Schools Most Overdue For a Final Four

[dukedevilz]

Just something I thought of. Kind of curious which schools are long overdue. I took all the schools that have made at least two Final Fours, calculated the average number of years it takes a program to make a Final Four (Duke has made 16 FF's, so for an 80 year Tournament, we average a FF every 5 years). If you subtract the number of consecutive years a team has missed the FF from the average # of years it takes to make one, that is the determining factor for which schools are the most overdue. A lower number means you're long overdue! Congrats to K-State for being the most overdue Power-6 school. And Oregon can take it easy for the next 38 years. You guys have already hit your average recently of making the Final Four every 40 years.

 

[dukedevilz]

I'll have to divide these images up evenly in the future so they align better. Oh well. You can double-click on the first image and that will make it somewhat easier to see fully aligned.

 

[WeAreDePaul]

No respect given for winning at NIT title when it was considered more important than the NCAA title. #sad

 

[dukedevilz]

No respect given for winning at NIT title when it was considered more important than the NCAA title. #sad

How did I forget to put DePaul on there? Sorry, honest mistake. So two Final Fours and last one was in 1979. That means DePaul actually hit the mark right on the head. You'd be slightly ahead of Ohio State on this list for being the most overdue.

As far as the NIT, yes, it's true. Many regarded it as the more prestigious of tournaments until maybe the 50's? Even so, it was just a quick little calculation that I did. Not sure how you would factor NIT berths into the equation.

 

[dukedevilz]

NIT Glory Days. #99 is George Freaking Mikan.

 

[KerryRhodes]

Louisville

Cards havent had a Final Four since 2005.

 

[Kevin Bryan]

According to that, UK should be making the FF this year.

 

[imajericho]

Unc

 

[dukedevilz]

Louisville

Cards havent had a Final Four since 2005.

Revisionist history ain't my thing. Hancock didn't compete unattached and win Most Outstanding Player for himself. He was representing Louisville.

 

[dukedevilz]

According to that, UK should be making the FF this year.

If you take teams with a realistic shot at the FF this year, I'd say Kentucky, Duke, Ohio State, and Purdue are the most overdue.

 

[dragonhawk1855]

Iowa as the time before the one before the last one was in 1956..

 

[ExitFlagger]

Iowa as the time before the one before the last one was in 1956..

I have a theory that "Iowa" would be your answer to virtually any question. I want to test this theory.

Which is the most underrated basketball program in the country?

Which team would place the most players on a top 100 list this season?

What is the greatest state in the USA?

 

[dragonhawk1855]

I have a theory that "Iowa" would be your answer to virtually any question. I want to test this theory.

Which is the most underrated basketball program in the country?

Which team would place the most players on a top 100 list this season?

What is the greatest state in the USA?

under rated Purdue as far as the BT is concerned Iowa has a ways to go before they can be considered under rated

in the country that would be Duke with Kentucky a close 2nd.

I may be a Hawk fan but am realistic enough to answer questions with a fair answer.

 

[ExitFlagger]

under rated Purdue as far as the BT is concerned Iowa has a ways to go before they can be considered under rated

in the country that would be Duke with Kentucky a close 2nd.

I may be a Hawk fan but am realistic enough to answer questions with a fair answer.

So Iowa is overrated?

 

[dragonhawk1855]

So Iowa is overrated?

nope neither over rated nor under rated.

 

[dragonhawk1855]

So Iowa is overrated?

you tell me Iowa has 6 4* players by ESPN with 4 of them top 100 4* players
Jordan All BT FR Team after JR Season 3rd team All BT
Garza All BT FR Team after SO season HM All BT.
Wieskamp All BT FR Team preseason All BT Team

of the 3 only Jordan is questionable as to if he will play or not. new additions
GT RSSR Evelyn who started at Nebraska before transferring to Valpo.
4* Top 100 F Patrick McC
4* PG Toussaint Finalist for NY Mr. BB
Gatorade POY in Kentucky CG Fredrick who RS'd
Nunge who RS'd after ending the season as the 5th leading scorer and 2nd on the team in Blocks with 25 in 14 starts as a FR
Pemsl who RS'd because of surgey on his knee with 18 starts finishing in 5th in scoring and was 3rd in rebounding with 144 total.

 

[IUfanBorden]

If you take teams with a realistic shot at the FF this year, I'd say Kentucky, Duke, Ohio State, and Purdue are the most overdue.

OSU and Purdue?

 

[dukedevilz]

OSU and Purdue?

Purdue might be a little bit of a reach. I think OSU can definitely make the Final Four. I'd give them a preseason seed of a 4 or 5 maybe.

