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Who is Gonzaga signature win to warrant being ranked #1?

I meant in the OOC. You think we are forming our opinions based on playing their conference opponents? Na it was raining every P5 team they played in the non-conf by double digits sans wvu.

Watch em play this year in the tourney and you will see it’s gonna take a lot to beat them. Not that it can’t be done, but it’s gonna take a helluva performance from anyone. Same can be said for Butler and Michigan tbh. Hope we are the 8/9 in the last region or 10 anywhere. Vt game canceled smdh.
 
dukedevilz said:
Right. Gonzaga's schedule is clearly nowhere near the difficulty level of Michigan. Being the overall #1 seed might be more significant this year, however. If we believe the gap between Gonzaga, Michigan, and Baylor is substantial - that would mean Gonzaga wouldn't have to face either of those two teams until the championship game.
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The way they have looked, if they played a B1G schedule, the Vegas O/U on number of losses would only be 1.5. They are legit good.
 
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Michigan played a top 5 team

If only they could play Pepperdine like Gonzaga
 
Ole_Ted said:
Michigan played a top 5 team

If only they could play Pepperdine like Gonzaga
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Give it up Ted, the Zags would booty blast either of these Michigan or Illinois teams.

They get bored playing awful competition but they've dominated Iowa, WV and UVA in the games that mattered.

This is one of the greatest teams of all time and I expect them to abuse everyone in the tournament.
 
At this point, the Zags should definitely be #1 if they finish undefeated. If Michigan had finished the season with just one loss, they would have had a case.
 
Is Gonzaga an excellent team? Yes. They are a strong squad in a very down NCAA field. NCAA basketball has been very weak IMO last few years. Kids are jumping to play in random leagues around the world (not even europe in many cases SMH). It is what it is. None of these teams are TRULY stacked like they used to be. Not even close IMO.
 
LloydCarrIsSmegma said:
I don't know. They were 3-0 without Ayo. With 2 road wins against Top 25 schools.
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A 6-loss team is still top 5 w/out its All-American? Probably need to slow down here.

Illinois was good last night, but Michigan looked like a mid-major. They're clearly overrated. What have they really accomplished? They beat a reeling Ohio St team and inconsistent, defensively-challenged Iowa. Nothing else stands out at all. Everybody beats Wisconsin.
 
954gator said:
Is Gonzaga an excellent team? Yes. They are a strong squad in a very down NCAA field. NCAA basketball has been very weak IMO last few years. Kids are jumping to play in random leagues around the world (not even europe in many cases SMH). It is what it is. None of these teams are TRULY stacked like they used to be. Not even close IMO.
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Careful. Such words will bring out the pitchforks around here.
 
954gator said:
Is Gonzaga an excellent team? Yes. They are a strong squad in a very down NCAA field. NCAA basketball has been very weak IMO last few years. Kids are jumping to play in random leagues around the world (not even europe in many cases SMH). It is what it is. None of these teams are TRULY stacked like they used to be. Not even close IMO.
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I think this is incorrect. The 3 point shot and open field spacing has created a much better brand of basketball and has allowed many more teams to be competitive. Shoot the 2019 season was fantastic. Look at the elite 8 teams from 2019. Most of them could have won a NC in any given year.

Last year was probably down from an elite team status, that is not the case this year.
 
bignish said:
Give it up Ted, the Zags would booty blast either of these Michigan or Illinois teams.

They get bored playing awful competition but they've dominated Iowa, WV and UVA in the games that mattered.

This is one of the greatest teams of all time and I expect them to abuse everyone in the tournament.
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Huh? They only beat WVU by 5 and WVU was up most of the game. They should have beat Gonzaga but bad calls killed them in the end.
 
Original_Irish said:
I think this is incorrect. The 3 point shot and open field spacing has created a much better brand of basketball and has allowed many more teams to be competitive. Shoot the 2019 season was fantastic. Look at the elite 8 teams from 2019. Most of them could have won a NC in any given year.

Last year was probably down from an elite team status, that is not the case this year.
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There's no way that anyone can prove either side, but like he said, I don't think there are any truly stacked teams like in past years.

