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More entertainment in Portland -Who wins ANTIFA vs Patriot Prayer Group

1995 OK bombing changed the stats dramatically.... You left out this right wing thing... 168 killed.

Not sure what your point is. I didn't leave out any stats.

Media and multiple people on this board claim that Trump is promoting violence, which according to statistics is true. However stats also show left wing terrorism has been a lot worse than right wing since he was elected.

Using specific timelines you can skew the stats to look one way or the other. Just like the headlines like "Right wing terrorism is worse than Islamic terrorism". It counts the fact that there are more instances of rw terrorism, but not the fact that Islamic terrorists kill a lot more people.

I wasnt trying to be a "gotcha" post. It really was interesting. Off the top of my head I cant think of any of the 13 left wing terrorist attack deaths that Forbes mentions. Yet most people know all if the ones and more credited to the right wingers.
 
Not sure what your point is. I didn't leave out any stats.

"Left Wing terrorists killed only 23 people in terrorist attacks during this time('92-2017), about 0.7% of the total number of murders, but 13 since the beginning of 2016. Nationalist and Right Wing terrorists have only killed five since then, including Charlottesville."

My point was quite clear. You left out the right wing 1995 OK bombing that killed 165 out of the equation. Just fact checking your, um facts...
 
Those are not my facts. That is a quote from the Forbes article @TheDude1 posted. Also, if you read what was written before your highlight it specifically says , "since the beginning of 2016."


Again. I didnt leave anything out.
 
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Those are not my facts. That is a quote from the Forbes article @TheDude1 posted. Also, if you read what was written before your highlight it specifically says , "since the beginning of 2016."


Again. I didnt leave anything out.



from Forbes

https://www.forbes.com/sites/realsp...n-terrorist-attacks-on-u-s-soil/#3a3cc9711e74

Nationalist and Right Wing terrorists are the second deadliest group by ideology, as they account for 6.6% of all terrorist murders during this time. The 1995 Oklahoma City bombing, the second deadliest terrorist attack in U.S. history, killed 168 people and accounted for 77% of all the murders committed by Nationalist and Right Wing terrorists. The chance of being murdered in a Nationalist or Right Wing terrorist attack was about 1 in 33 million per year.

You also quoted this date range ('92-2017), not since 2016... You should read what you quote.... You're living up to your stage name...
 
I feel like this thread has turned into splitting hairs about who is worse White Nationalist or Antifa?

This is why I don't think we can have nice things like the right to vote in this country.
 
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Hm, I’d rather make fact based distinctions than play the silly “everyone is equally bad!” thing that seems so popular, especially among people who do not rely on facts, these days.
 
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Hm, I’d rather make fact based distinctions than play the silly “everyone is equally bad!” thing that seems so popular, especially among people who do not rely on facts, these days.
Between the two groups in the OP, which one would you say is worse?
 
from Forbes

https://www.forbes.com/sites/realsp...n-terrorist-attacks-on-u-s-soil/#3a3cc9711e74



You also quoted this date range ('92-2017), not since 2016... You should read what you quote.... You're living up to your stage name...


I'm not sure you can comprehend above a third grade level.

The range of 92 to 2017 consists of 23 murders from the left. However, since 2016 they have committed 13 compared to the 5 of the right.

The whole point of my quote was in the last 2 years, the left has been a lot worse than the right when it comes to domestic terrorism.

It's ok to admit you are wrong every now and then.
 
I don’t think I genuinely know enough about them to make a meaningful distinction.
Okay. Well, let's do some research together. Let's try to find an example of patriot prayer getting in the way of free speech. In other words, where they violently disrupt other groups from peacefully spreading their message. We don't even have to focus on what the message is. I don't know if there are instances or not. But let's look together.
 
I don’t think I genuinely know enough about them to make a meaningful distinction.
I tried. I can't find any examples of patriot prayer suppressing free speech.

Earlier in the thread, you called me a liar. My feelings aren't hurt or anything, but you then edited your post to say that you were done with this thread. You never gave me the courtesy of admitting that you were wrong. That's disappointing, but we're cool.
 
Both groups are filled with morons.

That written if I don't want to start trouble I am going to avoid hosting a "Lets go Auburn" rally in Tuscaloosa. Yet, Portland, Seattle, San Francisco is where these Prayer Patriots "rally". And the goal of the "rally" is to convert liberals to become part of the Prayer Patriot Movement? Please. It's their right to assemble and I support it, but come on. We're not looking for trouble we just want to "peacefully" educate these Ohio State fans why its better to root for Michigan.
 
