Billy Donovan return to college ball?

IUBtown

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Norte Dame basketball has as good of a chance of being excellent as Indiana football. Also Donovan won’t be returning to college as long as nba teams are interested, and they are.
 
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SheriffBufordTJustice

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In the minds of the ignorant
Norte Dame basketball has as good of a chance of being excellent as Indiana football. Also Donovan won’t be returning to college as long as nba teams are interested, and they are.
That isn't all the way true.
College jobs have trumped NBA jobs before. Just matters the person..

I don't know him personally so I can't speak on it

I do know it is looking less likely that it is Philadelphia.
Plus you have the issue with Sam Presti in OKC. Does Billy believe he deserves more of a say on personnel
 

IUBtown

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That isn't all the way true.
College jobs has trumped NBA jobs before. Just matters the person..

I don't know him personally so I can't speak on it

I do know it is looking less likely that it is Philadelphia.
Plus you have the issue with Sam Presti in OKC. Does Billy believe he deserves more of a say on personnel issues
Who that had a choice?
 

SheriffBufordTJustice

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Who that had a choice?
Calipari just turned down the NBA again.
He failed in his career so maybe he is different.

But looking at this from a coaching perspective.
College coaches have more control. They are 100% in control at all times of their roster.

Not the case in the NBA lots of times. Plus Billy Donovan had his run ins with Westbrook and Durant.

I don't know him personally so I don't know what he is thinking.
But you could see why some coaches would prefer college if the money is equal.
 

klize17

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But you could see why some coaches would prefer college if the money is equal.
If the money is the same and you have the option to stay in the pros it is a no-brainer for the pros.

Do you want summer's off being around your family or chasing 15-17 year old kids for multiple years around the country while having to kiss their ass?
 
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SheriffBufordTJustice

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In the minds of the ignorant
If the money is the same and you have the option to stay in the pros it is a no-brainer for the pros.

Do you want summer's off being around your family or chasing 15-17 year old kids for multiple years around the country while having to kiss their ass?
Each person is different.
I think the control factor is a plus to some. Those kids you are chasing are your players.

In the NBA you have a front office. A lot of issues in the NBA are coaches and the front office over players.
 

klize17

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Each person is different.
I think the control factor is a plus to some. Those kids you are chasing are your players.

In the NBA you have a front office. A lot of issues in the NBA are coaches and the front office over players.
The two guys who have made the switch recently and have been successful are Donovan and Stevens. Neither one wants anything to do with recruiting. They are the only two who have the option to stay in the NBA even when fired or let go. I do not see either one coming back to college.
 
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IUBtown

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Calipari just turned down the NBA again.
He failed in his career so maybe he is different.

But looking at this from a coaching perspective.
College coaches have more control. They are 100% in control at all times of their roster.

Not the case in the NBA lots of times. Plus Billy Donovan had his run ins with Westbrook and Durant.

I don't know him personally so I don't know what he is thinking.
But you could see why some coaches would prefer college if the money is equal.
Im talking leaving the NBA to go back to college. Cal is making 10mil and already has his program established. Plus the way he can recruit it’s different then most every other coach. Name me one coach who left the NBA to return to college who could have stayed in the NBA. The reason Donovan and Stevens won’t leave the NBA and the reason why Beilein left for the NBA is because it’s a better life. No chasing recruits all summer, sitting in a tiny hot ass high school gym in bfe. They’re spending time with their family on vacation. Less work, less headache worrying what the 18-22yo are doing while not around you.
 

IUfanBorden

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If the money is the same and you have the option to stay in the pros it is a no-brainer for the pros.

Do you want summer's off being around your family or chasing 15-17 year old kids for multiple years around the country while having to kiss their ass?
I mean how much do you have off, really? If you are a successful NBA coach, you could find yourself playing to the middle of June....Not to mention, season starts in October. So in the NBA, you have roughly a 7-8 month season---Off for 3 months. THen there's the travel....West coast trips---East Coast trips. For the most part, a college HC is home every single night. There are no 2 week road trips.
Now, you go from coaching 16-19 year-olds, who HAVE to listen to you. WHo you basically have 100% control over. Not so in the NBA...YOu are coaching millionaires..Grown ass men. Who you have basically ZERO control over, off the floor. You have basically zero control over your roster...You might to use that 1st round pick on a PG----But the front office wants a big.

