional players, and while they dont make nba money i bet they do pretty decent salary wise.
You do have an argument with the u18 team usa kids, i have no idea what their travel/food/etc looks like. But again they are all “amatuers” playingg against amatuers. If kanter had been playing with the turkish national team minus the tutor im sure he woulda been cleared to go.
But still the u18 or u19 usa teams isnt exactly the same as team usa that plays in the olympics. Those are amatuers not nba superstars. But again they do get the coaching and prob get to meet all kinds of dudes. Doubtful they have to claim 33k worth of income from playing on those teams tho. They prolly got even more along the lines, just got it in bags under the table.
Hypothetically yall would be ok with lets say bronnt james was a 5 star stud, youd be ok with bronny james practicing/playing/and traveling with the lakers all year bc his dad plays for them, as long as he didnt have a “salary”
Even getting to practice against pros daily for multiple years seems like a huge advantage to me.
Even getting to practice against pros daily for multiple years seems like a huge advantage to me.
I don't think Scheyer would be against having Ramey on the team, but not sure Ramey would come here if he's not essentially guaranteed a starting spot. Will definitely miss the physicality and toughness from Keels. Proctor is lean and obviously not built like Keels. But, I think he will be just fine. He's athletic and has a very high skillset. I'd much prefer him over Ramey for the starting two.
Yeah, can't blame you for being salty. Not sure how Few is going to keep everyone happy, to be honest. In the latter half of the 2021 season, Kispert primarily played the four. Still think there's a good possibility of that happening with Julian Strawther. The guards are just too talented to constantly have three of them on the bench. 80 combined minutes simply isn't sufficient PT for Nolan Hickman, Rasir Bolton, Hunter Sallis, Malachi Smith, and Dom Harris. I think Smith will see plenty of time at the 3, perhaps Sallis, as well.
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