The fact that the Michigan team we saw last night is what passes for a "loaded" team this year says it all. I think that Gonzaga and Baylor are both better but neither are truly dominant. They're dominant relative to the field.
 
954gator said:
Would you take this team over 2017 or 2018 Gonzaga even? When you really look closely?
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I think the 2017 team would beat this team just because the ridiculous amount of depth of big men that the 2017 team had. Depth at the big position is Gonzaga's weak point this year.

But no one this year is close to the depth of talent at the 4 & 5 that the 2017 GU team did.
 
Original_Irish said:
I think this is incorrect. The 3 point shot and open field spacing has created a much better brand of basketball and has allowed many more teams to be competitive. Shoot the 2019 season was fantastic. Look at the elite 8 teams from 2019. Most of them could have won a NC in any given year.

Last year was probably down from an elite team status, that is not the case this year.
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I’ll give you the change in the game but when we are talking about talent it’s not close IMO.
I was rewatching some NCAA tourney games from back in 2007. The talent difference is so far and away better. Funny comment from the UCLA final 4 I laughed at... “Afflalo in foul trouble, the bruins will now need to rely on Russell Westbrook to play more minutes”. Kevin Durant couldn’t take an excellent Texas team past the 4-5 matchup that year. Curry was starting his Davidson legacy, I mean if I made a list it would be astonishing. When you look at the teams those years you see the backbone of what was the NBA the last 10 or so years.

2008, 2009 etc very similar. You look at now? I don’t see it.
 
954gator said:
I’ll give you the change in the game but when we are talking about talent it’s not close IMO.
I was rewatching some NCAA tourney games from back in 2007. The talent difference is so far and away better. Funny comment from the UCLA final 4 I laughed at... “Afflalo in foul trouble, the bruins will now need to rely on Russell Westbrook to play more minutes”. Kevin Durant couldn’t take an excellent Texas team past the 4-5 matchup that year. Curry was starting his Davidson legacy, I mean if I made a list it would be astonishing. When you look at the teams those years you see the backbone of what was the NBA the last 10 or so years.
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Sure I get what you mean by talent since players used to stay longer. The counterpoint is that NONE of us knew how good Westbrook was in college because he was restricted so much by his coach. Think about how much better those UCLA teams would have been if they weren't held back by their own coach. So it doesn't really matter if you are more talented if you play slow, have poor ball movement and can't shoot the 3.
 
Original_Irish said:
Sure I get what you mean by talent since players used to stay longer. The counterpoint is that NONE of us knew how good Westbrook was in college because he was restricted so much by his coach. Think about how much better those UCLA teams would have been if they weren't held back by their own coach. So it doesn't really matter if you are more talented if you play slow, have poor ball movement and can't shoot the 3.
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Held back or not able to start over other NBA guys like Collison, Afflalo, Farmar? That’s the thing. Talent was everywhere.
 
954gator said:
Held back or not able to start over other NBA guys like Collison, Afflalo, Farmar? That’s the thing. Talent was everywhere.
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Definitely held back, same as the rest of the UCLA players. Those teams would be so much better now.
 
954gator said:
I’ll give you the change in the game but when we are talking about talent it’s not close IMO.
I was rewatching some NCAA tourney games from back in 2007. The talent difference is so far and away better. Funny comment from the UCLA final 4 I laughed at... “Afflalo in foul trouble, the bruins will now need to rely on Russell Westbrook to play more minutes”. Kevin Durant couldn’t take an excellent Texas team past the 4-5 matchup that year. Curry was starting his Davidson legacy, I mean if I made a list it would be astonishing. When you look at the teams those years you see the backbone of what was the NBA the last 10 or so years.

2008, 2009 etc very similar. You look at now? I don’t see it.
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It's hard to imagine that Durant team not being top 3 or so in this field. They'd murder teams like Iowa and Michigan.
 
Original_Irish said:
Ok y’all have some serious rose colored glasses on right now. That wasn’t a great team.
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They weren't great relative to the field. They were fringe top 10. But they were loaded with talent. It wasn't Durant + a bunch of scrubs. And he was unstoppable.