Give me the college game where I control my team, my roster, my schedule, my travel---basically, I control MY JOB.
 
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klize17

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I mean how much do you have off, really? If you are a successful NBA coach, you could find yourself playing to the middle of June....Not to mention, season starts in October. So in the NBA, you have roughly a 7-8 month season---Off for 3 months. THen there's the travel....West coast trips---East Coast trips. For the most part, a college HC is home every single night. There are no 2 week road trips.
Now, you go from coaching 16-19 year-olds, who HAVE to listen to you. WHo you basically have 100% control over. Not so in the NBA...YOu are coaching millionaires..Grown ass men. Who you have basically ZERO control over, off the floor. You have basically zero control over your roster...You might to use that 1st round pick on a PG----But the front office wants a big.

Give me the college game where I control my team, my roster, my schedule, my travel---basically, I control MY JOB.
If you are coaching until June you had a fantastic season in a great franchise who works with you.

Otherwise you are done by April or May and you aren’t brown nosing and having to rely on children all year long.
 

IUBtown

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I mean how much do you have off, really? If you are a successful NBA coach, you could find yourself playing to the middle of June....Not to mention, season starts in October. So in the NBA, you have roughly a 7-8 month season---Off for 3 months. THen there's the travel....West coast trips---East Coast trips. For the most part, a college HC is home every single night. There are no 2 week road trips.
Now, you go from coaching 16-19 year-olds, who HAVE to listen to you. WHo you basically have 100% control over. Not so in the NBA...YOu are coaching millionaires..Grown ass men. Who you have basically ZERO control over, off the floor. You have basically zero control over your roster...You might to use that 1st round pick on a PG----But the front office wants a big.

Give me the college game where I control my team, my roster, my schedule, my travel---basically, I control MY JOB.
You couldn’t be more wrong. You think kids that grow up with their egos stroked since middle school are easy to deal with? Hormones and chasing tail, worried about getting in trouble? Or grown ass men that for the most part act as professionals or they’re traded. I’m just telling you what we’ve heard from many mods over the course of several coaching searches. I’m still waiting for someone to tell me one name of a coach who was successful in the NBA, wanted and could remain in the NBA but went back to college. I’m surprised we don’t hear about all these NBA coaches beating down the doors to coach in college.
 
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IUfanBorden

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You couldn’t be more wrong. You think kids that grow up with their egos stroked since middle school are easy to deal with? Hormones and chasing tail, worried about getting in trouble? Or grown ass men that for the most part act as professionals or they’re traded. I’m just telling you what we’ve heard from many mods over the course of several coaching searches. I’m still waiting for someone to tell me one name of a coach who was successful in the NBA, wanted and could remain in the NBA but went back to college. I’m surprised we don’t hear about all these NBA coaches beating down the doors to coach in college.
Its just my opinion...For me. I cannot speak for others. I mean if you are succesful in the NBA, I doubt returning to CBB is on your mind.

As for kids growing up, having their egos stroked, being easy to deal with? I never said it was easy. I just said you have more control of what they do. I mean, NBA dudes also have had their ego's stroked---and for much longer. They become pampered....And ya know, they still chase some tail.
 
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IUfanBorden

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If you are coaching until June you had a fantastic season in a great franchise who works with you.

Otherwise you are done by April or May and you aren’t brown nosing and having to rely on children all year long.
Phil Jackson says, "hold my beer"..SmokinSmile...

True you don't have to worry about childeren---But you sometimes have to worry about adults, acting like children...Or holding out...contract issues, etc, etc...

Just for me, I'd rather be a college coach.
 

Gater4Life

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Phil Jackson says, "hold my beer"..SmokinSmile...

True you don't have to worry about childeren---But you sometimes have to worry about adults, acting like children...Or holding out...contract issues, etc, etc...

Just for me, I'd rather be a college coach.
I can agree with this. I can certainly see why someone would want to work in college vs the NBA. Billy Donovan clearly isn't that person. He literally picked the NBA over college.
 
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SheriffBufordTJustice

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Control....

Some coaches want absolute control. You don't get that in the NBA.

College coaches have more control.
There isn't a GM or a Front Office determining who is on your roster and even at times who plays or not.


Everyone is different.
Very few coaches in the NBA get this power.

