Is UH’s regular season Big 12 title the most impressive conference debut ever?

[HailToPitt725]

Not only did Houston win the Big 12 regular season championship, but they did so while moving up from a non-P6 conference. The only other recent example I can think of is Colorado winning their debut Pac-12 tournament. Creighton and Pitt came close in their first seasons post-realignment as well, but no cigar.

Any other examples I’m missing, including from mid-major conferences? Any time a D2 team moves up and wins their first D1 tournament is also impressive.

Another question: if UH doesn’t win the Big 12 tournament, does that change this? I’d say no.

 

[bignish]

Definitely and no one should be surprised. Houston proved in the NCAAT in recent years that they belonged and that they weren't a fools gold metrics team that was beating up on lower tier competition.

 

[ExitFlagger]

I don’t think they need to win the Big 12 tourney to solidify anything. I see conference tourneys as somewhat redundant and not that important. But they can tell you who’s peaking at the right time. I’m hoping KU makes a statement in KC and builds some momentum going into the dance.

 

[della]

Yeppers, they are impressive and have a killer defense.

 

[KUhawks34]

Very impressive. Sampson is a great coach. I was always annoyed that everyone blamed Houston for being a weak conference. Their conference was weak but if you watch basketball, they certainly were a really good team.

I figured they take a couple more losses just playing more consistent tough games but here they are

 

[ABVolsFan92]

Sampson is impressive but I'm not sold on them making it past the sweet 16 in the tourney

 

[mcnicKY91]

As a UK fan, Houston would be on my short list (which is very short), alongside Purdue, as teams I wouldn't mind in the slightest if they won the championship this yr.

I have always thought Sampson was a really good coach as well.

 

[Endeavor.]

Houston’s been a final four team while in the AAC, they were always a basketball powerhouse

 

[Ben Chode]

OU should have bit the ncaa bullet and kept Sampson. Take the post season ban and a couple years of pain, but they'd be nearing blue blood status ala Uconn by now.

In 20 years, Texas is gonna rue firing beard. I'm 100% positive if we suspended him for the season, he did some "rehab" and did some fluff stuff, no one would have batted an eye if he were coaching Texas this year.

 

[LeroyOU12]

OU should have bit the ncaa bullet and kept Sampson. Take the post season ban and a couple years of pain, but they'd be nearing blue blood status ala Uconn by now.

In 20 years, Texas is gonna rue firing beard. I'm 100% positive if we suspended him for the season, he did some "rehab" and did some fluff stuff, no one would have batted an eye if he were coaching Texas this year.

OU wanted to keep Sampson, but he wants to go to Indiana and had an offer from them. Then the phone call violations broke, Indiana recanted their offer and the NCAA banned him from coaching in college for 5 years. So he went NBA with the Rockets, he got the Houston job after 5 years ban.

 

[kyjeff1]

Extremely impressive and proves Sampson is a great coach that has a great system.
On the conference thing, I think mid major conferences hurt teams like Gonzaga and Houston, because when you're just playing mid major comp for three months before entering the tournament, you aren't going to be as battle tested. The BIG12 is going to make Houston a much tougher team to beat IMO.

 

[Donut with no holes]

Houston’s been a final four team while in the AAC, they were always a basketball powerhouse

Exactly. If you had told me a year ago that UH would win the B12 this year I would not have been a bit surprised. They've been a good team for a while.

 

[dukedevilz]

Extremely impressive and proves Sampson is a great coach that has a great system.
On the conference thing, I think mid major conferences hurt teams like Gonzaga and Houston, because when you're just playing mid major comp for three months before entering the tournament, you aren't going to be as battle tested. The BIG12 is going to make Houston a much tougher team to beat IMO.

Seems like Gonzaga has done just fine in March. They've won more tournament games than any other school since 2015. How do you reconcile that?

Tournament Wins Since 2015 (past 8 tournaments)
Gonzaga- 25
Villanova- 21
North Carolina- 21
Duke- 20
Kansas- 20
Kentucky- 14

Houston's run as an elite team really began in 2019. So, you're talking about 11 tournament wins over a 4 year-span. Had they won at the same rate, they would have won 22 games over an 8-year run.