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I tried. I can't find any examples of patriot prayer suppressing free speech.

Earlier in the thread, you called me a liar. My feelings aren't hurt or anything, but you then edited your post to say that you were done with this thread. You never gave me the courtesy of admitting that you were wrong. That's disappointing, but we're cool.
Very much how he operates. He won’t take you up on doing any research. He doesn’t want to know, because it destroys his narrative.
 
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I tried. I can't find any examples of patriot prayer suppressing free speech.

Earlier in the thread, you called me a liar. My feelings aren't hurt or anything, but you then edited your post to say that you were done with this thread. You never gave me the courtesy of admitting that you were wrong. That's disappointing, but we're cool.

Eh, here is the thing. You said this was a totally even thread until some Antifa apologists showed up. That’s bullshit. And Your focus on free speech is forced. Hey, let’s try this... lets find examples of Nazi Antifa! Whoops, can’t find any. You are literally going right at the “mission” of one side.

Listen, I’ve already said these Antifa people seem like violent assholes.

But you aren’t going to get me saying that they are worse than groups like white power folks or proud boys or whatever. Not only is their origin totally different (seems Antifa came about as an anti-Nazi movement, so as an actual response to assholes) but their history isn’t the same either. When you are comparing to right wing nutjobs, who have been responsible for ten times as many American deaths over the last thirty or so years, and you look at the idealogicical background, where you talk millions dead (including an entire swath of my own family), they just don’t compare. (Note for the logically impaired... “not worse” =/= “better”)

Again; these Antifa dickheads who are attacking people or whatever are douchebags. Full stop. Giant douchebags. They aren’t worse than the right wing douchebags. It seems both sides are intent on violence, which sucks, and sure as hell doesn’t further any reasonable, rational discussion about the issues we face.

Ultimately threads like this are dumb... they just dissolve into “well, THIS side is better than THAT side!” and “No, THAT side is worse than THIS side!”... often unsupported by anything other than emotion and a couple of click bait videos of some extremist punching someone or getting punched. It’s pointless. I think most of the posters here think this shit from both sides is ridiculous.
 
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Eh, here is the thing. You said this was a totally even thread until some Antifa apologists showed up. That’s bullshit. And Your focus on free speech is forced. Hey, let’s try this... lets find examples of Nazi Antifa! Whoops, can’t find any. You are literally going right at the “mission” of one side.

Listen, I’ve already said these Antifa people seem like violent assholes.

But you aren’t going to get me saying that they are worse than groups like white power folks or proud boys or whatever. Not only is their origin totally different (seems Antifa came about as an anti-Nazi movement, so as an actual response to assholes) but their history isn’t the same either. When you are comparing to right wing nutjobs, who have been responsible for ten times as many American deaths over the last thirty or so years, and you look at the idealogicical background, where you talk millions dead (including an entire swath of my own family), they just don’t compare. (Note for the logically impaired... “not worse” =/= “better”)

Again; these Antifa dickheads who are attacking people or whatever are douchebags. Full stop. Giant douchebags. They aren’t worse than the right wing douchebags. It seems both sides are intent on violence, which sucks, and sure as hell doesn’t further any reasonable, rational discussion about the issues we face.

Ultimately threads like this are dumb... they just dissolve into “well, THIS side is better than THAT side!” and “No, THAT side is worse than THIS side!”... often unsupported by anything other than emotion and a couple of click bait videos of some extremist punching someone or getting punched. It’s pointless. I think most of the posters here think this shit from both sides is ridiculous.
So both sides suck and it is pointless to say one is worse than the other when neither are doing any good?

I will overlook where you misrepresented what I said and am satisfied that we agree here.
 
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Both groups are filled with morons.

That written if I don't want to start trouble I am going to avoid hosting a "Lets go Auburn" rally in Tuscaloosa. Yet, Portland, Seattle, San Francisco is where these Prayer Patriots "rally". And the goal of the "rally" is to convert liberals to become part of the Prayer Patriot Movement? Please. It's their right to assemble and I support it, but come on. We're not looking for trouble we just want to "peacefully" educate these Ohio State fans why its better to root for Michigan.
This is true. I said essentially the same thing early in the thread. This is a topic worthy of discussion. It just shouldn't involve choosing sides. But that is bound to happen.
 