You say recruiting...but at least that is the player you want. In the NBA your success isn't determined just by you. For some coaches this bothers them.
 

SheriffBufordTJustice

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I can agree with this. I can certainly see why someone would want to work in college vs the NBA. Billy Donovan clearly isn't that person. He literally picked the NBA over college.
Things could change. We will see.
Donovan had issues with Westbrook and Durant but was able to work with CP3.



Watch Philadelphia and Chicago. Been hearing mixed messages from both.

None of us know him personally so it is all speculation
But we will know by October.
 
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Villian07

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I realize we are all a bit skewed being college basketball fans, but when if ever has a coach had success in the NBA and decided to go back to college. Not often if ever.

I know there’s plenty of successful guys that have never tried in the nba, but most of the time coaches return to college from the nba if/when they are unsuccessful in the nba such as Pitino and Cal.
 

SheriffBufordTJustice

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You also have that belief...

That college coaches can't win in the NBA.

This includes Brad Stevens and Billy Donovan.

Celtics success has more to do with Danny Ainge and the OKC Thunder Sam Presti.
How the hell did Ainge get rid of those veterans for draft picks. He did both Brooklyn and Dallas wrong.

Celtics could move on from Brad Stevens in the future as well.
As much talent as they have put on that team they have underachieved.
We will see in the ECF this year
 

klize17

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You also have that belief...

That college coaches can't win in the NBA.

This includes Brad Stevens and Billy Donovan.

Celtics success has more to do with Danny Ainge and the OKC Thunder Sam Presti.
How the hell did Ainge get rid of those veterans for draft picks. He did both Brooklyn and Dallas wrong.

Celtics could move on from Brad Stevens in the future as well.
As much talent as they have put on that team they have underachieved.
We will see in the ECF this year
If the Celtics are dumb enough to move on from Brad Stevens another NBA team will fire their existing coach and hire Brad in a heartbeat. He is 43 and a top 5 coach in the association.

You put way too much credit on the front office. Also in a winning franchise, such as the Celtics, Brad has a massive say on what happens.

Saying Brad Stevens has "underachieved" when he has been to the Conference Finals 3 out of the last 4 years with the previous two times losing to LeBron and is now the favorite to win the Conference Finals is laughable.
 
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SheriffBufordTJustice

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If the Celtics are dumb enough to move on from Brad Stevens another NBA team will fire their existing coach and hire Brad in a heartbeat. He is 43 and a top 5 coach in the association.

You put way too much credit on the front office. Also in a winning franchise, such as the Celtics, Brad has a massive say on what happens.

Saying Brad Stevens has "underachieved" when he has been to the Conference Finals 3 out of the last 4 years with the previous two times losing to LeBron and is now the favorite to win the Conference Finals is laughable.
Coaching doesn't turn players into All Stars...

Development does but those players must have the upside
Evaluation comes from the front office.
Just matters how much say a coach has in it


Brad Stevens isn't a Top 5 coach.
Nothing against him but he hasn't earned that in the NBA yet.

Danny Ainge actually moved on from an actual Top 5 coach in Doc Rivers.

Shows how much value he puts into the job
He would trade a coach for compensation
 

SheriffBufordTJustice

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Compare John Wooden to Phil Jackson

Wooden gets all the credit while you have naysayers for Jackson

Ultimately the issue with the NBA is the coach receives none of the credit and receives all the blame

At least in college coaches get credit. They are the face of the program.

Back to control and what type of person Billy Donovan actually is
 

klize17

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Compare John Wooden to Phil Jackson

Wooden gets all the credit while you have naysayers for Jackson
You and I are going have to agree to disagree with this, but Hall of Fame, 11x NBA Champion and greatest coach in NBA history Phil Jackson probably gives zero ****s about supposed "naysayers"

Also hilarious to me again that you bring up John Wooden, who had Sam Gilbert by his side paying players to come to Westwood.

"Wooden gets all the credit"

 
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SheriffBufordTJustice

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You and I are going have to agree to disagree with this, but Hall of Fame, 11x NBA Champion and greatest coach in NBA history Phil Jackson probably gives zero ****s about supposed "naysayers"

Also hilarious to me again that you bring up John Wooden, who had Sam Gilbert by his side paying players to come to Westwood.

"Wooden gets all the credit"

We weren't arguing what Phil Jackson thinks.