What makes you think they wouldn't be one of the top teams in this field? Do you really think teams like Iowa, Bama, Ohio St etc are better than them?
 
ExitFlagger said:
They weren't great relative to the field. They were fringe top 10. But they were loaded with talent. It wasn't Durant + a bunch of scrubs. And he was unstoppable.

What makes you think they wouldn't be one of the top teams in this field? Do you really think teams like Iowa, Bama, Ohio St etc are better than them?
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They were an average 4 seed in 2007 who got blown out in the second round of the tournament.

We talk about how bad Gonzaga’s conference is now. Texas lost to a Gonzaga team that had 3 conference losses before BYU had even joined.

Nothing about that team was special. You just think they were great because you recognize 2 NBA players who were 19 years old on that team.
 
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Original_Irish said:
They were an average 4 seed in 2007 who got blown out in the second round of the tournament.

We talk about how bad Gonzaga’s conference is now. Texas lost to a Gonzaga team that had 3 conference losses before BYU had even joined.

Nothing about that team was special. You just think they were great because you recognize 2 NBA players who were 19 years old on that team.
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DJ Augustine and the best player by far in college basketball! Nothing special? For the time sure, but why is that? Because teams were stacked back then! USC had OJ Mayo and Taj Gibson among others! (2008 USC add DeMar DeRozen Fwiw)


Texas was hanging with one of the better and obviously loaded Kansas teams @Kansas.
 
Original_Irish said:
They were an average 4 seed in 2007 who got blown out in the second round of the tournament.

We talk about how bad Gonzaga’s conference is now. Texas lost to a Gonzaga team that had 3 conference losses before BYU had even joined.

Nothing about that team was special. You just think they were great because you recognize 2 NBA players who were 19 years old on that team.
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You seem to think I'm saying that team was special. I'm not. I'm saying the current field pales by comparison to that year, so they would stand out.

If a team with the most dominant college player in recent memory + 3 other NBA players is nothing special, relative to this year's field, I'm really curious to know who all these special teams are.
 
ExitFlagger said:
You seem to think I'm saying that team was special. I'm not. I'm saying the current field pales by comparison to that year, so they would stand out.

If a team with the most dominant college player in recent memory + 3 other NBA players is nothing special, relative to this year's field, I'm really curious to know who all these special teams are.
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I'm saying that they lost to 5 unranked teams in 2007. I'm saying they lost to a Gonzaga team that would lose by 20 to this years' squad.

They would probably still be around a 4 seed this year.
 
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954gator said:
DJ Augustine and the best player by far in college basketball! Nothing special? For the time sure, but why is that? Because teams were stacked back then! USC had OJ Mayo and Taj Gibson among others! (2008 USC add DeMar DeRozen Fwiw)

View embedded media

Texas was hanging with one of the better and obviously loaded Kansas teams @Kansas.
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They had a 20+ lead in both games vs KU, and KU clawed back to win both. Durant was a monster.
 
bignish said:
Give it up Ted, the Zags would booty blast either of these Michigan or Illinois teams.

They get bored playing awful competition but they've dominated Iowa, WV and UVA in the games that mattered.

This is one of the greatest teams of all time and I expect them to abuse everyone in the tournament.
Click to expand...

The ole nish kiss of death uh oh
 
Original_Irish said:
I'm saying that they lost to 5 unranked teams in 2007. I'm saying they lost to a Gonzaga team that would lose by 20 to this years' squad.

They would probably still be around a 4 seed this year.
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Doubtful.

Purdue and Oklahoma St are currently listed as 4s in Bracketology. I’m pretty sure Durant’s team would dogwalk them.

Do you honestly think this year’s field compares to that year? Or 2008, 2010, etc?
 
ExitFlagger said:
Doubtful.

Purdue and Oklahoma St are currently listed as 4s in Bracketology. I’m pretty sure Durant’s team would dogwalk them.

Do you honestly think this year’s field compares to that year? Or 2008, 2010, etc?
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Maybe. Durant was the #2 overall pick and Cunningham is gonna be the #1 overall pick this year.