Both groups are filled with morons.

That written if I don't want to start trouble I am going to avoid hosting a "Lets go Auburn" rally in Tuscaloosa. Yet, Portland, Seattle, San Francisco is where these Prayer Patriots "rally". And the goal of the "rally" is to convert liberals to become part of the Prayer Patriot Movement? Please. It's their right to assemble and I support it, but come on. We're not looking for trouble we just want to "peacefully" educate these Ohio State fans why its better to root for Michigan.
This.
 
This is true. I said essentially the same thing early in the thread. This is a topic worthy of discussion. It just shouldn't involve choosing sides. But that is bound to happen.

What exactly is "worthy of discussion"? That a group of people for an objectively unworthy reason have chosen to antagonize another group of people under the guise of "peacefully demonstrating" and then want to be righteously indignant when the "peaceful demonstration" inevitably leads to trouble? Ok. Let's discuss. I'll start. I think it's a stupid idea to purposefully antagonize people in a manner that will 9 times out of 10 end in violence for the stated purpose of attempting to convert liberals into libertarians. Your thoughts?
 
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What exactly is "worthy of discussion"? That a group of people for an objectively unworthy reason have chosen to antagonize another group of people under the guise of "peacefully demonstrating" and then want to be righteously indignant when the "peaceful demonstration" inevitably leads to trouble? Ok. Let's discuss. I'll start. I think it's a stupid idea to purposefully antagonize people in a manner that will 9 times out of 10 end in violence for the stated purpose of attempting to convert liberals into libertarians. Your thoughts?
It's worthy of discussion because it is something that is happening on the streets of American cities. People have opinions and it is easy enough to just not chime in if you don't find it worthy of discussion.

You started by saying the same exact thing that has already been said. Including by me. I think we both agree that each group is a cancer to peace. But you seem to be putting a big chunk of the blame on one side.

I don't approve of these rallies, but without antifa, patriot prayer doesn't exist. I don't want to give either of these groups a pass. You are giving antifa 90% of a pass and patriot prayer 10%. That's a little crazy.
 
It's worthy of discussion because it is something that is happening on the streets of American cities. People have opinions and it is easy enough to just not chime in if you don't find it worthy of discussion.

You started by saying the same exact thing that has already been said. Including by me. I think we both agree that each group is a cancer to peace. But you seem to be putting a big chunk of the blame on one side.

I don't approve of these rallies, but without antifa, patriot prayer doesn't exist. I don't want to give either of these groups a pass. You are giving antifa 90% of a pass and patriot prayer 10%. That's a little crazy.
Interesting.
 
It's worthy of discussion because it is something that is happening on the streets of American cities. People have opinions and it is easy enough to just not chime in if you don't find it worthy of discussion.

You started by saying the same exact thing that has already been said. Including by me. I think we both agree that each group is a cancer to peace. But you seem to be putting a big chunk of the blame on one side.

I don't approve of these rallies, but without antifa, patriot prayer doesn't exist. I don't want to give either of these groups a pass. You are giving antifa 90% of a pass and patriot prayer 10%. That's a little crazy.

It's happening in American cities because idiots want to incite violence and a whole bunch of people cheer like its a sporting event rooting for "their side". And the idiots include anyone who wants to "debate" the issue as if its worthy of debate. I am calling them both out and the people engaged in a ridiculous debate. If more people did there would be less of it.

There are 300MM people talking and no one listening. Thanks Facebook. Winking
 
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It's happening in American cities because idiots want to incite violence and a whole bunch of people cheer like its a sporting event rooting for "their side". And the idiots include anyone who wants to "debate" the issue as if its worthy of debate. I am calling them both out and the people engaged in a ridiculous debate. If more people did there would be less of it. That includes you. Sorry.

There are 300MM people talking and no one listening. Thanks Facebook. Winking
Talking about idiots is not debating. I have never encouraged anyone to choose sides. We started this back and forth with me agreeing with your take on this nonsense. You somehow turned it into an argument.
 
Talking about idiots is not debating. I have never encouraged anyone to choose sides. We started this back and forth with me agreeing with your take on this nonsense. You somehow turned it into an argument.

I edited the part out turning it into an argument before you replied. That was my bad.
 
See how civil we are becoming?
No hidden message. Just wanted you to see this.

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