Your claim was that it was 100% NBA for everyone
Point is that it matters the coach. Some people like the idea that they are the captain of their own ship.

You really think Bobby Knight wanted anything to do with the NBA
Guy wanted complete control of his program... A lot of college coaches are like that.

End of the day the coaches are the first thing that comes to everyone's mind

When you say Chicago Bulls you think of Jordan
When you say Duke you think of Coach K
 

klize17

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Your claim was that it was 100% NBA for everyone
No it wasn't. It was for the guys who jump to the NBA and are successful. They wanted to jump for the NBA for a reason and when they are successful such as Donovan you do not see those guys going back to college. Many insiders have said that Donovan hated recruiting. That hasn't changed

I have never once said it is 100% NBA for every basketball coach in college.
 

Villian07

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Obviously there are many great coaches who never coached in the nba. But of those that do, the successful ones, usually don’t come back to college, sans maybe Larry brown. It just doesn’t happen and there’s a reason for that. The nba is the better gig.
 
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SheriffBufordTJustice

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It is a personal choice.

Out of all the ones who have there aren't many who have had success since early 90's https://www.espn.com/mens-college-b...29/how-college-coaches-fared-nba?platform=amp
Larry Brown is the only one I remember who won a NBa Championship and he was ran out of College Basketball three different times like I said earlier.

I don't know personally what Larry Brown preferred.
Larry Brown was an asshole as a coach.
When he did have success he had coaches on the floor
Mark Jackson with the Clippers and Pacers
Chauncey Phillips with the Pistons
Tried every way he could to get Iverson to listen but they butted heads. Pretty legendary the battles Iverson and L Brown had

Funny thing is AI says he should have listened to Larry Brown earlier in his career
 

SheriffBufordTJustice

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Rewatch I believe the 2008 NBA Finals with the Lakers. Look how they just ended that series on the defensive end.

Might be too young to remember Doc Rivers play.
When they tell you about a Chicago PG Doc Rivers is one of the main ones you think about
Tough defense. His mentality on the court is what you see as a coach.
 

SheriffBufordTJustice

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Matters the coach

I see the benefit of either one.

More power in college and you receive more of the credit

Not everyone cares about things like this

People already mentioned recruiting. To get your own team you have to recruit.

In the NBA can be the best coach in the world but you have a bunch of chickens in the front office It could be hard.

In college you never have to ask anyone to bring a player in. It is your choice.
 
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Global Havok

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I thought I had read that he left OKC because he didn't want to have build a team back up?

The Bull's aren't contending any time soon for a title unless they make some huge free agency moves. (AD??)
 
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lurkeraspect84

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I thought I had read that he left OKC because he didn't want to have build a team back up?

The Bull's aren't contending any time soon for a title unless they make some huge free agency moves. (AD??)
It will be interesting if AD has interest in returning to Chicago after he gets a ring.
 
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Gater4Life

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I would much rather be the coach in OKC with their talent and future draft picks. Maybe they just weren't willing to give Billy the long-term contract he was looking for.
 
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Global Havok

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I would much rather be the coach in OKC with their talent and future draft picks. Maybe they just weren't willing to give Billy the long-term contract he was looking for.
Only thing I can figure is that it is easier (though not as much as a few years ago) to reach the finals in the East than the West.

From what I read, OKC offered him a long term extension just before the restart in Orlando. That could obviously be wrong, but that is what I read last week.
 
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IUfanBorden

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Danny Ainge actually moved on from an actual Top 5 coach in Doc Rivers.
Same Doc Rivers who's teams have blown THREE, 3-1 leads in the playoffs? MOF, Rivers coached teams have lost 6 series when leading 3-2,or 3-1. Sure he has a title(2008), and been to the Finals again in 2010. But since then, his teams have made the Conference Finals ONCE---and that was in a shortened 2012 season. Also, since that 2010 Finals, his teams have lost in the 1st round, 4X's, and missed the playoffs once.

If that is a Top 5 coach, then son of a bitch has the NBA ever fallen.

And FTR, I agreee Stevens hasn't earned Top 5 status, BUT.....Since Year 3 his Celtic teams have played .590 ball, or better. Has 3 season of 64% or better. Hes in the conference finals for the 3rd time in the past 4 seasons...

Just saying...