 

[hawkit3113]

No. Next question

 

[kyjeff1]

Seems like Gonzaga has done just fine in March. They've won more tournament games than any other school since 2015. How do you reconcile that?

Tournament Wins Since 2015 (past 8 tournaments)
Gonzaga- 25
Villanova- 21
North Carolina- 21
Duke- 20
Kansas- 20
Kentucky- 14

Houston's run as an elite team really began in 2019. So, you're talking about 11 tournament wins over a 4 year-span. Had they won at the same rate, they would have won 22 games over an 8-year run.

I look at Gonzaga as an outlier tbh. Mark Few has built a great program out there.

When you watch any WCC game that involves Gonzaga, it looks like a high school team is playing legit power 5 dudes. Gonzaga's players are usually more developed physically. They look like a team that was taken out of the PAC12 and placed into the WCC.

Wichita State looked great for a few years (13, 14, 15, 16, 17 etc… ) but they've fallen back down. Couldn't keep it going after Gregg Marshal left.

Let's see what happens when Mark Few retires, or takes another job. He took over for Dan Monson, who had the program rolling pretty well, so maybe it's a good enough brand to attract another top notch coach.

 

[kyjeff1]

No. Next question

Soooo you're not going to don your new temporary avatar? I came up with a good one too.

 

[hawkit3113]

Soooo you're not going to don your new temporary avatar? I came up with a good one too.

I am so confused about the point. Are we betting on something?

 

[dukedevilz]

I look at Gonzaga as an outlier tbh. Mark Few has built a great program out there.

When you watch any WCC game that involves Gonzaga, it looks like a high school team is playing legit power 5 dudes. Gonzaga's players are usually more developed physically. They look like a team that was taken out of the PAC12 and placed into the WCC.

Wichita State looked great for a few years (13, 14, 15, 16, 17 etc… ) but they've fallen back down. Couldn't keep it going after Gregg Marshal left.

Let's see what happens when Mark Few retires, or takes another job. He took over for Dan Monson, who had the program rolling pretty well, so maybe it's a good enough brand to attract another top notch coach.

Okay, but that doesn't address the question. Does playing in the WCC hurt Gonzaga in March? They've won more tournament games than any other school over the past 8 years.

 

[kyjeff1]

I am so confused about the point. Are we betting on something?

No bets, you just have to wear a ridiculous avatar until the finals of the NCAAT.
Unfortunately for me, Random cheated and made it so I had to wear an avatar provided by Necessary Roughness. Lulz.

 

[kyjeff1]

Okay, but that doesn't address the question. Does playing in the WCC hurt Gonzaga in March? They've won more tournament games than any other school over the past 8 years.

They had 2 title game appearances and have had great success, like I said, they are an outlier, definitely not the norm.
Let's see what sMc does. FAU is another one to watch.
Nobody has been able to sustain success out of mid major conferences with the exception of Gonzaga and for a short time, WSU.

 

[dukedevilz]

They had 2 title game appearances and have had great success, like I said, they are an outlier, definitely not the norm.
Let's see what sMc does. FAU is another one to watch.
Nobody has been able to sustain success out of mid major conferences with the exception of Gonzaga and for a short time, WSU.

Hard to do for an extended period of time, for sure. This is Few's most vulnerable team since 2014. Still capable of winning a few games, but I don't expect them to make a Final Four run.

Saint Mary's, on the other hand, might be better built for a Final Four run. Tournament games are often won in the half court, and SMC does well in that. They don't necessarily need a ton of fast break points. They also lead the nation in rebounding margin, and when you combine that with a slow tempo, they can be a frustrating team to play against. Unfortunately for them, they're likely going to be a 6 or 7 seed. So, they'd likely have to beat a 3 and 2 seed to reach a Regional Final.

FAU, of course, has been to a Final Four. Same guys as last year. Offensive firepower is there. Just a matter of matchups and can get they get enough stops.