 

[IUfanBorden]

Purdue might be a little bit of a reach. I think OSU can definitely make the Final Four. I'd give them a preseason seed of a 4 or 5 maybe.

Really? I don't see OSU as being a legit FF contender. Maybe I am missing something on them?

 

[dragonhawk1855]

with Iowa if Jordan RS's next season will be the best chance at a FF since the Davis years, they only loses Kriener and Evelyn to graduation.

with these being the SR's
RSSR Jordan
RSSR Pemsl
SR Garza
SR Till
then it will be interesting as to who they bring in in the 2020 class, they already have Ulis, 4* top 100 Foster is shown as 100% to Iowa by both Rivals and 247, 4* Top 100 Sibley has Iowa in his top 2.

that would be a nice addition to what returns.

 

[VulvHa]

with Iowa if Jordan RS's next season will be the best chance at a FF since the Davis years, they only loses Kriener and Evelyn to graduation.

with these being the SR's
RSSR Jordan
RSSR Pemsl
SR Garza
SR Till
then it will be interesting as to who they bring in in the 2020 class, they already have Ulis, 4* top 100 Foster is shown as 100% to Iowa by both Rivals and 247, 4* Top 100 Sibley has Iowa in his top 2.

that would be a nice addition to what returns.

Gil - I think there is about a 0.000000000000% chance that @dukedevilz will be responding to the above...

 

[MGC_07]

with Iowa if Jordan RS's next season will be the best chance at a FF since the Davis years, they only loses Kriener and Evelyn to graduation.

with these being the SR's
RSSR Jordan
RSSR Pemsl
SR Garza
SR Till
then it will be interesting as to who they bring in in the 2020 class, they already have Ulis, 4* top 100 Foster is shown as 100% to Iowa by both Rivals and 247, 4* Top 100 Sibley has Iowa in his top 2.

that would be a nice addition to what returns.

Jordan Bohannon and Garza are not the first and second options of Final Four caliber teams.

 

[dukedevilz]

Really? I don't see OSU as being a legit FF contender. Maybe I am missing something on them?

I wouldn't put them in the same class as MSU, Kansas, Louisville, Florida, UK, Duke, UNC, etc. Second-tier contender. I see them as a top 20 team at least.

Kaleb Wesson I think is good enough to make one of the All-American teams if OSU can win 25+ games. Andre Wesson and Luther Muhammad, two starters from last year, return. Duane Washington and Kyle Young, two solid bench contributors, also return. They're bringing in CJ Walker, who started for FSU on their Elite 8 Team in 2018. And of course they're bringing in 3 top 50 recruits in Carton, Liddell, and Gaffney.

 

[IUfanBorden]

I wouldn't put them in the same class as MSU, Kansas, Louisville, Florida, UK, Duke, UNC, etc. Second-tier contender. I see them as a top 20 team at least.

Kaleb Wesson I think is good enough to make one of the All-American teams if OSU can win 25+ games. Andre Wesson and Luther Muhammad, two starters from last year, return. Duane Washington and Kyle Young, two solid bench contributors, also return. They're bringing in CJ Walker, who started for FSU on their Elite 8 Team in 2018. And of course they're bringing in 3 top 50 recruits in Carton, Liddell, and Gaffney.

Walker can play. I forgot about him. He's an Indiana kid. Also didn't realize they were bringing in 3, Top 50 kids. Wesson brothers are solid.

SO when you put it on paper, I guess they could be a FF contender.

 

[Jaycg15]

Walker can play. I forgot about him. He's an Indiana kid. Also didn't realize they were bringing in 3, Top 50 kids. Wesson brothers are solid.

SO when you put it on paper, I guess they could be a FF contender.

OSU has a lot of talent this year. I think they could finish 2nd in the Big 10. Holtmann is a stud.

 

[dragonhawk1855]

Gil - I think there is about a 0.000000000000% chance that @dukedevilz will be responding to the above...

I could F'n care less what he does. he can leave the board and I doubt he would be missed.

 

[dragonhawk1855]

Jordan Bohannon and Garza are not the first and second options of Final Four caliber teams.

why because they play for Fran or is it because they are slow unathletic white men?

 

[dragonhawk1855]

Jordan Bohannon and Garza are not the first and second options of Final Four caliber teams.

when Lutes team made the FF these were the top options
6'11 Waite [white]
6'11 Kraftcism [white]
6'5 SG FR Hanson [white]
6'0 PG SR Lestor [African American]

minus Hanson this group won a share of the BT Championship.

 

[MGC_07]

why because they play for Fran or is it because they are slow unathletic white men?