Again this goes back to talent vs team. The way colleges play now, they have an advantage over teams from 10+ years ago. Regardless on what you think the talent level is, these teams are close enough to say that this years’ teams would win.
 
@Original_Irish My only question regarding Gonzaga, is why so many slow starts? Seems like every other game Gonzaga is tied with an inferior opponent 15-20 minutes into the game.
 
dukedevilz said:
@Original_Irish My only question regarding Gonzaga, is why so many slow starts? Seems like every other game Gonzaga is tied with an inferior opponent 15-20 minutes into the game.
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Ya I know. I’ve definitely still got questions about this team. Center depth, rim protection and outside shooting are still areas of concern for me.

The slow starts are because they are board. They have blitzed every single NCAA tournament team this year in the first half except WVU.

Kansas 8 point halftime lead
Iowa 14 point half time lead
Virginia 13 point half time lead
BYU 23 point half time lead
BYU again 10 point half time lead and started the game on a 15-2 run.
 
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Ole_Ted said:
Everyone knows Michigan is the best team in the country
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You need to make the argument that UM's losses somehow don't exclude them from #1 considering a team is undefeated.
 
Ole_Ted said:
Michigan played a top 5 team

If only they could play Pepperdine like Gonzaga
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It doesn't take a special skill to lose to a top 5 team, anyone can do it. UM would have to be undefeated to better competition rather than playing better competition to be considered #1.
 
Original_Irish said:
Maybe. Durant was the #2 overall pick and Cunningham is gonna be the #1 overall pick this year.

Again this goes back to talent vs team. The way colleges play now, they have an advantage over teams from 10+ years ago. Regardless on what you think the talent level is, these teams are close enough to say that this years’ teams would win.
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Cunningham doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence as Durant. The fact that he's likely #1 says it all. If we compared the top 5 from the '08 draft to this year's, it would be embarrassing. Rose, Beasley, Mayo, Westbrook, Love. The entire draft would blow this year away.

In this hypothetical scenario that teams from today played teams from then, are you for some reason assuming that the more talented teams wouldn't be able to adjust to a different style of play? That it's somehow an advantage to have less talent?

Durant's Texas team was basically all freshmen, so of course they stumbled now and then, especially early on. But it's funny to imagine you saying "no problem" as you watch Durant, Augustin, Abrams and James walk onto the court in a late-season matchup. And if you're judging them based on their tourney loss, that's also funny, as Gonzaga's resident Rodney Dangerfield. Gonzaga's been ranked top 10ish in about 15 of the last 20 years (many times in the top 5) and did very little in the postseason until the last few tourneys.

Plus, that was a very talented USC team with three NBA players surrounded by some players that had very good college careers. Compare them to the projected 5 seeds right now: Colorado, Virginia, Oklahoma and Creighton. Give me a break.
 
ExitFlagger said:
Cunningham doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence as Durant. The fact that he's likely #1 says it all. If we compared the top 5 from the '08 draft to this year's, it would be embarrassing. Rose, Beasley, Mayo, Westbrook, Love. The entire draft would blow this year away.

In this hypothetical scenario that teams from today played teams from then, are you for some reason assuming that the more talented teams wouldn't be able to adjust to a different style of play? That it's somehow an advantage to have less talent?

Durant's Texas team was basically all freshmen, so of course they stumbled now and then, especially early on. But it's funny to imagine you saying "no problem" as you watch Durant, Augustin, Abrams and James walk onto the court in a late-season matchup. And if you're judging them based on their tourney loss, that's also funny, as Gonzaga's resident Rodney Dangerfield. Gonzaga's been ranked top 10ish in about 15 of the last 20 years (many times in the top 5) and did very little in the postseason until the last few tourneys.

Plus, that was a very talented USC team with three NBA players surrounded by some players that had very good college careers. Compare them to the projected 5 seeds right now: Colorado, Virginia, Oklahoma and Creighton. Give me a break.
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Talent doesn’t come close.
07 Florida would murder these top teams IMO as would many of the top teams back in those times.
 
2009 Kentucky was stacked. Out in the elite 8. Who could handle a team like that in today’s field?
 
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