Mike Brey--seat getting warm?

Discussion in 'College Basketball Board' started by GE Nole, Mar 5, 2020.

  1. GE Nole

    GE Nole Well-Known Member
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    What's y'alls thoughts on Brey? They had those Elite 8 runs a few years back but this will be 3 straight years with no tourney appearances. The ND board I went to seemed like there was some frustration bubbling over.

    And the thing is, they are pretty dang talented. 7 four-star recruits with 6 top 100 kids. It's not a Shaka Smart level of underachievement, but it's certainly not getting it done. By comparison, the 25-5 FSU team has 4 top 100 kids, one of whom is a banged up freshman that plays about 6 minutes a game.
     
  2. UL_1986

    UL_1986 Well-Known Member
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    Idk, but I hate playing at ND. Even when their squad is mediocre it’s a tough out in their gym. We barely squeaked a win in this year with far superior talent.
     
  3. dukedevilz

    dukedevilz Well-Known Member
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    Brey has been at Notre Dame for the past 20 years, crazy to think he's been there that long, and they've managed to be in the NCAA Tournament 12 times during that span. That's solid. But yes, going three straight years without a tournament appearance is going to sting. If not for injuries to Bonzie Colson and Matt Ferrell in 2018, I'm certain they would have made the tournament. Last year may have actually been worse, in terms of having an injury-riddled team. I want to say they played several ACC games with only 6 scholarship players suiting up. I would cut him some slack for that aspect, just don't know if the administration is going to be so forgiving.

    The recruiting has been suffering a little lately, too. The 2018 class was good, but that's about it. Juwan Durham was a nice transfer pickup. And Cormac Ryan should be a valuable piece next year. Overall though, it's been a tad underwhelming. He's going to be losing Mooney, Gibbs, and Pfluegger after this season, so it's possible they could actually be worse next year. Wouldn't be surprised if AD asks him to gracefully consider retirement this year or next. He'll be 61 years old in two weeks. Seems like he's losing steam.

    Danny Manning apparently is already in the process of negotiating a buyout with Wake Forest. I've heard they are interested in hiring BYU's Mark Pope, who was an assistant there 9 years ago. I also expect Josh Pastner to be shown the door relatively soon.
     
  4. dukedevilz

    dukedevilz Well-Known Member
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    Well, Cormac Ryan is sitting out as a transfer. And Robby Carmody has been injured for the better part of the last two years. He's played less than 100 minutes this year. So, more like 4 top 100 kids.
     
  5. GE Nole

    GE Nole Well-Known Member
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    4 top 100 kids is still more than many teams. I don’t really see talent as an excuse for them not making the Dance this year.

    And while injuries have hurt them in previous years, part of that is not developing functional depth. You can’t just rely on 7 guys unless you have a Duke type of roster from a talent standpoint.
     
  6. dukedevilz

    dukedevilz Well-Known Member
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    One of the bigger issues with Brey, IMO, is the fact that he's not using all of his scholarships. I think he's been pretty close to 10 guys the past three years. So yeah, if you get down to 7 guys and you have to rely on Nikola Djogo for 20 minutes a night, it could be rough. But that's on Brey. He needs to use 12 scholarships at a minimum. I'm sure he could have had a semi-decent grad transfer.
     
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  7. dukedevilz

    dukedevilz Well-Known Member
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    Here's a breakdown of top 100 recruits (RSCI Composite) for ACC schools. I'm excluding transfers that are sitting out (i.e. Sam Hauser) - and players that have had season-ending injuries (i.e. Anthony Harris).

    8- Duke
    7- Louisville
    5- Miami
    4- FSU
    4- UNC
    4- Virginia
    4- Notre Dame
    3- Virginia Tech
    2- NC State
    2- Clemson
    2- Boston College
    2- Wake Forest
    1- Syracuse
    1- Pittsburgh
    1- Georgia Tech

    Crazy that Syracuse only has one top 100 recruit that's seeing the court. And that one player is Brycen Goodine, who is averaging just 2 point a game.
     
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  8. MrBaracus

    MrBaracus Well-Known Member
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    He should have beaten the greatest team of all time, 2015 Kentucky. I say give him a raise.
     
  9. lurkeraspect84

    lurkeraspect84 Well-Known Member
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    Me too.
     
  10. toonces11

    toonces11 Well-Known Member
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    I think teams like ND should think long and hard about firing a very solid and 20 yr Veteran coach who has had a fair deal of success. You better have an absolute ringer lined up. Pretty sure Texas would take Barnes back in a heart beat.
     
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  11. GE Nole

    GE Nole Well-Known Member
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    Good breakdown. So tell me again why ND can't be having 22+ wins this season? Are Hamilton and Bennett just THAT much better at developing players?
     
  12. dukedevilz

    dukedevilz Well-Known Member
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    I think the biggest difference between Brey and Hamilton/Bennett is the emphasis on defense. I mean, look at their Elite 8 teams from 2015 & 2016. The 2015 team had a defense that was rated 99th - the 2016 team had a defense rated 156th. Sad to say, but in the KenPom era, only once has Brey had a defense ranked in the top 50. I don't think that's a coincidence. They're generally a fun team to watch, but not exactly the style you want for championship basketball.

    He usually has really good offensive teams. One big surrounded by multiple good shooters. And that very efficient offense often masks the limitations of the defense. He either just needs better recruits, or direct more of his focus on the defensive side of things. If the status-quo remains for Notre Dame, they need a really elite offense to make the tournament.
     
  13. dukedevilz

    dukedevilz Well-Known Member
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    Now, all that being said, since Hamilton started at FSU, Brey has won 11 NCAA tournament games. And Hamilton has won 9. So he does have the edge in that department.
     
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  14. pontiff322

    pontiff322 New Member
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    The biggest reason is ND is pretty crummy in close games. They are 4-7 (Literally 35% of their total games played! ) in one possession games this year. Including last minute losses to UL, FSU twice, and UVA.

    Two of the wins were extremely lucky too, as Nate Leszewski hit 3s at the buzzer to beat UNC and send it to OT vs Toledo.
     
  15. GE Nole

    GE Nole Well-Known Member
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    No doubt that Brey has had good success at ND. Can’t question his historical work.

    But it should probably be noted that:
    1. Brey has been there 2 years longer
    2. He took over an ND team that won 22 games the year before. Hamilton took over an FSU team that won 21 games in the previous two years combined. Not quite apples to apples in terms of the rebuild that had to be done the first 3-4 years.
     
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  16. Ipartiedwithhopgood

    Ipartiedwithhopgood Well-Known Member
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    Doesn't shave, just a sloppy guy. Could be fun to go on a bender with. Wouldn't trust him with my sister if I had one.
     
  17. dukedevilz

    dukedevilz Well-Known Member
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    I was counting Brey's tournament wins starting in 2002-03, Hamilton's initial year. He had an additional two tournament wins that I didn't include. So yes, I would agree they started on different ground. Brey certainly had an edge. The 2000 Notre Dame team was nothing special, however. They went 17-13 in the regular season. Went on a nice run in the NIT. I was surprised that Doherty left, though, because I thought he had a really good relationship with Troy Murphy.

    Also, it's important to consider the fact that Notre Dame hadn't been to the tournament since 1990. And they hadn't won a tournament game since 1989. So while Brey hasn't come remotely close to matching Digger Phelps's success from the 70's and 80's, he has been relatively consistent. He's helped make Notre Dame relevant again. Notre Dame has been ranked in the final AP Poll eight different times under his reign.
     
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