Both

 

[WeAreDePaul]

I could F'n care less what he does. he can leave the board and I doubt he would be missed.

lol you'd be dead wrong about that. I don't think it's crazy to say DD is the most valuable poster on this entire board. No one contributes more to the enjoyment of this place than him.

 

[dukedevilz]

lol you'd be dead wrong about that. I don't think it's crazy to say DD is the most valuable poster on this entire board. No one contributes more to the enjoyment of this place than him.

Thanks, bud. Appreciate it.

 

[dukedevilz]

Both

And it's not to say that two white guys can't lead their team to a Final Four. Duke had Jon Scheyer & Kyle Singler in 2010. Butler had Gordon Hayward and Matt Howard in the same year. Wisconsin had Frank Kaminsky and Sam Dekker in 2014 & 2015. Virginia had Kyle Guy and Ty Jerome this past season (Jerome is 1/4 black, though). Those were very elite players on elite teams. Bohannon and Garza are decent players. They could maybe win a game or two if everything goes well. Still have a hard time seeing Iowa advancing to the second weekend - this year or next.

 

[MGC_07]

And it's not to say that two white guys can't lead their team to a Final Four. Duke had Jon Scheyer & Kyle Singler in 2010. Butler had Gordon Hayward and Matt Howard in the same year. Wisconsin had Frank Kaminsky and Sam Dekker in 2014 & 2015. Virginia had Kyle Guy and Ty Jerome this past season (Jerome is 1/4 black, though). Those were very elite players on elite teams. Bohannon and Garza are decent players. They could maybe win a game or two if everything goes well. Still have a hard time seeing Iowa advancing to the second weekend - this year or next.

Exactly. It’s not that they’re white, it’s that they just aren’t elite Final Four level players. Gordon Hayward and Kyle Singler are. Jordan Bohannon and Garza are good players surely, but with Fran at the helm and the rest of that team, they aren’t going to a Final Four.

 

[pig1960]

Thanks, bud. Appreciate it.

I concur- damn shame you’re a ****ing shitty Duke fan though.

 

[dukedevilz]

I concur- damn shame you’re a ****ing shitty Duke fan though.

I know, right!? I tried to be a Carolina fan when I was like 7. Everyone else around me was. But, I had to distance myself from those ugly ass colors.

 

[dukedevilz]

Here's an overview of Ohio State and Purdue for those that are curious what their rosters might look like.

 

[Jaycg15]

Here's an overview of Ohio State and Purdue for those that are curious what their rosters might look like.

Carton and Liddell are studs in the making. Gaffney is no slouch either. If they're both there in 3 years, that team is going to do a lot of damage.

 

[dukedevilz]

Carton and Liddell are studs in the making. Gaffney is no slouch either. If they're both there in 3 years, that team is going to do a lot of damage.

Holtmann is doing work. Seriously. The team he inherited was barely above .500 in 2017. He lost 3 starters from that team. Comes in the first year and they're a top 20 team - KBD is a superstar and earns All-American honors. Second year he loses 3 starters again. Only brings in 1 top 100 kid and still manages a 2nd round game. Once he has continuity + talent his program is going to wreak havoc. I see them as the #3 Big Ten team right now behind MSU and Maryland. If they get enough guys to stick around for another year, they might be the favorites to win the BT in 2021 - and probable top 10 team.

 

[AWilli6995]

I know, right!? I tried to be a Carolina fan when I was like 7. Everyone else around me was. But, I had to distance myself from those ugly ass colors.

Hey now! Those colors are cool and btw I love what you bring to this board. It looks like you hurt that Iowa fans' feelings when you listed your top players.

 

[dukedevilz]

Hey now! Those colors are cool and btw I love what you bring to this board. It looks like you hurt that Iowa fans' feelings when you listed your top players.

No doubt. He has a hard time reconciling the fact that a .500 team in conference play probably doesn't have 4 of the top 150 players. Any time you try to reason with him he tries to spout off how Iowa has six 4-star recruits. Whoopty-Freakin-Doo. Northwestern also has six 4-star recruits (if you use the ESPN rankings). Ain't nobody talking about Northwestern killing it this year; they were picked last in the Big Ten. You need a combination of talent, player development, continuity, and good coaching to really have a shot a conference title - or a Final Four. Here are the 6 NW guys, FWIW.

2019:
4* Robbie Beran, 82 ranking on ESPN
4* Jared Jones, 82 ranking on ESPN
2018:
4* Pete Nance, 84 ranking on ESPN
4* Miller Kopp, 81 ranking on ESPN
2017:
4* Anthony Gaines, 80 ranking on ESPN
2015:
4* AJ Turner, 80 ranking on ESPN